An interesting discussion on transgendered men/women

@Buttermilk,

I wish you happiness with her.

Not arguing your feelings, since we all have our preferences, but...

You say for a woman you love and adore you'd be willing to sacrifice your wants to be with her.

What if you wanted to be with a person who was born a woman, but happened to become attracted to someone, really thought this will go somewhere, and then found out she was transgender?
Would you be willing to sacrifice your initial want of being someone who was born with a vagina, for someone who went out and corrected what they saw as basically a birth defect, and is now in the proper body?

You can't always know someone is transgender, and frankly if I were, I would bring it up on a first date.

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@chai2,

chai2 wrote:

I wish you happiness with her.

Not arguing your feelings, since we all have our preferences, but...

You say for a woman you love and adore you'd be willing to sacrifice your wants to be with her.

What if you wanted to be with a person who was born a woman, but happened to become attracted to someone, really thought this will go somewhere, and then found out she was transgender?
Would you be willing to sacrifice your initial want of being someone who was born with a vagina, for someone who went out and corrected what they saw as basically a birth defect, and is now in the proper body?

You can't always know someone is transgender,
and frankly if I were, I would bring it up on a first date.

This is true.
At a Mensa convention, I attended the advertized lecture of a surgeon on that subject.
I sat down next to a pretty girl, who later identified herself as being transgender. I was very surprized.

David

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@Buttermilk,

I'm somewhat sympathetic to your friend, not because I think her point is valid, but her life experience so far has probably been very difficult. Society has not treated the LBGT community very fairly. I suspect her view was shaped by her own struggle, and now that shapes her desire to see everyone accepted as they are. That part is noble, but trying to hang a label on someone using a hypothetical, that's not compatible with what she thinks she believes. It's a bit of a red herring, since the chemistry between people has to be there before anything sparks. That's true even in friendships, there are some people we just work better with than others.

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I am reminded of The Kiss of the Spider Woman.

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@Buttermilk,

Buttermilk wrote:

An obvious factor is I want to have naturally born kid(s), I cannot have that with a trans-woman.

well, given your comments about being with a woman who will likely not have naturally born children with you, what else have you got?

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@hawkeye10,

hawkeye10 wrote:

it is not your place to say anything about his choice. You live your life, he lives his...this is how it works.

I can certainly ask, and if you don't like me asking questions you can just **** off eh.

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@Buttermilk,

so would you prefer to date a biological woman who identifies as male rather than a biological man who identifies as a female?

not suggesting that you date either - asking you to consider the questions that arise from your comments about 'biological women

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@chai2,

chai2 wrote:

I'm just curious, since I never wanted kids, and if I found out a man wanted them, and wouldn't be happy without them, I'd have to end it for both our sakes.

I've done that twice.

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@ehBeth,

ehBeth wrote:

chai2 wrote:
I'm just curious, since I never wanted kids, and if I found out a man wanted them, and wouldn't be happy without them, I'd have to end it for both our sakes.

I've done that twice.

there are few things in relationship that I can think of that are worse then lying about wanting kids till after the rings are exchanged. I dont believe in divorce, but for this divorce is justified,

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@ossobuco,

ossobuco wrote:

I'm trying to remember the name of the movie that at the time surprised me a lot.

The Crying Game?

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@ossobuco,

ossobuco wrote:

I remembered the movie - The Crying Game.

Oops, should read all the posts before I post.

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@Buttermilk,

Buttermilk wrote:

I haven't dated a trans-woman and as I said,

Are you sure?

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@chai2,

I wish you happiness with her.

"Not arguing your feelings, since we all have our preferences, but...

You say for a woman you love and adore you'd be willing to sacrifice your wants to be with her.

What if you wanted to be with a person who was born a woman, but happened to become attracted to someone, really thought this will go somewhere, and then found out she was transgender?
Would you be willing to sacrifice your initial want of being someone who was born with a vagina, for someone who went out and corrected what they saw as basically a birth defect, and is now in the proper body?

You can't always know someone is transgender, and frankly if I were, I would bring it up on a first date."

Good question. To be honest I wouldn't and perhaps it would depend on if the person would tell me in the beginning that they were born a man and transitioned to their desired gender and had corrective surgical procedures. I have to admit since I am a product of my environmental conditioning since childhood and what I know now, I most likely wouldn't be with that person. I cannot fathom to know that even though I'm looking at a complete woman, this woman was once the same sex as I. I simply prefer to be with a biological woman. Now maybe in another time I was raised in a society or in an environment where there were no "true" distinction between sex and gender then perhaps my thought process would be different but today I could not, for the life of me continue to love someone who was once a man.

For some, people would argue that transgendered people are not obligated to tell people they are transgendered on the first date. I would argue otherwise.

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@glitterbag,

"I'm somewhat sympathetic to your friend, not because I think her point is valid, but her life experience so far has probably been very difficult. Society has not treated the LBGT community very fairly. I suspect her view was shaped by her own struggle, and now that shapes her desire to see everyone accepted as they are. That part is noble, but trying to hang a label on someone using a hypothetical, that's not compatible with what she thinks she believes. It's a bit of a red herring, since the chemistry between people has to be there before anything sparks. That's true even in friendships, there are some people we just work better with than others."

Well the hypothetical discussion we had really wasn't about my friend, it was a subject we drifted in the conversation we had regarding the progressiveness in the judicial system and the hopes of making gay marriage the norm in society.

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@Buttermilk,

Quote:

some, people would argue that transgendered people are not obligated to tell people they are transgendered on the first date. I would argue otherwise.

I would argue BEFORE the first date. You dont pass yourself off as a woman and accept a date as a woman if you are not in fact a woman. If this is going to happen then we need to start asking questions before we even offer proposals for dates.

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@ehBeth,

There is a difference between willfully being with a woman 10 years older than me with two adult children, and a transwoman. There is a huge difference.

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@ehBeth,

By "biological woman" I referring to a woman who not only identifies her gender as female but was also has the phenotype of a female. This is different than a man who identifies psychologically as a female but contains a male phenotype. I would rather date the former than the latter.

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@hawkeye10,

Surprisingly I agree with you. I do not think in today's society transgendered men shouldn't pass themselves off as a woman especially since in our society still contains stigma for the LGBT community. I also believe it is dangerous to do so because deception can be dangerous. I tend to think there are a lot of men (and I'll include myself in this one) that believe even though the man who believes he is a female makes the transition to their desired gender still believe it is a man and would believe that any further engagement with that person is considered a homosexual relationship despite the transwoman transitioning from being a man to a woman.

1 Reply

@Buttermilk,

Buttermilk wrote:

For some, people would argue that transgendered people are not obligated to tell people they are transgendered on the first date. I would argue otherwise.

An interesting discussion on transgendered men/women

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