63
   

What are your pet peeves re English usage?

 
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 1 Jul, 2013 06:41 am
@JTT,
Quote:
Hundreds of spelling variations occur between dialects of English.


I should have thought there are at least hundreds of thousands if one takes the trouble to indulge in the affectation of trying to reproduce them.

There is a considerable difference between how "hurt" is spoken where I live and how it is spoken 10 miles away. So also with many other words as I know from a fellow boozer who came from there. How it might be possible to render such differences in print for all the places in England is a problem I wouldn't care to attempt to solve.

People who attempt dialect writing are stumped on most of the words they employ.

And meanings of words vary as well. As also do choices of words to designate the same things.

I'll revise my previous estimate on superficially considering the matter. It must be hundreds of millions from a scientific point of view. At least.

From my childhood reading I had developed a pronunciation of "orangutan". I was quite surprised later that wildlife programmes on the BBC pronounced the word markedly differently. If I am called upon to say the word now I have to stop momentarily and rehearse the BBC version before saying it.

"ooze geeten ur skidsy trollies darn nah".

Maybe it's infinite. "Hundreds" is ridiculous JT and objective proof that you haven't put much thought into what you say.

JTT
 
  1  
Reply Mon 1 Jul, 2013 11:16 am
@McTag,
Quote:
And is that what we're discussing here? No, it isn't.


When you click back on our blue names, it's clear that that's exactly what we are talking about, the variation in spelling of miniscule/minuscule.

Quote:
So please don't be disingenuous, nor dishonest.


That's all you have been of recent, McTag. All manner of diversion, accusations for things that you have also engaged in, but nothing on the language issues.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Mon 1 Jul, 2013 11:29 am
@spendius,
You should have addressed this to McTag, Spendi.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 1 Jul, 2013 01:25 pm
@JTT,
I'm not certain that Taggers has been exposed to your line of reasoning before JT so I doubt he will know what you mean.
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Mon 1 Jul, 2013 02:29 pm
@spendius,
Quote:
I'm not certain that Taggers has been exposed to your line of reasoning before JT so I doubt he will know what you mean.


I don't mean to be unkind, Spendius but you're either a liar of gigantic proportion or you operate here at A2K in a less than semi-conscious state.

Have you not been following along?
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 1 Jul, 2013 02:36 pm
@JTT,
Of course I have. It's about how to spell "miniscule" isn't it?

So there you are if you're in doubt.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 1 Jul, 2013 02:37 pm
@JTT,
Oh--you can be as unkind as you wish with me. It's no skin off my nose.
0 Replies
 
laughoutlood
 
  2  
Reply Tue 2 Jul, 2013 02:34 am
@JTT,
Quote:
Have you not been following along?


Akin to a thriller, I never want to miss an episode.

I googled english usage: lo and behold the top hit was

"common errors in english usage"

http://public.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/errors.html

and a creditable second

http://www.bartleby.com/usage/

then i relieved myself

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_usage

and around this time i realised what a tool we have in language

but my major peeve is that obtuse has come to mean abstruse and the secret meaning of all my treasured verbosity is sullied in the birds nest of unsubtle broadening of the definition, up with which i will not put
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jul, 2013 02:38 am
@laughoutlood,

Quote:
what a tool we have


Yes, it's JTT.

In German, "Schmuck" means "jewel", and from there, "prick". Fascinating thing, language. In the UK, "tool" has similar meaning.
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jul, 2013 02:40 am
@spendius,

Quote:
Of course I have. It's about how to spell "miniscule" isn't it?


Spendy, what does your dictionary say about that spelling? Make sure it's a modern one, mind.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jul, 2013 04:54 am
@McTag,
Is Spellcheck modern?
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jul, 2013 05:30 am
@laughoutlood,
Quote:
I googled english usage: lo and behold the top hit was

"common errors in english usage"

http://public.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/errors.html


That's Brians' errors.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jul, 2013 05:36 am
@McTag,
It's refreshing, McTag, in this day and age, to see how well you address the language issues.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jul, 2013 05:42 am
@McTag,
Quote:

http://www.barnsdle.demon.co.uk/spell/mini.html

If Someone Tells You That "Miniscule" Isn't a Real Spelling...

Back to Spelling Reform Page
In "Merriam-Webster's Dictionary of English Usage" (1989), part of the entry "miniscule, minuscule," notes:


"This spelling [miniscule] was first recorded at the end of the 19th century (minuscule dates back to 1705), but it did not begin to appear frequently in edited prose until the 1940s. Its increasingly common use parallels the increasingly common use of the word itself, especially as an adjective meaning `very small.' "

During the last half of the 20th century, dictionary lines have been adding "miniscule." A telling case comes with the "Concise Oxford" dictionaries. The Eighth Edition, published in the mid-1980s, does have an entry for "miniscule," but labels it as "erroneous." However the "Concise Oxford Dictionary," Ninth Edition (1995) lists "miniscule" as simply a "variant" spelling.
The "American Heritage Dictionary," Third Edition (1992) gives "miniscule" as a full-fledged variant of "minuscule," as does "Merriam-Webster's Collegiate Dictionary," Tenth Edition (1993). Merriam-Webster's has been listing "miniscule" in their dictionaries since at least 1971.

"The Random House Unabridged Dictionary," Second Edition (1987) lists "miniscule" as a variant, with a usage note stating that while "this newer spelling is criticized by many, it occurs with such frequency in edited writing that some consider it a variant spelling rather than a misspelling."

I am told (on an Internet newsgroup) that "Macquarie's Australian Dictionary," Second Edition lists "miniscule" as a variant spelling as well.

Also noted in the "miniscule, minuscule" entry in "Merriam- Webster's Dictionary of English Usage" is this:


"It may be, in fact, that miniscule is now the more common form. An article by Michael Kenney in the Boston Globe on 12 May 1985 noted that miniscule outnumbered minuscule by three to one in that newspaper's data base.

That entry concludes with this statement on the spelling "miniscule":

"Our own view is that any spelling which occurs so commonly, year after year, in perfectly reputable and carefully edited books and periodicals must be regarded as a standard variant."
By Cornell Kimball
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jul, 2013 05:54 am
@McTag,
Quote:
Make sure it's a modern one, mind.


What would a language luddite like you want with a modern dictionary, McTag? It might cause you to have to think about your cherished childish fantasies on language.

Smile

Quote:


http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/minuscule

minuscule
Pronunciation: /ˈmɪnəskjuːl/
(also miniscule)

...




The standard spelling is minuscule rather than miniscule. The latter form is a very common one (accounting for almost half of citations for the term in the Oxford English Corpus), and has been recorded since the late 19th century. It arose by analogy with other words beginning with mini-, where the meaning is similarly ‘very small’. It is now so widely used that it can be considered as an acceptable variant, although it should be avoided in formal contexts.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jul, 2013 06:18 am
@JTT,
Quote:
What would a language luddite like you want with a modern dictionary, McTag? It might cause you to have to think about your cherished childish fantasies on language.


I hope Mac doesn't feel the need to respond to anything as meaningless as that.

I'm easy going how miniscule is spelled. It seems to suggest seeing something small (cule derives from "see") and minuscule seems to suggest seeing something that is not there. Seeing something minused or taken away.
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jul, 2013 07:00 am
@spendius,
Quote:
I hope Mac doesn't feel the need to respond to anything as meaningless as that.


You would say that, Spendi, because that's exactly how you have handled any discussion of real language issues.

Quote:
and minuscule seems to suggest seeing something that is not there. Seeing something minused or taken away.


You seem to be giving it a meaning that it doesn't possess. Clearly, the etymology of a word has its limitations.
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jul, 2013 07:44 am
@JTT,

It looks like I'm going to have to concede this point. Miniscule is acceptable as a variant; not one that I'm going to use, of course. I'll stay on the side of the angels, with the more elegant and original version.

I blame the ignorant.
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jul, 2013 08:23 am
@McTag,
Quote:
I'll stay on the side of the angels, with the more elegant and original version.


I'd certainly be interested in hearing what makes the original more elegant.

I'd also like to discover how you could forsake the original meaning, which ought to lend it at least the same degree of elegance, in favor of the one that you most often use for minuscule.

And one last thing. We've done this exact thing before, discuss the variant spellings of miniscule/minuscule. Why did we have to go thru it all again?
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jul, 2013 10:03 am
@JTT,

We went "through it all again", my little burr, because you picked up a throwaway remark, not even directed to you, and decided to make an issue of it. Which you are wont to do. You ruin hundreds of threads in this and similar ways.
And if you check back, (I know you like doing research) you will find that I didn't labour the issue, or react to your sarcastic correction.
 

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