ADAM'S RIB

A person can care if inmates are raped (many inmates are female and they also get raped) without losing sight of the fact that women are in danger (shorthand to avoid writing it all out over and over). Many of us can focus on more than one thing at a time. Oddly, the thread is not about what males do to one another.

Prison rape has been discussed in many threads over the years. If it is of particular interest to you, you might like to consider starting a thread on the subject.

That's may be why you can't see anything clearly...

interesting question - getting predictable responses from predictable posters

I wish there was a way to target it to specific posters who wouldn't normally post in a thread like this.

Back at ya, slick.

That's an ad hominem ehBeth.

I would like to see you, or anyone else, look at the facts and answer the question in an intellectually honest way.

I challenge you to compare 21st century Western women with any other demographic group in terms of being in danger of violence. And then, with facts, make the case that other than rape (or as a whole including rape) that women are not in fact less at risk of violent crime than anyone else.

You are taking an ideological position that is not at supported by the facts, and then you are dismissing anyone or any facts that disagree.

If this is anything other than an exercise in ideological purity... please give me some facts comparing the risk women face with any other group (in anything other than sexual assault.)

Let's have an open-minded, fact based, balanced discussion rather than just shutting out anyone who disagrees with you.

Ahem, I take this as a jolly whipsnapping thread, and am editing myself re the rest of it.

what position have I taken in this thread?

Remember, ebeth, if you disagree with him you are being intellectually dishonest.

I'll keep that in mind

It certainly was an interesting post to read - I had to go and re-read my post to see what I'd posted that got that response.

Definitely entertaining.

Joke aside, if it's true that more than 100,000 people, male and females, get raped or sexually assaulted in prison every year, then it must be two or three times larger as an epidemic than the one happening on campus.

Ad hominems are intellectually dishonest, Edgar. Intellectual honesty means putting facts above your ideological beliefs.

If you show me where facts contradict my beliefs, I not only will change my mind, but I will appreciate it. I love having my beliefs challenged with facts. No one here has even tried to do so... all the facts I have seen strongly support the claim that men are far more at risk from violent crime than women in the US.

I don't mind if you or EhBeth or anyone else disagrees with me. All I am asking for is some intelligent, fact-based balanced discussion.

Rather than empty ad hominems... how about some facts to back up the claim you are making.

I see Max has jumped in with both feet to show us how "scientifically" he thinks. I advise the people treat him as he deserves, and ignore him.

My thanks to every one who has responded in a supportive way. This needs to be said, and almost never is. Kudos to Chai for her statement.

This is hilarious! The premise of this thread is factually incorrect.

Setanta makes an ideological claim with zero factual support that turns out to be completely wrong. It is pretty easy to prove that it is wrong.

http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cv13.pdf
http://nortonbooks.typepad.com/everydaysociology/2008/06/girls-boys-and.html

The data clearly show that men are, in fact, more likely to be victims of violent crime then women.

Then he insists that people ignore the evidence that he is wrong, and thanks people for supporting him being wrong. Through the process no one even tries to provide any evidence to support their claim... it is true because they believe it must be true. Any evidence against them is ignored and anyone who questions Setanta is to be dismissed.

This is a textbook example of ideological purity. Ignore the evidence. Circle the wagons. This is just like the anti-vaxxer movement.

However, rich kids end up in college more often than poor ones, and poor ones end up in jail more often than rich ones, statistical facts which may explain in part why the US press and the academia cares less for jail rape than for campus rape.

The other possible explaination is that it affects men disproportionally, and thus feminists won't be bothered. Men don't care either, apparently.

Another factor may be the popular illusion that women are morally better than men, an illusion shattered by the fact that female inmates also get raped in prison, by female wardens... Power corrupts, and women get corrupted by it just like men do.

Give me a break:
Women's harassment in Paris

Let's have a fact-based, reasoned and intelligent discussion here Timur.

The facts are that men in the US (and in Western societies in general) are more likely to a victim of violent crime than women when you consider all violent crime in total. And the facts are that men in the US are more likely to be a victim of any category of violent crime except for sexual harassment.


I have provided data from the US Bureau of Justice Statistics. These data directly contradict the claim Setanta is making.

Would you like to provide some actually relevant facts to support Setanta's ideological narrative?

The interesting thing about this thread is the power of an ideological narrative to make facts irrelevant.

still waiting for a response to this



maybe someone can let me know if it ever happens

You are right EhBeth... I was wrong to ascribe a position to you. I apologize.

EhBeth.. I would like to hear your response to the data presented on the basic question of this thread. I believe you work in science, don't you?

Based on the BJS data I posted, or on any other reliable data available, would you agree that men (in the US or comparable western countries) are more likely to be victims of a violent crime then women when considering all violent crimes as a whole? And would you agree that men are more likely to be victims of any category of violent crime except for sexual assault?

I would like to hear your opinion based on the data.