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What are your pet peeves re English usage?

Forums: English, Grammar, Abusage, Pet Peeves, English Usage
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aidan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 04:02 am
@McTag,
I say it (preventative) all the time - good thing I'm not David's psychologist (or surgeon (god forbid) Laughing Laughing Laughing -although I can sew.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 04:14 am
@McTag,
McTag wrote:


My British dictionary has them both as equally valid.

Informative, restorative, preventative.....just sounds better to me.


Indeed, YES, qua the first 2 words:
informative not informatative;
restorative not restoratative.

Your assertion supports MY position, not yours.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 04:19 am

My unanswered question remains:
WHAT ` function or what purpose is served by adding the extra syllable ?

I submit that no function is served; it is an exercise in futility.
The additional syllable fails to supplement our information.





David
aidan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 04:19 am
@OmSigDAVID,
Not really David because you do add another syllable to inform and restore- as in instead of saying 'informtive' as in 'preventive' you say inform(A)tive - get it?
Same with restorative - although that word ends with a vowel instead of a consonant- so that adds another dimension to why there may be a difference (as per logic and ease in terms of pronunciation)
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 04:26 am
@OmSigDAVID,
actually, in my post "orient" and Orientate" are both correct root words . When "Orientate" is used as a verb it just sounds lame and merely sounds like an affectation. I only hear it from Brits on BBC AMerica and from "Bear" on "MAn v Wild"

Orient and Orientate (the infinitive) all mean the same but as proper drivers of the English language, Americans (Canadians and USers) dont engage in these useless syllabic appendages. (There is no general rule as Aidan is stating) Course the CAnadians still insist on adding "U's" into words like harbor and color.
We are working on that.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 04:27 am
@aidan,
aidan wrote:

I say it (preventative) all the time - good thing I'm not David's psychologist (or surgeon (god forbid) Laughing Laughing Laughing -although I can sew.

U r WASTING a perfectly good syllable in these tuff economic times.
What if u need it for something else ?

for some noble purpose ?



What if your CHILDREN cry out to u, in urgent quest of another syllable, in time of acute need ?



David
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 04:32 am
@OmSigDAVID,
We store all our extra syllables and spare letters in a hall step back cupboard. Consequently, the verbal recession has not affectated us
aidan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 04:32 am
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
What if your CHILDREN cry out to u, in urgent quest of another syllable, in time of acute need ?
Laughing Laughing Laughing
You know me - ever resourceful - especially when it comes to giving my kids what they need - I'll find some way to get it- don't you worry.

As an aside - I will NEVER waste a syllable saying 'aluminium' (pronounced al-u- min-ee-um). Maybe that's where I can find my extra syllables while I'm here in England - I'll save one every time I say aluminum foil - which I'll always say no matter who tries to convince me I'm wrong
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 04:35 am
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:

We store all our extra syllables and spare letters in a hall step back cupboard.
Consequently, the verbal recession has not affectated us

I am relieved to hear that u remain unaffectated.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 04:35 am
@aidan,
another useless verbal appendage is "preventative" when "preventive" sounds precise and concise.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 04:37 am
@aidan,
aidan wrote:

Quote:
What if your CHILDREN cry out to u, in urgent quest of another syllable, in time of acute need ?
Laughing Laughing Laughing
You know me - ever resourceful - especially when it comes to giving my kids what they need - I'll find some way to get it- don't you worry.

As an aside - I will NEVER waste a syllable saying 'aluminium' (pronounced al-u- min-ee-um).
Maybe that's where I can find my extra syllables while I'm here in England - I'll save one every time I say aluminum foil -
which I'll always say no matter who tries to convince me I'm wrong

What arguments do thay use
to convince u ?
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 04:38 am
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:

another useless verbal appendage is "preventative" when "preventive" sounds precise and concise.

SO STIPULATED !
0 Replies
 
aidan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 04:43 am
@farmerman,
I just kind of like that stacatto rhythm that extra 'ta' adds...

preven-TA-tive - seriously- I enjoy saying it.
(I also really like saying Chippen'am and Chelten'am the way they say it over here).

I think I'm from JTT's school - language as a method of one's own personal music (or expression).

But of course - to each his own...I can fully recognize that.
aidan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 04:49 am
@OmSigDAVID,
I said:
Quote:
As an aside - I will NEVER waste a syllable saying 'aluminium' (pronounced al-u- min-ee-um).
Maybe that's where I can find my extra syllables while I'm here in England - I'll save one every time I say aluminum foil -
which I'll always say no matter who tries to convince me I'm wrong


David said:
Quote:
What arguments do thay use
to convince u ?

None, when I've asked, they have no answer - just as when I've asked why do you say, po- tay-to, but you then say to-mah-to , although the syllables whose pronunciation you are changing are exactly the same?

They don't have a good argument that I've heard so I still say to-may-to. And I still say bay-zl (basil) instead of ba-zl with a short a because to me Basil with a short a is a man's name and you have to have some sort of way to delineate the two. I will also not say herb- pronouncing the h- because that's also a man's name.
I have a reason for everything I say- David.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 04:55 am
@aidan,
aidan wrote:
Quote:
I just kind of like that stacatto rhythm that extra 'ta' adds...
preven-TA-tive - seriously- I enjoy saying it.

If we adopt that as an operative criterion
for use of words, then we can end up with many extra ta s,
depending upon the uncertainties of personal taste.

aidan wrote:
Quote:
(I also really like saying Chippen'am and Chelten'am the way they say it over here).

Maybe; I don 't recognize those words.

aidan wrote:
Quote:

I think I'm from JTT's school - language as a method of one's own personal music (or expression).

I believe that I have him on Ignore
for being mentally devoid of value.


Quote:
But of course - to each his own...I can fully recognize that.

Yeah; anyone is free to say that 3 + 3 = 7.





David
aidan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 05:15 am
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
If we adopt that as an operative criterion
for use of words, then we can end up with many extra ta s,
depending upon the uncertainties of personal taste.

Don't forget the small fact that it's a recognized and accepted form of the word (since 1630) that I'm choosing to use David - I haven't created it on my own out of whole cloth.


Quote:
Maybe; I don 't recognize those words.

They're places - in America we'd say: CheltenHAM and ChippenHAM- I like the way they say them better.
Quote:

I believe that I have him on Ignore
for being mentally devoid of value.

Mentally devoid of value David? Come on- he's extremely articulate and well versed in his field of expertise. I have to say I'm surprised to hear you say something like that, because you don't agree with what he says. You used to be such a free spirit- live and let live sort of guy- what happened?


Quote:
Yeah; anyone is free to say that 3 + 3 = 7

Yeah, unless it's a math test and you care about your grade.
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 05:51 am
@farmerman,

Quote:
another useless verbal appendage is "preventative" when "preventive" sounds precise and concise.


To you. To me its sounds incomplete and stilted.

OmSigDavid wrote:
Indeed, YES, qua the first 2 words:
informative not informatative;
restorative not restoratative.


Informive? Restorive? We don't say these.

So your argument falls. Sorry.
0 Replies
 
oolongteasup
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 06:32 am
the pejorative is my prerogative

The first instance of preventive given by the Oxford English Dictionary is by Francis Bacon in 1626. The first citation for preventative is from Roger Boyle Orrery in 1655.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 07:50 am
@oolongteasup,
oolongteasup wrote:

the pejorative is my prerogative

The first instance of preventive given by the Oxford English Dictionary is by Francis Bacon in 1626.
The first citation for preventative is from Roger Boyle Orrery in 1655.


Welcome to the forum Oolongteasup.
U have an interesting screen name.

I guess u like tea ?





David
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Jul, 2009 08:17 am
@aidan,
Quote:
If we adopt that as an operative criterion
for use of words, then we can end up with many extra ta s,
depending upon the uncertainties of personal taste.

aidan wrote:
Quote:
Don't forget the small fact that it's a recognized and accepted form of the word (since 1630)
that I'm choosing to use David - I haven't created it on my own out of whole cloth.

I take the vu that the 2nd form is simply an inaccuracy --
a corruption of the first.






Quote:
Maybe; I don 't recognize those words.

aidan wrote:
Quote:
They're places - in America we'd say: CheltenHAM and ChippenHAM-
I like the way they say them better.

As long as the pronunciation bears fidelity to the spelling.




Quote:

I believe that I have him on Ignore
for being mentally devoid of value.

aidan wrote:
Quote:
Mentally devoid of value David?
Come on- he's extremely articulate and well versed in his field of expertise.
I have to say I'm surprised to hear you say something like that,
because you don't agree with what he says.
You used to be such a free spirit- live and let live sort of guy- what happened?

If this is the guy that I 'm thinking of,
I acted in furtherance of my right of self-defense.

He was driving me nuts with drivel for too long.
He shocked my brain too many times with naked attacks against logic.
He denied that the word NOT has any meaning.
My patience with him was not infinite. I suspected that he was trolling me.

like arguing with Gracie Allen






Quote:
Yeah; anyone is free to say that 3 + 3 = 7

aidan wrote:
Quote:
Yeah, unless it's a math test and you care about your grade.

Anyone is still free to say it.

I don t recommend it.

0 Replies
 
 

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