Snowdon is a dummy

You can go back to Ghenghis Khan if you want, but you can't give another example of a Liberal Democracy behaving like that in the 21st Century.

My country right or wrong is never a good maxim to apply.

The true hypocrite is one who claims to be one thing, but when push comes to shove behaves exactly the opposite.

What? You're reduced to posting pics already?

That was fast... You're getting soft, man. :-)

If you think your hands were clean before WWII, Walter, you are dreaming. Some of the stuff you guys did in Africa...and during WWI is off the charts.

Nurses Urge Leniency Over Refusal to Force-Feed at Guantánamo Bay
By BENEDICT CAREY, NOV. 19, 2014
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/20/health/nurses-urge-leniency-over-refusal-to-force-feed-at-guantnamo-bay.html

The case of a Navy medical officer who refused to force-feed prisoners on a hunger strike at Guantánamo Bay prompted the country’s largest nursing organization on Wednesday to petition the Defense Department for leniency, citing professional ethical guidelines that support the officer’s decision.

The officer is a nurse and 18-year Navy veteran whose commander has called for an internal inquiry into the refusal, his lawyer said.

The case, which came to light in July when a hunger striker called the London-based legal defense group Reprieve, is the latest flash point in an increasingly heated debate over military medical professionals’ role in interrogation and torture. The World Medical Association has issued a statement condemning force-feeding, and in 2013 the American Medical Association called the practice a violation of “core ethical values of the medical profession,” saying that “every competent patient has the right to refuse medical intervention,” including life-sustaining measures.

In letters to Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel and the director of the Navy Nurse Corps, the American Nurses Association cited a slightly softer standard — “the ethical right of a professional nurse to make an independent judgment about whether he or she should participate in this or any other such activity,” the letter read — and urged the leaders to take no retaliatory action against the nurse. Force-feeding is done through a tube, and the nurse reportedly refused to manage the procedure.

Frank Apisa wrote:

If you think your hands were clean before WWII, Walter, you are dreaming. Some of the stuff you guys did in Africa...and during WWI is off the charts.

It all started when the Saxons and Angles (plus the Jutes) invaded England. Or do you want to further back?

But whatever: since Germans did awful things in history, I can't criticise that some other nations do it now.

I understand.

You wouldn’t know it if you’d talk only to Frank, but some Americans still have a moral sense, including some working at Gitmo itself:

No, it's about knowing that it does kill innocent people.

What's the difference for those killed whether by drones or terrorists?

When you start railing against Guantanamo you can talk about strawmen. You claim to not have supported Bush, but when it comes to a particularly nasty bit of Bush's legacy you're all defensive and tu quoque.

I just came into the conversation when you started making excuses about Guantanamo Bay.

And whether or not you're neither for nor against it, it remains, and will probably continue to remain, a very powerful recruiting sergeant for Islamic fundamentalists.

And whenever a nasty dictator is chided for his human rights record he'll point to Guantanamo and say, "You can ******* talk."

"Where's America's moral authority that Clinton used to stop the slaughter in Kosovo?"

"That? It's fucked off to Guantanamo Bay, and doesn't look like it will be coming back for a long time."