Snowdon is a dummy

@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

He IS a trouble maker...and allegedly a thief of and unauthorized disseminator of classified documents. He ought to be apprehended and returned to the United States and given a fair trial.

I can understand this ... from your point of view.

Quote:

The right of asylum (sometimes called political asylum, from the Greek: ἄσυλον) is an ancient juridical concept, under which a person persecuted by his or her own country may be protected by another sovereign authority, a foreign country, or church sanctuaries (as in medieval times).
[...]
The United States recognizes the right of asylum of individuals as specified by international and federal law. ... ... ... Asylum eligibility has three basic requirements. First, an asylum applicant must establish that he or she fears persecution. Second, the applicant must prove that he or she would be persecuted on account of one of five protected grounds: race, religion, nationality, political opinion, and social group. Third, an applicant must establish that the government is either involved in the persecution, or unable to control the conduct of private actors.

(Source: wikipedia
One man's meat is another man's poison ...

1 Reply

@Walter Hinteler,

Walter Hinteler wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
He IS a trouble maker...and allegedly a thief of and unauthorized disseminator of classified documents. He ought to be apprehended and returned to the United States and given a fair trial.
I can understand this ... from your point of view.

Quote:
The right of asylum (sometimes called political asylum, from the Greek: ἄσυλον) is an ancient juridical concept, under which a person persecuted by his or her own country may be protected by another sovereign authority, a foreign country, or church sanctuaries (as in medieval times).

Seems to me that quote should have used the expression "...under which a person perceived to be persecuted by..."...or the question of whether or not the United States actually is persecuting him by demanding that he be tried on charges that seem substantial.

Hey...we've granted people "asylum" when we perceive them to be worthy of it...and Russia or any other country has the right to do the same. My position is that we should not simply accede to the countries that grant Snowden asylum...but rather attempt to get him back here for trial.

There is no way the United States can allow this guy to steal classified documents and not make an attempt to bring him to trial on the accusations...without inviting wholesale stealing of documents and inviting all sorts of trouble from people who mean us harm.

I understand you and others here strongly disagree with me on this. I wish I could persuade you otherwise...and I will continue to attempt to do so.

0 Replies

Quote:

By Noah Rayman Oct. 31, 20131 Comment

Follow @TIMEWorld
Former NSA contractor turned famed leaker Edward Snowden has found a new job putting his tech skills to use — in a way that’s likely to be far less roiling to international relations.

Snowden, who revealed troves of classified information as he fled the country in May, will start work Friday at a Russian website, according to the RIA Novosti Russian news agency. His lawyer didn’t say the name of the website where Snowden will work.

Facing espionage charges in the U.S., Snowden was granted asylum by Russia in August, but his exact whereabouts in the country are unknown.

[CBS News]

Read more: Edward Snowden, Revealed Secret NSA Documents, Has Job in Tech Support | TIME.com http://world.time.com/2013/10/31/edward-snowden-gets-a-new-job/#ixzz2jItj0ROn

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@Frank Apisa,

Quote:

But in the grand scheme of things what is happening within the NSA and the allied intelligence community...is very small potatoes.

And somehow, you have no doubt about that.... You are not sure you're not a giant blue carrot watching the movie of the universe... You keep saying to Walt (the poster who's done more than any other here to keep abreast and keep us informed on this story) that he ought not assumes he knows too much... You have written dozens of posts saying you don't know anything and don't want to know anything about the spying... But somehow you know for certain that it's a small, unimportant issue... and because what? Napoleon has done it before?

Thanks for the laugh, Frank.

1 Reply

Instead of bringing him back here to face trial, I'm beginning to think that President Obama should go to Russia and have a one-on-one sit-down with Mr. Snowden. Every time the President says "we aren't doing that", but then has to recant it and say, "I didn't know we were doing that" hours/days later he demonstrates that there's a whole hell of a lot going on that he's not being made aware of. We either have a rogue intelligence agency, or a President who is so far out of the loop that he's being made to look foolish. Or, he really is foolish.

I'm thinking he should make the trip and ask Mr Snowden to tell him precisely what's going on inside his agency.

1 Reply

@JPB,

JPB wrote:

We either have a rogue intelligence agency, or a President who is so far out of the loop that he's being made to look foolish. Or, he really is foolish.

or he's lying

3 Replies

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

Quote:
But in the grand scheme of things what is happening within the NSA and the allied intelligence community...is very small potatoes.

And somehow, you have no doubt about that.... You are not sure you're not a giant blue carrot watching the movie of the universe... You keep saying to Walt (the poster who's done more than any other here to keep abreast and keep us informed on this story) that he ought not assumes he knows too much... You have written dozens of posts saying you don't know anything and don't want to know anything about the spying... But somehow you know for certain that it's a small, unimportant issue... and because what? Napoleon has done it before?

Thanks for the laugh, Frank.

You are welcome, Olivier.

1 Reply

@ehBeth,

Yes, that's entirely possible too. I've read that the IC is far from pleased with his apparent lack of support (when I feel he's been much too supportive!) and has left them hanging out to dry.

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@ehBeth,

I´m of the opinion that he´s lying.

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@ehBeth,

I´m of the opinion that he´s lying.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Please do post more about how you don't know anything about anything anyhow but still managed to guess, somehow, that Snowden was DEFINITELY not a hero or that the international outrage is "very small potatoes"...

I guess you're not a giant blue carrot after all. Rather you are a very small carrot.

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

Of course, he is lying. Not terribly well, too.

2 Replies

@Olivier5,

I can't even begin to pick out a short paragraph or two about who's lying and who isn't, but this does a pretty good job of parsing who's saying what to whom, when, and how.

1 Reply

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

Please do post more about how you don't know anything about anything anyhow but still managed to guess, somehow, that Snowden was DEFINITELY not a hero or that the international outrage is "very small potatoes"...

I guess you're not a giant blue carrot after all. Rather you are a very small carrot.

I really get under your skin, don't I, Olivier.

Oh...deny it if you want. Just adds to the fun. Wink

2 Replies

@Frank Apisa,

Quote:

Oh...deny it if you want. Just adds to the fun.

But Olivier is, as yet, a novice at adding to the fun compared to Apisa.

And if Beth would favour us with a video of her dancing class she would easily take the lead and even forge ahead.

0 Replies

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

Of course, he is lying. Not terribly well, too.

OMG! Obama flat out lies, him being the guy who promised to run the most transparent administration ever because we the American people deserve that?

Inconceivable!

1 Reply

@JPB,

Who would have thought that English, French, Spanish, Russian, Chinese, Canadian and U S of A Spy agencies would be spying on each other and on top of that lying to everyone about it. Covering one's ass is what governments and spy agencies do. Its what I've been claiming right along. Who do you trust. As in all things if its my guy he can do no wrong, its why my government is so screwed up, if its your guy he is a lying bastard. Until people really take an unbiased look at their heros nothing is going to change. And all the finger pointing is going to mean exaactly nothing.

1 Reply

@RABEL222,

trust is the most required element of leadership, only fools squander it. Obama turned out to be not very bright where it counts.

2 Replies

@hawkeye10,

Quote:

trust is the most required element of leadership, only fools squander it. Obama turned out to be not very bright where it counts.

I was very young when president Eisenhower lied about the U2 overflights, but I still can remember being shocked that an president would so opening lied to the American public.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

Only an idiot believes governments and politicians dont lie.

1 Reply

Snowdon is a dummy

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