1 in 5 women get raped?

@firefly,

Quote:

And we now have laws, and sexual assault crime descriptions, that are written in gender neutral terms

leave it to you to argue that fudging the words changes reality. The fact that gender terms have largely been removed from law does not in any way mitigate the reality that sex laws are written to advantage women and to discriminate against men.

Quote:

-they simply define acts of sexual contact which are considered criminal when engaged in without consent, including instances where the victim is incapable of giving consent because of his/her age or because of his/her temporary or permanent mental or physical incapacity.

The state demands to be the arbiter of this consent, THAT is the problem. Under the states legal reasoning we men must obtain the consent of the state (after the fact, which is clearly unjust) to have sex with a woman. The state has no jurisdiction to decide when a citizen can consent, the citizens always have the right to either consent or not. The state only has the right to determine if the parties consented, it does not have the right to demand that we get its consent to have sex.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

Quote:

The fact that gender terms have largely been removed from law does not in any way mitigate the reality that sex laws are written to advantage women and to discriminate against men.

No, if those laws are written in gender neutral terms, that cannot be considered the case. The laws do not discriminate against men--in fact they now better protect men from sexual assaults by making the laws more inclusive and non-gender specific.

Simply because more men violate the sexual assault laws doesn't mean they are discriminatory laws--more men violate most criminal laws. Most men don't violate the sexual assault laws, but the small percentage who do so, deserve to feel the full force of the law.

Since the "Yes means yes" consent standard places responsibility for assuring mutual consent for sex acts on both parties, it's rather illogical that you would oppose it. The best way you can be sure you have someone's consent, for anything, is simply to ask first.

It's amazing, that in any discussion of sexual assaults, which primarily involve female victims, you try to turn the discussion into a pity party for men, particularly the ones accused of, or charged with, these crimes.

Women and men have a right not to be sexually assaulted, and to see the sexual assault laws enforced. And you have an inability to grasp that basic notion, which most people do understand and accept.

Anyway, I'm tired of listening to your soapbox posturing, I've heard it all before, and it simply gets more boring with time.

1 Reply

@firefly,

Quote:

Simply because more men violate the sexual assault laws doesn't mean they are discriminatory laws

the laws are discriminatory because they make the one who puts something in a hole the one who holds the primary responsibility. More time than not it will be the party with the penis that this applies to, which makes the laws anti male. A proper law would hold all parties equally responsible for the consent parameters of the encounter.

Quote:

Anyway, I'm tired of listening to your soapbox posturing, I've heard it all before, and it simply gets more boring with time.

and notice how my side of the debate continues to pick up steam. Your side not having arguments to beat the assertion that the state is abusing men is the reason, and it will only get worse because you are wrong.

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@hawkeye10,

Quote:

the laws are discriminatory because they make the one who puts something in a hole the one who holds the primary responsibility. More time than not it will be the party with the penis that this applies to, which makes the laws anti male.

No, it doesn't mean that the law is anti-male. It can include non-consensual penetration of oral or anal openings, with fingers or objects, as well as anal or vaginal penetration with a penis or object, which makes it equally applicable to either gender as perpetrators.

More often, it is men who violate the sexual assault/rape laws, but that doesn't mean the laws are discriminatory. More men rob banks too, does that mean that laws against such crimes are anti-male?

Quote:

A proper law would hold all parties equally responsible for the consent parameters of the encounter.

Dummy, that's exactly what "Yes means yes" does. Laughing

And I believe that's been the standard in the state you live in for some time, without any hew and cry about it.

Quote:

and notice how my side of the debate continues to pick up steam

Where?

Not on a national level. Everything continues to move in the opposite direction from the things you've been saying and advocating for years. Women vote, and they have gained more and more political power to influence policies, and they've been very influential in getting the sexual assault laws framed in gender-neutral terms, so they better protect men as well. And most men want to see the incidence of sexual assault reduced as well, and they do not see enforcement of the sexual assault laws as abusive to men in general.

It's pathetic, not only has your "side of the debate' not 'picked up steam', you've clearly lost the debate, and you're too egotistic to even realize it.

Get in touch with reality.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

Hawkeye it would be safer for college men to avoid casual sexual relationships with the female students and only get involved with off campus women and or hookers for sexual release.

An that should also made the men hating college feminists happy by giving them a no competition, by evil heterosexual males , access to the women student body.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

Hawkeye it would be safer for college men to avoid casual sexual relationships
with the female students and only get involved with off campus women and or hookers for sexual release.

YES!!!
I was thinking that, Bill; no joke. If I were in college, I 'd take that very seriously.
Maybe the fraternities will circulate the word.

BillRM wrote:

An that should also made the men hating college feminists happy
by giving them a no competition, by evil heterosexual males,
access to the women student body.

0 Replies

@Lordyaswas,

love Kirsty, RIP

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@firefly,

I don't think reality and Hawkeye are on nodding terms. The only reason he thinks his side is picking up steam on this thread is because most ordinary men and women aren't prepared to argue with a bunch of obnoxious/delusional creeps. It's the two usual suspects, both apologists for paedophiles, Max whose weird paranoia has been nailed by Setanta on this thread, and the pathetically sad OEM. (If anyone was destined to end his days a virgin, it's that delusional cretin.)

Everything's been said, and the only ones remotely bothered by the clarification of the law are the above mentioned bunch of weirdos.

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@izzythepush,

Quote:

Everything's been said, and the only ones remotely bothered by the clarification of the law are the above mentioned bunch of weirdos.

LOL...............One of the masters of the ad hominem attack is at it again.

In fact this is the second such attacks within the last 24 hours on two independent threads with a strawman attack added in beside on a number of threads by our friend of late.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

That's what counts for wit down your way is it? You must love it when the circus comes to town.

1 Reply

@izzythepush,

Quote:

That's what counts for wit down your way is it? You must love it when the circus comes to town.

That is kind of weak in my opinion and hardly up to your normal high standards in the arts of personal attacks.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

But your opinion is that of someone who writes LOL.

2 Replies

@izzythepush,

Oh, I have not gotten the memo that LOL is no longer indicated when someone of your skill level had created an amusing post even if the post was not up to your normal standards of at least fitting in two or even more examples of personal attacks methods.

Are you feeling ok?

Being the true hero that you are one can only hope you had not been spending your time away from this website helping out Ebola victims in your street cloths.

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@izzythepush,

Some of his opinions, even though I may not agree 100% (Snowden), I can at least get where he is coming from, however there are two areas where he just looses me, the main is on topics such as this, the other was Trayvon Martin and other such cases to a lesser degree. Not that he probably cares, but anyway just saying.

I just wonder if any of these guys have ever been in vulnerable positions such this when they were young boys, or have female relatives who have been raped or sexually molested or harassed. For that matter, there are lots of ways older men can be in the same degrading positions so it really is not a gender manufactured problem, nor is it confined to colleges or even just the US. I personally think this problem is a lot more serious than it is taken because it takes a huge toll on a person for years or even a lifetime, sometimes physically, but always mentally.

2 Replies

@revelette2,

BillRM has:
had a court injunction taken out against him by his ex wife,
been asked to leave a children's play area because he was on his own with a box of kittens,
described a convicted downloader of child pornography as a "useful member of society",
on the same thread, after reading about the criminal's computer being impounded, boasted of his own computer security, and expressed no concern for the child victims, (but shedloads for the criminal,)
boasted about how easy it is to obtain child pornography,
made his own distinction between what he regards as 'real rape,' as opposed to real rape,
dismissed 99.9% of victims of rape as being hysterical women who had a bit too much to drink and later regretted it.

And you already know about Trayvon Martin.

1 Reply

@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

I don't think reality and Hawkeye are on nodding terms. The only reason he thinks his side is picking up steam on this thread is because most ordinary men and women aren't prepared to argue with a bunch of obnoxious/delusional creeps. It's the two usual suspects, both apologists for paedophiles, Max whose weird paranoia has been nailed by Setanta on this thread, and the pathetically sad OEM. (If anyone was destined to end his days a virgin, it's that delusional cretin.)

Everything's been said, and the only ones remotely bothered by the clarification of the law are the above mentioned bunch of weirdos.

A few years ago, but long after my retirement,
some cases were presented concerning ladies who decided after a few days
and after un-related disagreement, that she was not really all that into it the last time
that thay got together, and that he shud have taken a hint, however subtle it may have been.

After her complaint to the police, he is prosecuted for rape,
a very, very serious felony whose conviction will result in destroying his life.

A brothel offers the only relative safety.

2 Replies

@OmSigDAVID,

Listen, we are not saying false allegations are not made, however, not every allegation is false and each should be taken as a case by case basis and investigated and not either hyped up or casually dismissed based on preconceived notions.

2 Replies

@OmSigDAVID,

So in all your years working in law you've only come across two cases that you would consider a bit dodgy. Compared to unreported rapes the malicious false rape allegations are a drop in the ocean.

1 Reply

@revelette2,

Agreed.

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@revelette2,

revelette2 wrote:

Listen, we are not saying false allegations are not made, however,
not every allegation is false and each should be taken as a case
by case basis and investigated and not either hyped up or casually dismissed based on preconceived notions.

The Defendant probably WOUD HAVE AVOIDED HER,
IF HE SUSPECTED THAT POLICE WOUD BECOME INVOLVED.

In all likelihood, he considered himself to be SAFE
when he was reducing his sexual tension and safe
when thay disagreed concerning where to go on vacation.

He did not understand his peril,
until police arrived n dragged him away.

1 Reply

1 in 5 women get raped?

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