2
   

Is Domestic violence always domestic violence?

 
 
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 07:53 am
This is from an article questioning the results of a study on the prevalence of domestic violence.

Quote:
Someone might get frustrated because they feel like they are not being heard they are emotional because the relationship matters a lot to them, and while that may come out in a push or a shove or a grab, all of which are considered dating violence, it doesn’t have the effect of intimidating”


The point is that sometimes a physical act, although technically violence, shouldn't be considered violence. This means that the statistics on domestic violence might be inflated.

Is there any value to this argument?
  • Topic Stats
  • Top Replies
  • Link to this Topic
Type: Question • Score: 2 • Views: 3,699 • Replies: 113

 
View best answer, chosen by maxdancona
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 09:35 am
@maxdancona,
from your source

http://news.ufl.edu/archive/2006/07/women-more-likely-to-be-perpetrators-of-abuse-as-well-as-victims.html

Quote:
Although women were the predominant abusers, they still made up the largest number of victims in both surveys, accounting for 70 percent of those being stalked, for example.

The reason more college men weren’t victims may be that women in the study did not exclusively date them, preferring men who had already graduated, not yet enrolled in college or chose not to attend college at all, Gover said. “It shows that students who are perpetrating these attacks aren’t just targeting other students on campus,” she said.

It also is possible that some of the physical attacks women claim they are responsible for are actually acts of self-defense, Gover added. “Maybe some of these women have been abused by their partner for some time and they’re finally fighting back,” she said.

Recent studies on domestic violence suggest that whereas in the past victims might have felt trapped in violent situations, today’s women are more likely to understand they have options instead of putting up with mistreatment, she said.

“I think we may also be seeing sort of a new dynamic in dating relationships in terms of women feeling more empowered,” she said. “They recognize they don’t have to be in a dating relationship forever. They can get out of it.”



and the rest of the quote you edited

Quote:
Shelley Serdahely, executive director of Men Stopping Violence, in Decatur, Ga., questions the validity of studies showing women are more violent. “Women might be more likely to get frustrated because men are not taught how to be active listeners and women feel like they are not being heard,” she said.



it is a potentially interesting study from 2006

hard to know what it means since it's based on self-reporting and it isn't clear what definitions were given to people - doesn't pass the scientific sniff test
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 09:41 am
@ehBeth,
You ruin all my fun, EhBeth.

This is an example of a woman explaining away domestic violence statistics. She is minimizing domestic violence statistics by blaming the victim.

She is saying the victims of domestic violence deserved it because they weren't listening. This is the very definition of "blaming the victim".

The hypocrisy made me laugh.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 09:46 am
@ehBeth,
Quote:
doesn't pass the scientific sniff test


There is no such thing as a scientific sniff test. The term "sniff test" just means that the results aren't the ones you expected or wanted. But, that often happens with science. "Sniff tests" are unscientific by definition.

There are several other studies that have similar results. Women are just as likely as men to use physical violence toward their intimate partners, although men are far more likely to injure their partner in the process. Objective scientific studies whow that women are slightly more likely then men to use psychological abuse.

An objective scientific viewpoint means you consider all of the evidence whether it supports your pre-existing beliefs or not. If you discard any result that doesn't match your narrative, then your view is no longer scientific or objective.

That happens all too often.

ehBeth
 
  2  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:00 am
@ehBeth,
Quote:
Shelley Serdahely, executive director of Men Stopping Violence, in Decatur, Ga., questions the validity of studies showing women are more violent. “Women might be more likely to get frustrated because men are not taught how to be active listeners and women feel like they are not being heard,” she said.


if anyone is interested in what MSV is, this will be on PBS on Monday

http://www.menstoppingviolence.org/msv-to-be-featured-in-pulitzer-prize-winning-journalist-nicholas-kristofs-upcoming-documentary-a-path-appears

Quote:
Men Stopping Violence (MSV) is excited to announce that we will be featured in a forthcoming three part PBS documentary titled A Path Appears. The series airs January 26, February 2, and February 9, 2015. Men Stopping Violence’s segment will be aired at 10pm on February 9, 2015.


Kristof's column following filming

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/09/opinion/sunday/kristof-to-end-the-abuse-she-grabbed-a-knife.html?ref=nicholasdkristof&_r=1 (some good links in his column)

izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:05 am
@ehBeth,
What do you expect? Women are responsible for all the ills in this world, them, and the wicked sexy children who tempt poor sensitive men.

Rape and domestic violence are myths put about by evil feminists who want to castrate all men.

ehBeth
 
  3  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:05 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:
the term "sniff test" just means that the results aren't the ones you expected or wanted.


no.

it means the study stinks since the authors themselves don't know what the results mean.
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:07 am
@ehBeth,
Quote:
Women might be more likely to get frustrated because men are not taught how to be active listeners and women feel like they are not being heard,


She is saying that physical violence by women is OK because it is the man's fault for not listening.

How is this not blaming the victim?

If she is against domestic violence, she shouldn't be justifying it. Surely you see the contradiction here, ehBest?
ehBeth
 
  2  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:09 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

An objective scientific viewpoint means you consider all of the evidence whether it supports your pre-existing beliefs or not.


the authors of the study in the article from which you pulled the partial quote (which you didn't reference - very clearly in an effort to get a result you wanted) ran a poorly-designed study which they couldn't interpret. It didn't even get to the point of science.

A second or third year statistics and research studies student should be able to design a better study.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:10 am
@izzythepush,
You are off base Izzy. I am arguing for equality. What is wrong with that?

I am saying that men and women should be treated equally and judged equally. I am saying that domestic violence is a real problem and that it is perpetrated by both men and women.

You are the one who is saying domestic violence is a myth. I am saying no such thing.

0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:11 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

You ruin all my fun, EhBeth.


that is my goal every waking minute of every day

clearly

as Miller would say Rolling Eyes

0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  0  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:14 am
@ehBeth,
Quote:
A second or third year statistics and research studies student should be able to design a better study.


If I show you better run studies that show the same result, will you change your opinion?
ehBeth
 
  2  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:14 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:
ehBest


if nothing else, this acknowledgement works for me



http://www.gifbin.com/bin/280sw0yu335.gif
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  2  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:15 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

If I show you better run studies that show the same result, will you change your opinion?


ahhh

what's my opinon?
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:19 am
@ehBeth,
You seem to be rejecting the idea that women are often the perpetrators of domestic violence (or am I misreading your posts).

I started this thread because I found it humorous; an anti-domestic-violence advocate excusing acts of domestic violence because the victims deserved it.

I love irony.
ehBeth
 
  2  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:19 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

You seem to be rejecting the idea that women are often the perpetrators of domestic violence


where do I say that?
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  2  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:20 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:
an anti-domestic-violence advocate excusing acts of domestic violence because the victims deserved it.


have you read Kristof's column yet?
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:26 am
@ehBeth,
Yes. I have read it.

I am in favor of programs and laws to stop domestic violence. These programs should be open to male victims, they should be fair to the accused (whether male or female), and they should be based on real facts rather than on prejudice or fear.

Facts are balanced, you need to look at both sides. In about 30% of spousal murders, the perpetrator is a woman. Do those killings count? If Mr. Kristof gave one of those terrifying stories, it wouldn't have the same impact on you.

What's wrong with equality. I am not saying that we shouldn't take domestic violence seriously. I am saying quite the opposite. We should take it seriously no matter what the gender of the perpetrator is.
ehBeth
 
  2  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:28 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:
If Mr. Kristof gave one of those terrifying stories, it wouldn't have the same impact on you.


why do you say that?
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2015 10:33 am
@ehBeth,
You are right ehBeth, I put words in your mouth. I am sorry.

My point is that Mr. Kristof is using an emotional anecdote that doesn't add anything to the discussion. We all know that being in a physically abusive relationship is horrible. That doesn't tell us anything about the right way to address the problem in society.

I want programs that help victims of domestic violence. But, I want them to be fact based rather than ideologically based. And, I want them to be fair.

This is about equality.
 

Related Topics

New Propulsion, the "EM Drive" - Question by TomTomBinks
The Science Thread - Discussion by Wilso
Why do people deny evolution? - Question by JimmyJ
Are we alone in the universe? - Discussion by Jpsy
Fake Science Journals - Discussion by rosborne979
Controvertial "Proof" of Multiverse! - Discussion by littlek
 
  1. Forums
  2. » Is Domestic violence always domestic violence?
Copyright © 2020 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.03 seconds on 12/05/2020 at 09:31:45