When will Hillary Clinton give up her candidacy ?

According to this piece from 538, it will be hard to draw Sander loyalist into the fold because many of them were never in the fold to begin with, in other words we are not talking about long time democrats or even independents but people who usually don't vote at all.

Why Clinton Might Have A Tough Time Flipping The Sanders Holdouts

Before the storm blew my satellite I watching the DNC, the last I seen, Sanders was busy trying to tweet his delegates to calm down and not to disrupt the DNC convention. I think he has no control over these folks at all. Crazy rabble rousers.

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@snood,

I wish I could help you more. Perhaps we could use the analogy of the Occupy Movement. What possible political benefits did some of them presume might fall out from drum circles particularly in locations where neighbors' sleep is disrupted? Or from refusing to organize in anything like a hierarchy?

Some will be purists, certainly, with the attending certainty that their vision is close to the sacred. And they'll be stupid and relatively uneducated. Others will be like Lash (if one presumes her on the up and up) - angry and politically incoherent.

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Paul Waldman has a good piece up now on all this...

"As you may have heard, there already seem to be many more protests from the left around the Democratic convention than there were around the Republican convention. If it seems strange to you that leftists would be protesting not the candidate who wants to deport 11 million people, ban Muslims from entering the country and roll back civil rights gains for gay Americans, but the candidate who wants to increase the minimum wage to $15 an hour, expand Social Security and enact universal child care, well, that would only mean that you’re unfamiliar with leftist politics. For a certain kind of activist on the left, the real enemy is never the right; it’s always the liberals who are insufficiently committed to their brand of revolution." http://wapo.st/2alSbkn

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@snood,

snood wrote:

I have to say it's frustrating that no one seems to even have given it any thought. What the **** do the Berners think they're going to accomplish by working themselves into a lather at the convention? Or are they all like Lash, just lashing out because they can? So far, what I've gotten is they're taking "a passionate political stance". Okeedokie.

Conceivably they don't like Hillary as a candidate and feel that the game may have been partly rigged between her and the DNC. That sounds like enough to me. Some people actually resent being lied to so frequently and so condescendingly. Understandably the true blue Hillary supporters are all quite accustomed to this and may not notice anymore.

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Many Democrats resent a completely outsider suddenly becoming a Democrat because he wanted a reasonable shot at running for president, and they especially resent his supporters' apparent willingness to wreck the party in their petulant rage.

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@Lash,

Hmmm.. so you are demanding that the person that gets fewer votes should win? That is hardly a democratic system responsive to the people.

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@georgeob1,

Pshaw.

Quote:

90 percent of unwavering Sanders supporters plan to vote for Clinton in November

http://wapo.st/2alUzY4

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From Thomas Rid at Motherboard

Quote:

All Signs Point to Russia Being Behind the DNC Hack

http://bit.ly/2alUXG2

And as Paul Waldman points out...

Quote:

Let’s be clear about this: the fact that Russia is trying to swing the outcome of an American presidential election is about a million times more important than the fact that some DNC staffers talked trash about Bernie Sanders in emails to one another.

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I'm a little heartened after hearing Ben Jealous get the pro-Bernie crowd to cheer Hillary's name at the end of his speech. Also, the announcers just read part of a letter I think from Bernie's press secretary that was encouraging. It was directed at Bernie supporters, urging them to be respectful of the candidate and the convention. Also (and this was the really hopeful part for me) it said that no one cheated their way to a victory, and that 7 people on an internal DNC email hadn't cheated us out of a victory - that Hillary was the rightful winner and nominee.

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@blatham,

Quote:

Let’s be clear about this: the fact that Russia is trying to swing the outcome of an American presidential election is about a million times more important than the fact that some DNC staffers talked trash about Bernie Sanders in emails to one another.

This is getting far too little play, IMO. The FBI is looking into what extent that the Putin forces are trying to influence the election. I don't think it's far fetched to suspect Trump of actively colluding with Putin, but that's just me.

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@maporsche,

I'm not voting for trump either.

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@snood,

I don't think we can make a claim that Trump is colluding with Putin. But we don't have to. That Putin is or might be trying to influence the election for Russia's benefit is enough of a clue that Trump in the WH would be a disaster in just one more way.

By the way, Josh Marshall at TPM has been writing on the prior connections between the Trumps and Russian oligarchs along with Manafort's connections with allies of Putin. That's all part of this story too.

Post convention, I expect coverage on these things will become more common.

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@snood,

snood wrote:

Quote:

The FBI is looking into what extent that the Putin forces are trying to influence the election.

LOL. Like the CIA hasn't been doing this since forever? Heard of operation Ajax? One of the first coups organised by the USA. Right up to the present bloodbath in Syria.

snood wrote:

Quote:

I don't think it's far fetched to suspect Trump of actively colluding with Putin, but that's just me.

Getting a little frantically desperate now, aren't we?

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@blatham,

Quite a few stated it as a likely probability. Several pointed out the difference between pre voting poll data and actual vote counts in states like Michigan and several others, suggesting this may be an indicator that many voters act differently in the voting booth than when replying to pollsters. If just (say) 3% of the voting populartion is underground in this sense, that could be a decisive difference. Most saw the contest as a Hobson's choice, but a few, as one prominent pol indicated, noted that with Trump at least there's hope, however small. (How do you compare a narrow statistical distribution with a moderately adverse mean to a broad one with high uncertainty?)

The best line came in a comedy skit done by a very prominent cast of characters, including among others, Henry, Mike, Colin and Juan Carlos. The best line came from the latter who who noted that this beautiful forest was once part of Spain, adding , "We should have built a wall". He got a standing ovation.

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@InfraBlue,

Not at all. I voted for the democrat challenger who consistently beats trump in the polls. The fools that voted for the Baggage Lady are the ones who might give trump the win. Well, them and Hillary and the cheating DNC and colluding MSM.

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And re george's and others hatred/mistrust of Hillary, this is really the thing (outside of tribal loyalty, that is).

Quote:

As former New York Times editor-in-chief Jill Abramson wrote, “I would be ‘dead rich,’ to adapt an infamous Clinton phrase, if I could bill for all the hours I’ve spent covering just about every ‘scandal’ that has enveloped the Clintons.” After all that investigation, Abramson concluded that Clinton “is fundamentally honest and trustworthy.” But the appearance of perpetual scandal surrounding Clinton can make it seem as if she must be hiding something monstrous, especially to those who are predisposed against her.

And that's why they keep doing it and will continue doing it. This isn't about governance, it is about power.

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@Setanta,

I expect that's a large number. After all throughout his years in the Senate Bernie never labelled himself as a Democrat, though he caucoused with them and usually voted with them. That fact should give you some pause with respect to the real strength of Hillary's support among Democrats. I think Bernie's popularity surprised just about everyone. Not bad for a superannuated Socialist who never held a real job outside of government.

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@blatham,

She was just busted. Nationwide.

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@blatham,

Hasn't it be proven that something that's false repeated often can be perceived to be true?

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@georgeob1,

Quote:

with Trump at least there's hope, however small.

Hope of what?

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When will Hillary Clinton give up her candidacy ?

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