34
   

President Endorses Gay Marriage

 
 
revelette
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 11:06 am
@Thomas,
I imagine that Romney wants to stay away from this topic as far as he can get on account of the incident of how he assualted and cut the hair of a teenage boy and made fun of another boy because he seemed gay. He says he is against gay marriage with all it entails but he thinks it is ok for gay couple to adopt children. Go figure.

left links to both on this thread
0 Replies
 
Joe Nation
 
  2  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 11:18 am
As John Stewart pointed out: The Republicans and FoxNews**have gone from saying that same-sex marriage would mean the end of civilization as we know it to '....the President will say anything popular to get re-elected!"

That is progress.

Joe(Please, people on the left, get out and vote.)Nation

**(is there really any division between them , except for some itterations by Shephard Smith)
Finn dAbuzz
 
  2  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 11:33 am
It is often astounding how easily people will see what they want to see and shape their opinions around the obvious tripe dished out by individuals they, for one reason or another, feel are significant.

If I were gay, I certainly wouldn't be unhappy that the president of the US has come out in favor of gay marriage, but I certainly would be asking the questions:

What took you so long?

and

Why now?

Since he ran for the office, the liberal wink-wink, nod-nod conceit was that he was personally for gay marriage but had to affect a tie to the bigoted homophobes in the heartland, in order to get elected and do great things...eventually even for gays.

The nonsense about his opinion "evolving" was simply code for " be patient gays, I'm setting the stage. I've got these rubes just where I want them and before long, I'll get there."

If you believe that this announcement has nothing to do with the upcoming election, then you are hopelessly naive or partisan.

If you believe that if he thought maintaining his status of "evolving" would help his chances in November, but that second term be damned, he was ready to emerge from the seas of bigotry and walk on the land of enlightened tolerance, well...ditto.

His campaign's internal polling, and the recent embarrassments of Democrat primaries where he has run "unopposed" but had to struggle against "No Preference" and a felon in jail, tell him that if he is to win in November, he has to have a turn-out among his base that matches or exceeds performance in 2008.

What is exceedingly delicious is to read the crap by Obamanistas who claim to appreciate that an evolving opinion on gay marriage is perfectly understandable.

Ha!

Everyone else has been required to walk on land long before Obama lest they be labelled bigot and homophobe, but The One? Apparently his is the only mind in America that is so obviously grand and nuanced that he gets to evolve, and evolve, and evolve.

And the notion that he made his announcement after the NC Amendment One vote to bring hope and light to the gay community is so laughable I'm afraid I might split my gut.

Unless one believes that his evolution of thought was so coincidently timed as to occur after the vote, the question should be: "If the president of the US was in favor of gay marriages, why wouldn't he lend his weight to those who opposed the amendment, before the vote?"

The answer is simple. He had good reason to believe the Amendment was going to pass, and that his weight was meaningless as far as the vote went. In the midst of a re-election campaign why would he take the chance of proving to America that his endorsement has no weight? Gays sure as hell weren't worth that risk, and surely they should have appreciated that because his re-election is the only thing stopping the Religious Right from shipping them off to camps.

So many of you lean far left and hate the right. Fair enough. Vote for any Democrat over a Republican because it is obvious that any of the former is more aligned to you positions than any of the latter, but when you engage in this desperately silly attempt to make your only choice a hero of your ideology you make yourselves seem childish at best.

Some politicians are actually willing to lose rather than compromise their principles or foreswear cynical politics. Obama ain't one of them.

revelette
 
  2  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 12:12 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
Some politicians are actually willing to lose rather than compromise their principles or foreswear cynical politics


Think Romney is one of em?

0 Replies
 
snood
 
  3  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 12:17 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Finn dAbuzz wrote:

It is often astounding how easily people will see what they want to see and shape their opinions around the obvious tripe dished out by individuals they, for one reason or another, feel are significant.

If I were gay, I certainly wouldn't be unhappy that the president of the US has come out in favor of gay marriage, but I certainly would be asking the questions:

What took you so long?

and

Why now?

Since he ran for the office, the liberal wink-wink, nod-nod conceit was that he was personally for gay marriage but had to affect a tie to the bigoted homophobes in the heartland, in order to get elected and do great things...eventually even for gays.

The nonsense about his opinion "evolving" was simply code for " be patient gays, I'm setting the stage. I've got these rubes just where I want them and before long, I'll get there."

If you believe that this announcement has nothing to do with the upcoming election, then you are hopelessly naive or partisan.

If you believe that if he thought maintaining his status of "evolving" would help his chances in November, but that second term be damned, he was ready to emerge from the seas of bigotry and walk on the land of enlightened tolerance, well...ditto.

His campaign's internal polling, and the recent embarrassments of Democrat primaries where he has run "unopposed" but had to struggle against "No Preference" and a felon in jail, tell him that if he is to win in November, he has to have a turn-out among his base that matches or exceeds performance in 2008.

What is exceedingly delicious is to read the crap by Obamanistas who claim to appreciate that an evolving opinion on gay marriage is perfectly understandable.

Ha!

Everyone else has been required to walk on land long before Obama lest they be labelled bigot and homophobe, but The One? Apparently his is the only mind in America that is so obviously grand and nuanced that he gets to evolve, and evolve, and evolve.

And the notion that he made his announcement after the NC Amendment One vote to bring hope and light to the gay community is so laughable I'm afraid I might split my gut.

Unless one believes that his evolution of thought was so coincidently timed as to occur after the vote, the question should be: "If the president of the US was in favor of gay marriages, why wouldn't he lend his weight to those who opposed the amendment, before the vote?"

The answer is simple. He had good reason to believe the Amendment was going to pass, and that his weight was meaningless as far as the vote went. In the midst of a re-election campaign why would he take the chance of proving to America that his endorsement has no weight? Gays sure as hell weren't worth that risk, and surely they should have appreciated that because his re-election is the only thing stopping the Religious Right from shipping them off to camps.

So many of you lean far left and hate the right. Fair enough. Vote for any Democrat over a Republican because it is obvious that any of the former is more aligned to you positions than any of the latter, but when you engage in this desperately silly attempt to make your only choice a hero of your ideology you make yourselves seem childish at best.

Some politicians are actually willing to lose rather than compromise their principles or foreswear cynical politics. Obama ain't one of them.




You're so full of bullcrap you should be condemned as a public health hazard.

Obama's very unpopular stand against the Iraq war when he was a state senator was clearly a stand taken on principle. Others followed suit when the tide of public opinion turned, but for a while his was a lone voice.

And it takes hopelessly sold-out abysmal tools like you to only see a calculated upside to Obama's gay marriage announcement - anyone with half an honest brain can see that it has as much potential potential risk as benefit.

Obama has certainly shown more backbone and willingness to speak unpopular truth in 3 years than, oh say the republican candidate has his whole freakin life.

If he had waited to announce at the convention, you rightwingnuts would say it was political calculation. If he continued to postpone taking a stand inevitably, you'd carp that he wasn't as "hopey changey" as he'd promised. No matter when he took this stand, you'd find a way to pronounce it as empty and useless and bray about how his supporters are naive and gullible.

Conservatives have nothing to be proud of - certainly not this soulless, empty suit whose kool-aid pumping tin heart couldn't muster a strong stand on something if his corporate enslaved life depended on it.

So you sling shyt at the only thing moving at all. It wouldn't be so bad if you could admit that you'd rather yank out your eyeteeth than admit what Obama has done well. You're not only boringly predictable in your denouncements of Obama and his supporters, but your one-note corrosiveness belies an ugliness that can't even see itself.
Thomas
 
  2  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 12:51 pm
@Joe Nation,
Joe Nation wrote:
Joe(Please, people on the left, get out and vote.)Nation

I'm still getting used to the notion that I'm "on the left" in this country. But I guess I am, comrade Nation.
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 01:14 pm
@Thomas,
You are both a couple of commies. Razz
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 01:40 pm
@snood,
Ahh, I 'm glad to see yourself in my post, because you were featured.

Now, whether or not your bullshit is more dangerous to the public health than mine is an argument I will leave to the likes of you who just can't seem to ever label an opinion "bullshit," unless it opposes one held by Obama.

You, predicatbly, mistake principle for political calculation.

As a US Senator, it served Obama's ambitions to distinguish himself from the rest of the herd.

What was the political liability for a state senator from an exceedingly liberal area of Illinois to oppose the Iraq war? Where was the bravery in that?

Who the **** cares what position a State senator in any State takes? That any of them take a stand on national issues is simply an indicator that they have ambitions beyond serving their constituients is so limited a forum as a State legislature.

It's clear that you admire him for it and so it's logical that you should be able to explain it. No doubt you can cite the numerous national Democrats who ascribe their change in position to the example set by the lonely but courageous Barrack Obama, Illinois State Senator "Present."

Actually anyone with half a brain realizes that a President who waited until his re-election campaign and after the NC Amendment One vote to move from Homo Bigotus to Homo Illuminati was operating politically and not on the basis of principle. I'm sure you have more than half a brain snood but it is so mucked up with partisan nonsense and it operates at a fraction of its capacity.

What "unpopular truth" has your hero spoken?

Easy to throw that accolade out there in a response to a "tool" such as myself, but how about backing it up?

But wait, maybe you're right.

He was quite brave in taking the "unpopular" stance of leaving the Green Revolution in Iran to the tender mercies of the mullahs.

He was quite brave in giving away Eastern European missle defense positions to court a Russia that screwed him in the end.

Of course he followed up with the bravery of telling Medved that he will be more "flexible" after he wins re-election.

What bravery he has show in respect to the Syrian tyrant who daily tortures and kills his citizens.

Then there's the bravey of introducing a budget for which not a single member of his own party will vote.

Braveheart Obama establishes the Simpson-Bowles Comission to bravely address the deficit and then courageously ignores their findings.

Only a "tool" like me can't see the bravery involved with joining a foreign government in it's suit against one of the 50 states.

And the ultimate act of bravery...he got Osma bin Laden!

Imagine, as Bill Clinton so poignantly expressed, the terrible political downside he would have faced if the mission failed and Navy Seals had been killed or captured. What would their suffering have been compared to a president faced with being a one-termer? Our Special Forces clowns can be such "tools" when they have the nerve to compare the value of their lives with the value of The One's presidency!

Obviously you believe that his announcment on gay marriages was totally in line with the pace of his "evolution" and not in any way influenced by politics.

And you have the nerve to call me a "tool?"

I really enjoyed your previous post in which you acknowledged that folks might, in good faith, take some time in coming to the truth about gay marriages. It was incredible to see someone back-track on numerous pronouncements so as to give cover to their hero. You really are shameless snood.

One of your reliable themes is that those of us who oppose Obama will never acknowledge the good he has done.

That's simply bullshit, but it is predicated on a smug belief that what you think is good, is the final word.

I applaud the man for killing so many terrorists as he has.

Apparently his followers have lost sight of their former argument that it is ridiculous to think that we can kill all of the terrorists. Now it's "Kill as many of the cocksukers as you can Obama --- even if they are American citizens!"

With every post in this forum you reveal yourself more and more to be a member of the herd.

I don't expect you to see the light because I'm holding the lantern, but if you are, actually, something other than a real tool, I would think you might want to try and test your blind obedience.







JTT
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 04:42 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
We have come a long way, Baby!


Not really, Frank, but you keep deluding yourself.

"Americans can always be counted on to do the right thing...after they have exhausted all other possibilities."
-- Winston Churchill
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 04:55 pm
@snood,
snood wrote:

They want to be counted as equal even by the institutions that are demonstrably antipathetic to them.



I had to look up the meaning of antipathetic.
Lustig Andrei
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 04:56 pm
@Foofie,
Most of the rest of us didn't.
JTT
 
  -2  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 04:57 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
What bravery he has show in respect to the Syrian tyrant who daily tortures and kills his citizens.


He is, at least, happy that he didn't install this particular tyrant who daily tortures and kills his citizens.

I know what let's do, Finn. Let's do a list of US installed tyrants who daily tortured and killed their citizens.

Need I point out the stunning hypocrisy, ... again?
JTT
 
  -2  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 04:59 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
You, predicatbly, mistake principle for political calculation.

As a US Senator, it served Obama's ambitions to distinguish himself from the rest of the herd.

What was the political liability for a state senator from an exceedingly liberal area of Illinois to oppose the Iraq war? Where was the bravery in that?


You may well have a point here, Finn. Obama was more than willing to carry on the war crimes started by GWB and his gang of miscreants.

But, again, there's that stunning degree of hypocrisy. It's just not you this time, Finn.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  -3  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 05:01 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
Quote:
Most of the rest of us didn't.


Do you mean that knowledgeable Pet Peeves of English crowd, Merry?
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  2  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 05:19 pm
@snood,
snood wrote:
If he had waited to announce at the convention, you rightwingnuts would say it was political calculation. If he continued to postpone taking a stand inevitably, you'd carp that he wasn't as "hopey changey" as he'd promised. No matter when he took this stand, you'd find a way to pronounce it as empty and useless and bray about how his supporters are naive and gullible.

Yup. To those determined to drag him down, anything he does will be spun as a negative.

snood wrote:
Conservatives have nothing to be proud of - certainly not this soulless, empty suit whose kool-aid pumping tin heart couldn't muster a strong stand on something if his corporate enslaved life depended on it.

Yup again.

snood wrote:
So you sling shyt at the only thing moving at all. It wouldn't be so bad if you could admit that you'd rather yank out your eyeteeth than admit what Obama has done well. You're not only boringly predictable in your denouncements of Obama and his supporters, but your one-note corrosiveness belies an ugliness that can't even see itself.

If Obama complemented Finn on his clothes, Finn would take 'em off and burn them.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  0  
Reply Sat 12 May, 2012 05:38 pm
@JTT,
Ok

Have at it
Finn dAbuzz
 
  2  
Reply Sat 12 May, 2012 06:05 pm
@DrewDad,
No DD, I would take them off and hide them lest he raise my taxes for having nice clothes.

When Mr Obama does something I can agree with, or respect, I applaud him.

I applaud, for instance, his taking the terrorist threat seriously enough to adopt most of the associated policies and means of his predecessor. I know that must irk him, but he has his priorities straight in at least this one area.

Of course it doesn't mean he won't milk the political hell out of killing Bin Laden, but he got him, and that was a good thing.

What you and snood seem to think is that because you support and or admire certain of his "accomplishments" that folks like me who don't agree with you are fueled in our criticism of him solely by sour grapes.

I can't help it if you have so much Obama Dust in your eyes that you are unable to how the politics of remaining in power dominate his decision.

While I can't identify them off hand, I'm sure there are a few A2K liberals who have not been happy with this game he has played on gay marriage.

Meanwhile the majority of liberals in the country - including you and snood - have not only been accepting of it, but thought it quite clever.

You need only ask yourselves why now?

If it was brave principle, wouldn't it have been better for the gay cause if he made the announcement before the vote on Amendment One?

You don't really believe, do you, that he announced his support on precisely the day the evolutionary process finished working it's magic?

It's amazing testimony to the degree that some people want to love this guy that they close their eyes so tightly to his cynical gaming.

It's sort of frightening actually.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  -2  
Reply Sat 12 May, 2012 07:19 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
You go first, Finn, and I'll fill in any gaps in your assessment.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  2  
Reply Sat 12 May, 2012 09:35 pm
@snood,
I can imagine if you were gay, you'd feel this much differently. I was amazed at a close friend recently who said his view on gay rights is that it's none of his business.

I reminded him:

First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.


It may seem gratuitous or trite now - but it is still visceral to me. It wasn't long ago they came for you and me. We may fall into some unforeseen, discounted category in the future. We have to be vigilant.

Please fight for equal rights for everyone.
snood
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 May, 2012 10:45 pm
@Lash,
Lash wrote:

I can imagine if you were gay, you'd feel this much differently. I was amazed at a close friend recently who said his view on gay rights is that it's none of his business.

I reminded him:

First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.


It may seem gratuitous or trite now - but it is still visceral to me. It wasn't long ago they came for you and me. We may fall into some unforeseen, discounted category in the future. We have to be vigilant.

Please fight for equal rights for everyone.

Lash, As is increasingly the case in the last couple of years - I have no earthly idea what in the holy **** you are blathering about. You don't seem to be replying to anything I've said in this thread, but the tone of your post seems to be instructing me to... what? Be fair to gay people? What are you talking about?
0 Replies
 
 

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