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Illegal Entry From Mexico to U.S. Soaring

 
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Apr, 2004 09:00 pm
My point exactly, CI.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Apr, 2004 09:03 pm
As we all know, some prisoners escape from prison where they have huge walls and barbed wires, with guards and guns. Wink
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Apr, 2004 09:03 pm
But buyer beware; if you buy a cow in Canada.......
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edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Apr, 2004 09:05 pm
Or in Toon Town ...
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infowarrior
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Apr, 2004 09:27 pm
If they photograph and fingerprint everyone who comes across the border, and absolutely shut down the border everywhere but the ports of entry, then we will know who's coming into our country.

I guess you missed it, but under orders from George Bush, Mexicans ebtering the USA are exempt from fingerprinting -- much to the delight of President Fox and La Raza.

The Bush plan is a good one? Whatever!
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Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Apr, 2004 09:34 pm
I can't believe I'm on the same side as Infowarrior on this one but politics does indeed make strange bedfellows.

While I am all for the Mexican Nationals to be able to come here to work, I do think we should have the ability to know who is here and where they are.
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infowarrior
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Apr, 2004 09:38 pm
Gosh foxfyre, wouldn't it suit you better to remain on your side of the aisle and just give Bush another pass? Laughing
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Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Apr, 2004 09:41 pm
Well, at least thanks for not making a crack about the bedfellows thing. Smile
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Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Apr, 2004 09:43 pm
infowarrior wrote:
If they photograph and fingerprint everyone who comes across the border, and absolutely shut down the border everywhere but the ports of entry, then we will know who's coming into our country.

I guess you missed it, but under orders from George Bush, Mexicans ebtering the USA are exempt from fingerprinting -- much to the delight of President Fox and La Raza.


Do you know whether you are talking about visitors or immigrants? I strongly suspect that you do not.

And why are you making it a race issue?
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infowarrior
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Apr, 2004 09:47 pm
craven:

I am referring to visitors. However, in the post 9/11 age, I say anyone entering the USA should be subjected to fingerprinting, including undocumented workers from Mexico.

Is that clear enough for you?

And it is you, not me, who is trying to play the race card here, and rather badly, I might add.

Next?
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Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Apr, 2004 09:51 pm
infowarrior wrote:

I am referring to visitors.



That's what I thought. In this case it has nothing to do with Bush's immigration proposals.

Quote:
However, in the post 9/11 age, I say anyone entering the USA should be subjected to fingerprinting, including undocumented workers from Mexico.

Is that clear enough for you?


Yes, it is clear, thought I disagree with it (although fingerprinting isn't one of my hot buttons).

Quote:
And it is you, not me, who is trying to play the race card here, and rather badly, I might add.


This is not true. You introduced the ethnic term "the race" here. Let me ask you a direct question, do you have a problem with Mexicans?
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Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Apr, 2004 09:53 pm
Craven I don't think its a race issue. It's a homeland security issue. Realistically in a place like El Paso TX and Juarez Mexico where Americans and Mexicans are continually crossing the bridge to shop or work or whatever, fingerprinting everybody every time would be unreasonable. But it looks like a one time deal with ID card or whatever would not be unreasonable.

I found this on Visalaw.com:

The INS has taken the surprising step of dramatically changing the fingerprinting policy overhaul only issued a few months ago. As of March 29, 1998, ALL applicants for immigration must be fingerprinted by the INS or an INS-designated facility after they have filed their applications. This is the same as the new requirement imposed on naturalization applicants. When the INS overhauled its fingerprint rules last autumn, it allowed green card applicants to be fingerprinted by designated Law Enforcement Agencies ("LEAs"). Now the LEAs will have no role in fingerprinting. Whether any LEAs will join the private Designated Fingerprint Service providers in a class action lawsuit against the INS remains to be seen.
Applicants should now be filed without fingerprints even if the applicant has had fingerprints taken by an LEA. Instead, applicants will be notified when to appear at one of the 100 INS Application Support Centers ("ASCs") or the INS mobile units. The INS has now opened 40 ASCs. Applicants will be scheduled for fingerprinting in the order they file their I-485 adjustment of status applications and will be given the opportunity to appear during any work hour in a specific week. The INS claims that it will take no longer than 90 days to be scheduled for fingerprinting. If a person does not get fingerprinted during the designated week, they can show up on any Wednesday and be fingerprinted on a first-come, first-served basis. But if the applicant waits more than 84 days, the application may be denied. Also, the INS claims it will attempt to have all family members scheduled for the same time.
http
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Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Apr, 2004 09:57 pm
Foxfyre wrote:
Craven I don't think its a race issue.


I don't think the issue is inherently one of race. But for many immigration is, in fact, about race. There are few issues more directly connected to racism than immigration. In infowarrior's case I think it is race-related. His verbiage implies it (e.g. "the race will be happy" paraphrased).

As to whatever it is you pasted, I didn't read it and apologize I'm trying to get a few things done and hit the door.
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Tarantulas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Apr, 2004 10:09 pm
infowarrior wrote:
I guess you missed it, but under orders from George Bush, Mexicans ebtering the USA are exempt from fingerprinting -- much to the delight of President Fox and La Raza.

Yes, I missed it. Not the first time, either. Here's more information:

Quote:
Fair and Secure Immigration Reform

On January 7, 2004 President Bush proposed a new temporary worker program to match willing foreign workers with willing U.S. employers when no Americans can be found to fill the jobs. The program would be open to new foreign workers, and to the undocumented men and women currently employed in the U.S. This new program would allow workers who currently hold jobs to come out of hiding and participate legally in America's economy while not encouraging further illegal behavior.

President Bush also asked Congress to work with him to achieve significant immigration reform that protects the homeland by controlling the borders; serves America's economy by matching a willing worker with a willing employer; promotes compassion for unprotected workers; provides incentives for temporary workers to return to their home countries and families; protects the rights of legal immigrants while not unfairly rewarding those who came here unlawfully or hope to do so. This legislation must also meet the Nation's economic needs and live up to the promise and values of America.

Background on Presidential Action

America is a welcoming nation, and the hard work and strength of our immigrants have made our Nation prosperous. Many immigrants and sons and daughters of immigrants have joined the military to help safeguard the liberty of America. Illegal immigration, however, creates an underclass of workers, afraid and vulnerable to exploitation. Current immigration law can also hinder companies from finding willing workers. The visas now available do not allow employers to fill jobs in many key sectors of our economy. Workers risk their lives in dangerous and illegal border crossings and are consigned to live their lives in the shadows. Without harming the economic security of Americans, reform of our Nation's immigration laws will create a system that is fairer, more consistent, and more compassionate.

Link

Quote:
Principles of Immigration Reform -- The President's proposal is based on several basic principles:

- Protecting the Homeland by Controlling Our Borders: The program should link to efforts to control our border through agreements with countries whose nationals participate in the program. It must support ongoing efforts to enhance homeland security.
- Serve America's Economy by Matching a Willing Worker with a Willing Employer: When no American worker is available and willing to take a job, the program should provide a labor supply for American employers. It should do so in a way that is clear, streamlined, and efficient so people can find jobs and employers can find workers in a timely manner.
- Promoting Compassion: The program should grant currently working undocumented aliens a temporary worker status to prevent exploitation. Participants would be issued a temporary worker card that will allow them to travel back and forth between their home and the U.S. without fear of being denied re-entry into America.
- Providing Incentives for Return to Home Country: The program will require the return of temporary workers to their home country after their period of work has concluded. The legal status granted by this program would last three years, be renewable, and would have an end. During the temporary work period, it should allow movement across the U.S. borders so the worker can maintain roots in their home country.
- Protecting the Rights of Legal Immigrants: The program should not connect participation to a green card or citizenship. However, it should not preclude a participant from obtaining green card status through the existing process. It should not permit undocumented workers to gain an advantage over those who have followed the rules.

Temporary Worker Program

President Bush does not support amnesty because individuals who violate America's laws should not be rewarded for illegal behavior and because amnesty perpetuates illegal immigration. The President proposes that the Federal Government offer temporary worker status to undocumented men and women now employed in the United States and to those in foreign countries who have been offered employment here. The workers under temporary status must pay a one-time fee to register in the program, abide by the rules, and return home after their period of work expires. There would be an opportunity for renewal. In the future, only people outside the U.S. may join the temporary worker program, and there will be an orderly system in place to address the needs of workers and companies.

- American Workers Come First: Employers must make every reasonable effort to find an American to fill a job before extending job offers to foreign workers.
- Workplace Enforcement of Immigration Laws: Enforcement against companies that break the law and hire illegal workers will increase.
Economic Incentives to Return Home: The U.S. will work with other countries to allow aliens working in the U.S. to receive credit in their nations' retirement systems and will support the creation of tax-preferred savings accounts they can collect when they return to their native countries.
- Fair and Meaningful Citizenship Process: Some temporary workers will want to remain in America and pursue citizenship. They should not receive an unfair advantage over those who have followed the law, and they will need to be placed in line for citizenship behind those who are already in line. Those who choose the path of citizenship will have an obligation to learn the facts and ideals that have shaped America's history.
- Reasonable Annual Increase of Legal Immigrants: A reasonable increase in the annual limit of legal immigrants will benefit those who follow the lawful path to citizenship.

Benefits to America of the Temporary Worker Program

- A more prosperous economy -- for America. The program would allow workers to find jobs and employers to find workers, quickly and simply.
- A more secure homeland -- to improve the efficiency and management of all people who cross our borders. It is in the interest of the Nation, and each community, to identify foreign visitors and immigrants and make clear the nature of their intentions.
- A more compassionate system -- to protect all workers in America with labor laws, the right to change jobs, fair wages, and a healthy work environment.

Homeland Security and Border Enforcement

- Border Patrol has increased from a strength of 9,788 on September 11, 2001 to 10,835 on December 1, 2003. Between ports of entry on the northern border, the size of the Border Patrol has tripled to more than 1,000 agents. In addition, the Border Patrol is continuing installation of monitoring devices along the borders to detect illegal activity.
- The Bush Administration's Operation Tarmac was launched to investigate businesses and workers in the secure areas of domestic airports and ensure immigration law compliance. Since 9/11, DHS has audited 3,640 businesses, examined 259,037 employee records, arrested 1,030 unauthorized workers, and participated in the criminal indictment of 774 individuals.
- President Bush announced the Student and Exchange Visitor Information System (SEVIS), an internet-based system that is improving America's ability to track and monitor foreign students and exchange visitors. Over 870,000 students are registered in SEVIS. Of 285 completed field investigations, 71 aliens were arrested.
- This week, the US-VISIT program began to digitally collect biometric identifiers to record the entry and exit of aliens who travel into the U.S on a visa. Together with the standard information, this new program will confirm compliance with visa and immigration policies.

Link

I still don't see how this is a bad program.
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Apr, 2004 04:33 am
The more extremist liberals here see it as a threat because they think the Spanish-speaking population will register and vote Republican . . .
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edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Apr, 2004 04:40 am
I haven't seen evidence that Mexicans are all that likely to vote Republican. To date, more have voted for Democrats in Texas.
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JoanneDorel
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Apr, 2004 05:15 am
Chicano Workers

What The Mexican Worker Has To Say

Honoring Ceasar Chavez - American Hero
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Apr, 2004 05:16 am
Well, EB, the media have done several reports on this, and a big deal was made in 2000 about Bush speaking Spanish and courting the Spanish-speaking voter. I am otherwise mystified that rabid liberals like Deecups and Infoweinie would get so worked up that they would even quote Phyllis Schlafly . . . that's a sad comment.
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cavfancier
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Apr, 2004 05:23 am
I have to agree with Setanta....this thread has been a high-larious read. Is there nothing funnier than high-falutin' lefties who cringe when an ethnic moves next door? Laughing
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Apr, 2004 05:41 am
Cav, some of my favorite family members were ethnic, but we prevailed upon 'em to tone it down for the public . . .
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