52
   

Question to those who do or do not doubt Christianity

 
 
voiceindarkness
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 08:58 am
@Chights47,
Chights47 wrote:

Quote:
XXSpadeMasterXX wrote:
I am not making it black and white....I think you dodged my question...So you think that your rational deduction/experiences/reasoning/education/beliefs/lack of beliefs/views/what you know/what you have heard/others experiences etc...is happening in the blink of an eye??
You better make it black and white, Shocked that's all there is. Laughing Wir all colored blind ally dogs. Neutral I'm top dog, Smile just ask Lisa. Very Happy I'm her Bitch. Cool I am come to lead you out of the smoke, Twisted Evil and past da junk yard dogs. Shocked Watch out for Dawg the bounty hunter, Rolling Eyes he'll hunt yer ass down for booty. Wink
How fast have you been runin? Laughing Dude, time is so slow, Cool everything happyended in a blink of an eye, Wink thurs yer big bang for ya! Drunk Shocked Cool GET OUT OF THE SMOKE, Shocked It's gowna BLOW Shocked yer mind Cool
WHO LET THE DOGS OUT?...............

Yew bin looken down them tracks? Shocked This Loco Motive is abowt to reach the speed of light Shocked You'll get a good view to the singularity in December 21st. Shocked When we cross the event whorerisin, Confused Don't blink. Cool Twisted Evil Evil or Very Mad Crying or Very sad Rolling Eyes Confused Wink Embarrassed Cool Laughing

Which rail you stradlin? Shocked Won is in the black whole, Cool Da other is in da light. Shocked

This is your conscience....speaking. Cool

Not anything to do with mathematical probabilities, nor science...It is mathematical absurdity within the obscurity, Confused of the mind. Cool

They could prepare you, but your conscience makes the decisions....So what have you decided? Rolling Eyes Who keeps punting words out of your mouth? Laughing

What do you think your conscience is??..............................................
What you think. Confused Kinda redundant don't ya think? Rolling Eyes Who is the center of your universe? Cool
Quote:
I'm not trying to avoid your question here, but what exactly do you think the conscience is? Confused In order to answer this post a little however, I do not think that all that you've stated is happening in the blink of an eye. Wink I simply believe that my decision making and the formulation of what I plan to do can occur in the blink of an eye, Wink although I may (and generally do) take additional time to more thoroughly think things through if it is a weighty decision. Rolling Eyes I do always think in the form of probabilities also, Neutral I just never do the specific math behind it, Confused I just approximate on it. Laughing
"Always think in the form of probabilities"? Confused you need to think in the form of possibility. Smile and what is it that you posses? Very Happy

We are all children of the atom. Cool ................................Bomb? Shocked
Chights47
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 11:57 am
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
XXSpadeMasterXX wrote:
Chights47 wrote:
]It seems that I just misinterpreted your question then..in which I still don't seem to accurately understand. The guess the reason that I don't understand is that I really can't fathom any other way of thinking. I guess in order for me to understand your question better, it would be best if you explain to me how you approach situations so that I might be able to compare it to my own. Perhaps we are truly in agreeance but simply have different understandings?
I think we are in agreeance here... Wink Wink Wink Very Happy
Well I wouldn't really know until you explain how you specifically approach such situations. I unfortunately cannot agree to what i do not know.

XXSpadeMasterXX wrote:
I am not avoiding this/these questions...based on your p.m. I am not going to answer, unless you want me to talk about God....Let me know how you feel...If you don't want me to answer them, I am fine with that...And take nothing personally... Very Happy Very Happy

BTW...just for understanding, by me saying ray of light, meant nothing about you embracing a God, but my own perspective as to something that is indeed a good thing....from a perspective of "faith" to one who does not embrace "faith"....More simply, it is a great accomplishing act of humanity to do these things...Is that a better way of stating it??
I know that you aren't infering that I embrace your god regardless of whether I believe or not, my concern is that you insert you god into your understanding of me. When I volunteer or decide a course of action, regardless of what I say, you always seem to interject your god into that understanding as if you can't comprehend that such a thing could happen without your god being involved. It's also not that I don't want you talking about your god, I just now feel like it's going no where so I feel that it's pointless to talk about directly. If there are tangents that include your god then that's perfectly fine. I mainly want to avoid the whole "faith" topic, I don't mind if it's brought up, I just probably won't join in on that specifically.
0 Replies
 
Chights47
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 11:57 am
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
XXSpadeMasterXX wrote:
Suppose you put down your math and science books for a second, and get in touch with reality for a second or two....
I know that this was your response to BillRM's post, but I just found this to be too humorous to pass up commenting on. Math and science are the ever progressing and ever expanding understanding of the world and universe around us. It is basically a representation of everything in which we currently know...so it is reality! For example, the laws of physics which are represented in both math and science a representative of reality. Reality is the state of things as they actually exist, rather than as they may appear or might be imagined. In a wider definition, reality includes everything that is and has been, whether or not it is observable or comprehensible. A still more broad definition includes everything that has existed, exists, or will exist. Reality is often contrasted with what is imaginary, delusional, (only) in the mind, dreams, what is abstract, what is false, or what is fictional. The truth refers to what is real, while falsity refers to what is not. Fictions are not considered real.
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 01:11 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
You can never rule out a negative so no all the above is just as likely to exist in my opinion as a three in one god of the Christians.

Or the gods of the Romans or the gods of the Greeks or the gods of tens of thousands of tribes that mankind had come up with in history and are still constantly for that matter coming up with.

All approach zero probability of existing as a limit but does not reach zero.

ROTFLMFAO!!! Like I said...but down your books, and get in touch with reality for a second or two....
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 01:15 pm
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
Quote:
ROTFLMFAO!!! Like I said...but down your books, and get in touch with reality for a second or two....


????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 01:18 pm
Happy Martin Luther King Jr. day all!!!If a God exists he was most definitely a man with the prophetic gift...Or at least a Saint....If I had to go by perceptions...I would say the Patron Saint of Freedom!! Wink Wink Very Happy

Hope your having a great time up there brother!! you deserve it!!! Wink Wink Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy
0 Replies
 
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 01:24 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

I give you props Bill, at least your a man of your word....And I guess you do believe that there is a chance of the tooth fairy, great pumpkin, Santa clause etc....but then that means there is reasons or doubt then in you that Jesus is not 100% provable to non existent...Or believe God is non existent...

And then in that case your not really an atheist...but more of a person who believes in a chance but has a vendetta against God...(if real)

BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 01:34 pm
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
Sorry but when the probabilities get as small as they are for all practice purposes in real life the matter is settle that there is no more a Christian god then the tooth fairy or any of the others gods mankind had come up with.

When and if more evidences come up for the exist of the tooth fairy or a Christian three in one god or the god Zeus those probabilities are open for review.



XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 03:07 pm
@Chights47,
Quote:
I know that this was your response to BillRM's post, but I just found this to be too humorous to pass up commenting on. Math and science are the ever progressing and ever expanding understanding of the world and universe around us. It is basically a representation of everything in which we currently know...so it is reality! For example, the laws of physics which are represented in both math and science a representative of reality. Reality is the state of things as they actually exist, rather than as they may appear or might be imagined. In a wider definition, reality includes everything that is and has been, whether or not it is observable or comprehensible. A still more broad definition includes everything that has existed, exists, or will exist. Reality is often contrasted with what is imaginary, delusional, (only) in the mind, dreams, what is abstract, what is false, or what is fictional. The truth refers to what is real, while falsity refers to what is not. Fictions are not considered real.

Yes, I can agree with most of the above...But how do you make your decisions? I feel you can use math and science to get deductions, and better prepare yourself, but your conscience ultimately makes the decision...

...But you do not feel there is a chance of the tooth fairy, Santa clause, Great pumpkin do you...(like Bill thinks there is a chance of)??If that is the case and you do not...then like I said, math, science, probabilities etc...prepare you in your conscience decision making(s)....

But you can't live solely off of probable outcomes....Life is not predicated that way....it is impossible to do...

And I disagree with this above...in that what people of high intelligence know, is not 100% accurate either...specifically a description of reality or falsity...

I personally experience visions, dreams...etc...That are in no way delusions, or fabrications....Nor am I out of touch with reality....

My visions and dreams consist, of seeing God, being around deceased who are happy, and know things about me, now in my life, that if they were rotten in the ground, such dreams would not exist....I have dreams of being purged in Hell etc...and they get very graphic indeed...If I feel I am right, there would be no reason for me to experience visions and dreams in Hell...If God himself is not real...For my reality, is I am doing correct actions...therefor, in my eyes no need to be purged...One ultimately is saying, I have to go there etc...

And at the end, it is always revealed why, and beneficial....

and likewise, I am simply not capable of imagining things that are Heavenly, and orchestrating, such graphic details...my mind is not that comprehensible, simply said....

As there is absolutely no way whatsoever, for me to validate these things for you...but I know for certain its real...

Like I said, the only ways for eyes to be open to these things, would be to go down that path...there is no other way to experience it, nor get a fully valid explanation, of it... other than deeming someone false, and delusional all together, which is entirely false indeed (at least to me, with my experiences) And to proclaim such things from doctors, scientist, mathematicians etc...they are flat out wrong....and I would be willing to bet the majority of them are atheists...Which would tell me (personally) they are trying to find ways to describe things they can't fully explain...or covering their ass in trying to hide from their conscience...Which ultimately can not be done so...

Like I said, I can not validate this...So as my friend, if you do not wish to embrace this path...you do not have too...but, then the only other option is to take I am being genuine, and honest, and truthful etc....You can believe I am delusional if you want...But it is wrong....Who out there actually knows, and con prove with certainty, that dreams, etc...are delusional, and false? simply because no one knows with certainty, why it actually happens the way it does??....So what then, and who then knows anything for certain....N o one! Only people are certain of themselves, what they believe, don't, experience, hear about, have heard about, have seen experienced etc....Which is the conscience inside of you....
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 03:19 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
Sorry but when the probabilities get as small as they are for all practice purposes in real life the matter is settle that there is no more a Christian god then the tooth fairy or any of the others gods mankind had come up with.

When and if more evidences come up for the exist of the tooth fairy or a Christian three in one god or the god Zeus those probabilities are open for review.

Not really anything at all to do with how insignificant low the number is....If you believe there is a chance, for it is not 100% certain....than you can not claim there is no existence of a God....All you can claim is that your almost certain, with the ever so smallest chance of faith, he is real....

I can not validate God's existence but am certain he is real....and No, I think there is absolutely zero chance possible, of the Tooth Fairy, Great Pumpkin, or Santa Clause....and until direct experiences are shown otherwise, I have no reason to believe what I see and experience from God is untruthful...and when evidence comes that says The tooth fairy etc... exist, or shows me ways in my experiences they're real, I will feel inclined to accept there is reason to believe they exist....

Like I said, keep hitting those books, if you think that math probabilities can solve this one for you....
0 Replies
 
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 03:29 pm
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
So what then, and who then knows anything for certain....No one! Only people are certain of themselves, what they believe, don't, experience, hear about, have heard about, have seen experienced etc....Which is the conscience inside of you....

And this is not a contradiction from above, in me being certain about things it is not me who is actually certain....it is God in me...telling me, explaining to me, direct experiences...which/and who is certain....and then that makes me certain of him....directly from the conscience...
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 03:58 pm
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
Quote:
..it is God in me...telling me, explaining to me, direct experiences...which/and who is certain....and then that makes me certain of him....directly from the conscience...


Are you certain it is not your ego?

We all reason to ourselves but I think that some of us think that it is God speaking to us when we are in an absolutist mindset.
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 04:17 pm
@reasoning logic,
I am certain it is not my ego...and I will attempt to prove it to you....

If you believe based on probabilities....And believe similar to the way Bill does...

Than you know nothing for certain....Not even the fact of God existence or not....You are almost absolutely certain...but your have the ever so smallest amount of belief or faith he could/can exist....If that is the case than it is not even a matter or argument anymore as to whether faith in God itself even exists....for we all possess it...and If ones follows that path, it goes as far as to saying it is not even a matter if God is real, etc....But the questions are....If we all have some kind of faith....100% certain, or almost absolutely sure its not real....Then your not denying that you have faith in God itself, nor does it exist (for if you agree with Bill, you possess faith also..)...But rather your trying to find ways as to why or how it is not real....In other words, Your trying to dispel doubts, rather than embracing something you know for certain (in that There is NO existence of a God)

reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 05:12 pm
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
Quote:
for if you agree with Bill, you possess faith also.


I think that Bill may have allot more faith than me if that is the case.
Do you think Bill is a closet worshiper? I guess that is what is meant by going to thy closet and preying to thy God in secret.
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 06:00 pm
@reasoning logic,
I had an engineering approach to life and if a god is not interacting in any known way with the universe then whether such exist or not is kind of beside the point.

The god of the bible who stop the sun in it track or level cities and turn humans into pillars of salt and then brought rotting human bodies back to life seem to be on a long vacation.
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 07:28 pm
@BillRM,


Quote:
he god of the bible who stop the sun in it track or level cities and turn humans into pillars of salt and then brought rotting human bodies back to life seem to be on a long vacation.


You just need a little more faith. Keep praying for it

All Things Are Possible, Through Christ
BillRM
 
  2  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 07:31 pm
@reasoning logic,
Quote:
All Things Are Possible, Through Christ


Zeus seems a more interesting god................

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQsoJJzcNqSxove2wGfLAe464DaY3SzR9TaHzyQUhgnBiHyOmy8yA
Chights47
 
  2  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 07:43 pm
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
XXSpadeMasterXX wrote:
Yes, I can agree with most of the above...But how do you make your decisions? I feel you can use math and science to get deductions, and better prepare yourself, but your conscience ultimately makes the decision...

...But you do not feel there is a chance of the tooth fairy, Santa clause, Great pumpkin do you...(like Bill thinks there is a chance of)??If that is the case and you do not...then like I said, math, science, probabilities etc...prepare you in your conscience decision making(s)....

But you can't live solely off of probable outcomes....Life is not predicated that way....it is impossible to do...

And I disagree with this above...in that what people of high intelligence know, is not 100% accurate either...specifically a description of reality or falsity...

I personally experience visions, dreams...etc...That are in no way delusions, or fabrications....Nor am I out of touch with reality....

My visions and dreams consist, of seeing God, being around deceased who are happy, and know things about me, now in my life, that if they were rotten in the ground, such dreams would not exist....I have dreams of being purged in Hell etc...and they get very graphic indeed...If I feel I am right, there would be no reason for me to experience visions and dreams in Hell...If God himself is not real...For my reality, is I am doing correct actions...therefor, in my eyes no need to be purged...One ultimately is saying, I have to go there etc...

And at the end, it is always revealed why, and beneficial....

and likewise, I am simply not capable of imagining things that are Heavenly, and orchestrating, such graphic details...my mind is not that comprehensible, simply said....

As there is absolutely no way whatsoever, for me to validate these things for you...but I know for certain its real...

Like I said, the only ways for eyes to be open to these things, would be to go down that path...there is no other way to experience it, nor get a fully valid explanation, of it... other than deeming someone false, and delusional all together, which is entirely false indeed (at least to me, with my experiences) And to proclaim such things from doctors, scientist, mathematicians etc...they are flat out wrong....and I would be willing to bet the majority of them are atheists...Which would tell me (personally) they are trying to find ways to describe things they can't fully explain...or covering their ass in trying to hide from their conscience...Which ultimately can not be done so...

Like I said, I can not validate this...So as my friend, if you do not wish to embrace this path...you do not have too...but, then the only other option is to take I am being genuine, and honest, and truthful etc....You can believe I am delusional if you want...But it is wrong....Who out there actually knows, and con prove with certainty, that dreams, etc...are delusional, and false? simply because no one knows with certainty, why it actually happens the way it does??....So what then, and who then knows anything for certain....N o one! Only people are certain of themselves, what they believe, don't, experience, hear about, have heard about, have seen experienced etc....Which is the conscience inside of you....
First and foremost, I would like to address that you still have yet to specifically answer my question as to what you believe is the "conscience"... or at least not to an adequate extent.

Secondly, I'm afraid that I actually don't know of any other way to live my life without factoring in the probabilities that my actions will cause. The only alternative that I know other than that is to simply not think at all which would be beyond any extent or concept of foolishness.

Lastly, of course you won't believe that your delusions are just that...that's why they are called delusions! The psychiatric definition of delusion is: a belief held in the face of evidence to the contrary, that is resistant to all reason. With this definition in mind, all of your posts that I have seen indicate that this is clearly the case. Despite whatever reason or logic is presented to you, you will always either reject it, or reinterpret it so that it fit's in with this delusion. I think that this will probably be my last chance to attempt to reason with you on this particular topic, I only ask that you please just take the time really watch all of this video. I know that it's long, I dont like long video's myself but it's very informative.

This is really the only part that I'm really concerned with now, I would like a response on this one way or the other however and you may place it here or send it in a PM, which ever you would prefer. I would also like you to watch the previous video's that I sent you, I can resend them to you in a PM if you would like since it was a little bit ago, it's mainly the second (of the first two, but this current one most of all) video that I want you to watch.
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 11:44 pm
@Chights47,
O.k. fair enough...but let me say in your departing from this thread...that just because there is absence of proof does not = proof of absence....and does not mean that people who experience things like I do...that were delusional...it means people out there label it as delusional...In which case, I feel there wrong....It is no more wrong than me saying that God is exactly to me, as he is to others...it is wrong...but that also does not = proof of absence, nor doubt of any kind...I would say open your mind about the fact that other mortal men and women, can not be certain, that their definition of reality is, maybe wrong....

And likewise, I will work on challenging what I know, and experiences...

This is my response to the 2 videos before...and I will answer regarding this one tomorrow....

I would say to the first video, there is reason for life here, as well as reasons for life in the existence of an afterlife, God etc...It is not either black or white on this matter

In the second video, those are valid points...Do you as an atheist feel you are rejecting God...If not why do you believe he must validate himself in certain ways that pertain exactly to your life in order for you to accept, validate him??

If it takes honest introspection, to truly make a choice. and if your given the option, and if you doubt whether the option even exists, Then why has the option not clearly been presented to you? And how is it preventing you from making a choice? about it?
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jan, 2012 11:49 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
Zeus seems a more interesting god................

LoL, that picture looks a lot like the picture of Zeus, in his slot machines etc...
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

Atheism - Discussion by littlek
The tolerant atheist - Discussion by Tuna
Another day when there is no God - Discussion by edgarblythe
church of atheism - Discussion by daredevil
Can An Atheist Have A Soul? - Discussion by spiritual anrkst
THE MAGIC BUS COMES TO CANADA - Discussion by Setanta
 
Copyright © 2025 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.07 seconds on 07/13/2025 at 11:45:54