Water Softeners - What are the differences in brands?

Re: Water Softner's - The Best Out There

Gary Slusser wrote:

I learned the Clack line of controls has the same piston seals and spacers design with serious improvements that Fleck hasn't come up with yet.

Actually the story is that Fleck came up with a new design that incorporated improvements. This new design accompanied a few former Fleck employees when they jumped ship to another company.

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That's not what the senior engineer told me and I've spoken to him a number of times since 2003.

I can email him or call his cell phone or home number and ask him why he thinks Fleck didn't come out with anything new after the three of them left in 1998 or '99 except the 7000. And that took unitil Feb 2005! And then why they made a special tool for it within 6 months or so if it was supposed to be so improved over their their valves....

Anything else?

Also, who at Fleck would design a new valve if not the their engineers? If what you say was true, then all Fleck would have to do is challenge the Clack patents and change the Clack WS-1 name to the Fleck XXXX valve... They haven't.

_________________
Gary Slusser
The internet water softener and well pump goto guy since Jan 1997.

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Whats the best way to go....
I am new to this forum and in the process of building a new home (7 months out). I want to put in a whole house water conditioning system and wanted to avoid a salt system because I thought it also required a RO system for drinking water. I also wanted to remove the chlorine in our shower due to my wife's asthma.

After doing some research it appears that the carbon based systems don't soften or condition the water ridding me of the hard water deposits (http://www.bobvila.com/wwwboard/messages/260140.html).

We live in Arizona and have very hard water. What is the best setup for getting rid of the hard water, removing the chlorine and having good drinking water?

H2O Man seems to be pushing the water softener. Also mentioned was the Multi-Pure filter. Is this in lieu of using a RO for drinking water. I am assuming that it too installs under the sink. What are its advantages over an RO unit?

I currently have to change out my RO filters every six months.

Also can I use a potassium salt in lieu of a regular water softener salt?

Thanks in advance...

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Re: Whats the best way to go....

flynaz wrote:

I want to put in a whole house water conditioning system and wanted to avoid a salt system because I thought it also required a RO system for drinking water. I also wanted to remove the chlorine in our shower due to my wife's asthma.

We live in Arizona and have very hard water. What is the best setup for getting rid of the hard water, removing the chlorine and having good drinking water?

I suggest a properly sized EcoWater ERR whole house system.
This will soften your water using potassium if you wish and reduce chlorine.
The Multi-Pure solid carbon block filter is an excellent POU system,
but it will not reduce sodium. If your water is over 10 gpg - the RO
is the way to go or a big distiller ... HTH ~

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Quality
I want to thank you guys for the information regarding the water softner.

I was trying to get information to make an informed descision about the purshase of a unit. I'm on city water and have been told that the water is relatively hard in my area. I don't want a unit where I have to change the salft frequently or get on some service contract that will nickel and dime me.

I did check with various dealers and the one local dealer for Ecowater did mention something that most others have not mentioned and that is the
remote device to monitor the usage. This is very important to me because I would hate to be contantly checking the unit to make sure it had enough salft. Is this wireless remote for real?

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Most softeners in AZ are installed in the garage. You're probably in the garage, or someone else in the family is, at least twice a day normally. All you or they would have to do once a week or two is to walk over to the salt tank and lift the lid and look in it for a mark that tells you to add the spare bag of salt you have next to the tank on the floor. IMO that is much better than paying a few thousand dollars more than is necessary for a water softener that will remind you remotely to put salt in the tank. You can set an alert on your computer for a lot less too.

I suggest a softener with a Clack WS-1 control valve.

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Re: Quality

avp wrote:

I did check with various dealers and the one local dealer for Ecowater did mention something that most others have not mentioned and that is the
remote device to monitor the usage. This is very important to me because I would hate to be contantly checking the unit to make sure it had enough salft. Is this wireless remote for real?

Yes, the remote is real, it works like a charm and it's more than just a monitor
Also, the EcoWater system is hands down the most efficient user of salt and water when regenerating itself.
There is a good chance your home is pre-plumbed for a softener.

If you want the very best system, warranty and service ... go with Eco ~

_________________
I do it, I love to do it. I just did it and I'm ready to do it again, don't tell me you don't do it! ...

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Re: Whats the best way to go....

Quote:

I suggest a properly sized EcoWater ERR whole house system.
This will soften your water using potassium if you wish and reduce chlorine.

The Multi-Pure solid carbon block filter is an excellent POU system,
but it will not reduce sodium. If your water is over 10 gpg - the RO
is the way to go or a big distiller ... HTH ~

Thanks for the info H2O_MAN what kind of additional costs or maintenance is reqiured for the ERR system? I noticed that there is a carbon layer that will remove the chlorine in the ERR 3500.
http://www.ecowatercfl.com/Products.asp

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Re: Whats the best way to go....

flynaz wrote:

Quote:
I suggest a properly sized EcoWater ERR whole house system.
This will soften your water using potassium if you wish and reduce chlorine.

The Multi-Pure solid carbon block filter is an excellent POU system,
but it will not reduce sodium. If your water is over 10 gpg - the RO
is the way to go or a big distiller ... HTH ~

Thanks for the info H2O_MAN what kind of additional costs or maintenance is reqiured for the ERR system?
I noticed that there is a carbon layer that will remove the chlorine in the ERR 3500.

The ERR POE system may sell for a little more, but there is no additional maintenance required except for replacement batteries in the remote.
The savings accrued by greatly reduced salt and water consumption during regeneration will more than cover any extra up front cost.

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Thanks for all the info
I'm glad I found this site. Everyone provides some really great info - Thanks

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Flynaz, you need to ask how much total salt and water on say an 8 day basis. I sold a softener today using a Clack WS-1 control valve that will use 55 gallons of water and 6.5 lbs of salt every 8 days for a family with 23 gpg hard water. The delivered price was <$700.

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Re: Thanks for all the info

flynaz wrote:

I'm glad I found this site. Everyone provides some really great info - Thanks

Your welcome and Happy New Year!

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Re: Quality

H2O_MAN wrote:

... the EcoWater system is hands down the most efficient user of salt and water when regenerating itself.

How much water and salt will it use per each regeneration?

How many total gallons of water and total pounds of salt in 8 days with 23 gpg hardness and a family of 2?

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Less than 55 gallons of water and 6.5 lbs of salt every 8 days.

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Although you make the claim that it uses less, how many gallons and pounds will it actually use in 8 days?

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Gary Slusser wrote:

Although you make the claim that it uses less, how many gallons and pounds will it actually use in 8 days?

I thought you were all knowing ... Rolling Eyes

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chloramine and water softner
Hi,

I am planning on getting a water softener.

The city water is treated with chloramine and has about 3ppm of total chlorine in it.

One of the water softener person I talked to told that if I do not have a Centuar carbon filter before the water softener, it will harden the resin and will have to be replaced every year.

But the other person I talked to did not mention anything about pre-filteration.

Can you please throw some light on what I should go with. The city water is 15 gpg hard.

Thank you,
Arun Mani

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Arun, check out the ERR 3500 from ECOwater - it is designed for the water you have.

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Re: chloramine and water softner

arunmani wrote:

I am planning on getting a water softener.

The city water is treated with chloramine and has about 3ppm of total chlorine in it.

One of the water softener person I talked to told that if I do not have a Centuar carbon filter before the water softener, it will harden the resin and will have to be replaced every year.

But the other person I talked to did not mention anything about pre-filteration.

Can you please throw some light on what I should go with. The city water is 15 gpg hard.

You say about 3 ppm, how much actually by doing a test?

Replaced every year... He is lying or simply doesn't know what he is talking about. Chlorine damage makes the resin mushy, not hard. And the resin will not fail in a year, it will take more like five to ten years. Centaur is overkill, coconut shell would be much leass expensive and a very good choice.

You can buy the softener with more chlorine tolerant resin but it costs more and hardly worth it IMO because resin is inexpensive and easily replaced. Although I don't like the idea, you could use a disposable cartridge GAC filter correctly sized for the peak demand flow rate of the house.

I suggest you search for "softener sizing" + SFR, and learn how to correctly size a softener. Then I suggest one using a Clack WS-1 control valve. A softener must be sized for the SFR (service flow rate in gpm that it will be expected to treat. If the peak demand exceeds the SFR of the volume of resin, the softener can not remove all the hardness in your water.

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These might help you if you are looking for charts and calculations.

http://www.excelwater.com/eng/b2c/softsize.php

http://www.watervalue.com/sizing_chart.html

http://www.qualitywatertreatment.com/water_softener_sizing.htm

http://www.bidness.com/esd/softencalc.htm

Andy Christensen, CWS-II

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Water Softeners - What are the differences in brands?

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