Snowdon is a dummy

@Frank Apisa,

I've already said SCOTUS decides the laws. Why are you repeating (ad nauseum) the same ideas over and over?

What I said was, I have the right to voice my criticism about SCOTUS.

CAPISH?

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

I've already said SCOTUS decides the laws. Why are you repeating (ad nauseum) the same ideas over and over?

What I said was, I have the right to voice my criticism about SCOTUS.

CAPISH?

Yes, I finally got you to acknowledge that...although I had to repeat ad nauseum my admonitions in that direction before you finally did.

But yes, you finally did see the light...and I am delighted.

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@Frank Apisa,

It's all there; it's been there. You're the only one who missed it.

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

It's all there; it's been there. You're the only one who missed it.

We've been at this for a long time, ci...discussing this very thing.

You can prove me wrong by showing one posting of yours from prior to today that acknowledges what you just acknowledged a few minutes ago.

Go ahead.

Show me that I am wrong...that you have acknowledged that earlier.

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@Frank Apisa,

Requote,

Quote:

I never said that SCOTUS' doesn't resolve legal issues that we must live by. That's an entirely different issue.

I've been criticizing SCOTUS for their inability to understand the US Constitution and the Fourth Amendment consistent with Cornell Law School and ACLU - which happens to agree with my understanding of the laws.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

May I be allowed to say that the Supreme Court as presently constituted sucks. It is just one more supposedly nonpolitical entity that is political as hell and the majority dont care one bit if the constitution is interpreted correctly.

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

Requote,
Quote:
I never said that SCOTUS' doesn't resolve legal issues that we must live by. That's an entirely different issue.

I've been criticizing SCOTUS for their inability to understand the US Constitution and the Fourth Amendment consistent with Cornell Law School and ACLU - which happens to agree with my understanding of the laws.

I agree that you can criticize the SCOTUS...and I certainly have my negative considerations about some of its decisions.

But all I have been saying is that the SCOTUS ultimately will decide (or will decide not to decide) whether or not what the NSA is doing actually falls under the Fourth Amendments provisions that the searches not be "unreasonable." The courts will make that decision...and neither you nor I nor anyone else here in A2K can arbitrarily DECLARE the actions to be illegal.

We are now in agreement, ci. You absolutely have the right (perhaps the obligation as a citizen) to question matters like this.

My point never was to suggest otherwise.

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@RABEL222,

RABEL222 wrote:

May I be allowed to say that the Supreme Court as presently constituted sucks. It is just one more supposedly nonpolitical entity that is political as hell and the majority dont care one bit if the constitution is interpreted correctly.

Agreed! Totally!

That is one of the reasons that although I disagree with many of the things the Democrats are doing (as I certainly do with what the Republicans are doing)...I will refrain from hammering the Democrats because above all, I want a Democrat rather than a Republican deciding who will be appointed to the SCOTUS during the years to come.

If it is going to be politicized, I do not want it tilted further in the direction of the Scalia, Thomas, Alioto types.

But it does suck that all this has happened to a body that had as much respect as the SCOTUS.

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@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

Snowden did work there,

Yes, Snowden worked as a low level contractor of NSA in Hawaii, however, he didn't have clearance to all the information he stole from the government. He used a co-workers password, who had since resigned, to obtain that information according to a NSA memo obtained by congress.

NSA memo alleges co-worker unwittingly provided Snowden password for classified data

1 Reply

@revelette2,

Quote:

Yes, Snowden worked as a low level contractor of NSA in Hawaii, however, he didn't have clearance to all the information he stole from the government. He used a co-workers password, who had since resigned, to obtain that information according to a NSA memo obtained by congress.

Yes and NSA have no history of lying to congress so we should take their word for it or for anything else for that matter?

We have Snowden version of his position with the NSA and the NSA version and given everything please guess who I happen to judge as the side that is likely to be more trueful

Next no matter how he gain access to that information the very fact that he was able to do so just point out how damn incompetent NSA happen to be at least compare to Snowden.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

Quote:

Next no matter how he gain access to that information the very fact that he was able to do so just point out how damn incompetent NSA happen to be at least compare to Snowden.

True, it was very careless of them to allow that to happen. I am hoping in future no one gets away with such a thing again.

Quote:

Yes and NSA have no history of lying to congress so we should take their word for it or for anything else for that matter?

We have Snowden version of his position with the NSA and the NSA version and given everything please guess who I happen to judge as the side that is likely to be more trueful

A couple of workers lost the clearance due this password business and one person resigned. I very much doubt they just picked people at random and wrote it in a memo for congress to receive at a later date. And you are right it is easy for me to guess who you will believe no matter how nonsensical it is.

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@revelette2,

Quote:

A couple of workers lost the clearance due this password business and one person resigned. I very much doubt they just picked people at random and wrote it in a memo for congress to receive at a later date. And you are right it is easy for me to guess who you will believe no matter how nonsensical it is.

An how did you feel about the weapons of mass destruction in Iraq that Bush and the intelligence community sold to the American people?

Sorry but there is sadly little reason to think that our intelligence community have an honest bone in it body.

We do however know that Snowden was willing to throw away a comfortable life to warn us all of a completely out of control intelligence community.

1 Reply

@revelette2,

I also find it highly amusing that for having an extramarital affair a CIA director was force to resign but not one person in the intelligence community had been force to resign to date for lying to congress or the courts or for hacking into congressional computer networks for that matter.

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@BillRM,

You bring up Iraq as though NSA was directly responsible for the Bush administration leading us into an unnecessary war and as though the CIA and NSA are one and the same.

The Bush administration was determined to go to war, they cheery picked the evidence and twisted it and ignored dissenting intelligence.

The CIA is not NSA. I haven't even looked at the story about the CIA hacking into congress. I don't know why no one has resigned nor do I really care to be frank about it.

As for Snowden, I know he is a hero to you and to a little over a majority of Americans. To me he is not.

I don't particularly think NSA is honest, I think they are expedient, if it is more practical to lie, they will do so. There was no reason to make up a story about Snowden tricking his co-workers into helping him to get information he otherwise would not have had access to because he did not have the clearance.

Surely if it was a false accusation, the one who resigned and the ones who had their clearance taken away would have said something in protest. I mean, what did they have to loose at that point?

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@revelette2,

You wrote,

Quote:

I don't particularly think NSA is honest, I think they are expedient, if it is more practical to lie, they will do so.

They have lied to congress; that should be a crime and they should pay the 'price.' Government can't work when department heads lie to congress.

This is evidence that the NSA is broken. There needs to be transparency between government leaders and all their departments for our country to operate efficiently and legally.

Without Snowden, all these lies and unlawful activities would still be going on without any question as to their unlawful activities.

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@revelette2,

Quote:

You bring up Iraq as though NSA was directly responsible for the Bush administration leading us into an unnecessary war and as though the CIA and NSA are one and the same.

NSA and the CIA and to a lesser degree the FBI are all parts of the US intelligence community and lying is a habit of all of them dating back many many decades.

NSA could had blown the whistle on the Iraq pro-war lying if they had care to do so as it was no secret what was going on inside the intelligence community and in fact it was their duty to do so.

Oh those inside the CIA that try to blow the whistle have their character attacked in the same way as Snowden character is being attacked now.

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Mentioned in the documentary, now published by Wired:
Snowden's first emails to Poitras

1 Reply

@Walter Hinteler,

Quote:

I am a senior government employee

How long does it take to be a "senior government employee?" Surely more than three months?

Quote:

Edward Snowden didn't just stumble upon details of the National Security Agency's PRISM surveillance program while working as a contractor with the consulting firm Booz Allen Hamilton — he was looking for them. In an interview with the South China Morning Post, Snowden said that he took a job with Booz Allen specifically to gather information on the NSA's spying efforts. His role as a source of leaks, sharing details of international surveillance efforts to the press, was something he says he envisioned for himself before taking the job.

"My position with Booz Allen Hamilton granted me access to lists of machines all over the world the NSA hacked," he said in the interview, "that is why I accepted that position about three months ago."

source

Personally I find him a egotistical blowhard who set out to be famous, but to each their own.

2 Replies

@revelette2,

revelette2 wrote:

Quote:
I am a senior government employee

How long does it take to be a "senior government employee?" Surely more than three months?

Well
a) he certainly needed to promote himself to get attention,
b) perhaps he enclosed his Geneva CIA-period et. al. .

My post was about his first emails, which are published now (and mentioned in the documentary) - not what he said later.
I think, these emails clarify how he got friendly with those, who now got the documents

1 Reply

@Walter Hinteler,

From what I understand, first he worked as a security guard at NSA, then somehow, got a job at as an information technologist at the CIA. All in all, I don't think any of it really is a senior position at NSA.

Quote:

Edward Snowden was born in North Carolina on June 21, 1983, and grew up in Elizabeth City. His mother works for the federal court in Baltimore (the family moved to Ellicott City, Maryland, when Snowden was young) as chief deputy clerk for administration and information technology. Snowden's father, a former Coast Guard officer, lives in Pennsylvania.

Snowden dropped out of high school and studied computers at Anne Arundel Community College in Arnold, Maryland (from 1999 to 2001, and again from 2004 to 2005), later earning a GED. Between his stints at community college, Snowden spent four months (May to September 2004) in the Army Reserves in special-forces training. According to Army sources, he did not complete any training, and Snowden has said that he was discharged after he broke his legs in an accident.

Government Work

Two years after leaving Anne Arundel for the second time, Snowden landed a job with the National Security Agency as a security guard, which he somehow parlayed into an information-technology job at the Central Intelligence Agency. Snowden has said that in 2007, the CIA stationed him in Geneva, but in 2009 he left to work for private contractors, among them Dell and Booz Allen Hamilton, a tech consulting firm. With Booz Allen, he was shipped off to Japan to work as a subcontractor in an NSA office before being transferred to an office in Hawaii. After only three months with Booz Allen, Snowden would make a decision that would change his life forever

source

2 Replies

Snowdon is a dummy

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