Question to those who do or do not doubt Christianity

@reasoning logic,

Just so you know, I do not think either of us are immoral....So I can not say that I fully understand how an immoral person would think...

But I will give it my best shot...

Quote:

Very few people are not able to understand universally held moral concepts but just because a person is not able to understand the concept does not mean the concept cant be proven.

How can you prove it to THEM? The person being immoral...? We understand this...But they do not...What would be "proof" for an immoral person?

Quote:

If someone is not able to understand mathematical concept does that mean the the math problem can not be proofed by the logical consistency that it was established on?

Correct, but would an immoral person "think" it was? Do they have the logical consistency to understand that this is correct? Or would you say they do not?

Quote:

When something is universally accepted such as addition or a moral concept, "kidnapping and making some one your slave should be easily understood by society.

Correct, comming from two people who are for the most part moral...

Would they "think" that it was if they were the ones doing it? And would this be apart of the reason why we see them as immoral? Because it is not easily seen by them?

Quote:

Sure people will get things wrong, just as getting a math problem wrong but that does not mean that the math concept is not provable.

Because it is a belief it is provable....It is not provable, unless someone thinks it is...Or thinks the math has the logical consistency to be "proven"...If they believe, believe it can be proven, or want to prove it, then they are moral...Someone who is not moral, does not "think" the same ways we do...Or it appears to me, they do not want to believe, believe it is proven, or try to prove it...If they do not do any of these things, they would be immoral...And not believe, believe it is proven, or want to prove it...

It would always be beliefs about everything...Before it is proof...Then believing it is proven, then trying to prove it...

Does this mean that atheists have more faith then theists? Wink

Not really, because they think the only way to find God is through proof....And skipping the belief, and believe to prove...steps...

So no one could even find a God, unless they wanted to "believe" that they could...

I do not know how a mostly immoral person would think...But I gave it my best shot...

1 Reply

@XXSpadeMasterXX,

@reasoning logic,
Quote:
Please give spades a chance to apologize for any mistakes you think he may have made. He really is an empathic person even though I think he is mentally off. Just kidding about the last part spades.

When he actually comes here and posts something of substance....Rather than trolling, And just telling people how they are wrong...And not explaining how he thinks that somone else is wrong with what they have posted of substance...I will apologize to him...And have conversations with him....

Anyone can claim that anyone is wrong...But if we are going to have intelligent conversations I would like to hear him explain how he thinks that other people are, rather than just saying hey, you are wong...

Or just talking about other people motives and agenda's....Which he does not know anyways unless he decides to talk about substance...

/END QUOTE

Substance?
If the East gets wind that we are spreading the kak you tried just then, they will not reason or ponder, they will shift base of strength to counter the views, that equals a larger hatred of the West. It is not rocket science that paranoia begets attack, or if your lucky, paranoia in return, which is why each country is supposed to bring down the negative onto their own doorstep instead of blaming dragons and white ghosts.

This is why we argue with 'Satan' instead of God and why we fight the devil/evil instead of the people.

0 Replies

@reasoning logic,

Let me ask you this...

So I better understand your position...

If someone was to do an immoral act and kidnapp someone from your faimliy...Would you need to prove that it was? Or would you already beleive it was? Without proving it was? Because of logical concistency of how math problems are solved?

Would you even need to believe it was provable? Or try to prove it?

Or would you know by proof, that you believe it is already an immoral act?

It is the same exact thing with a God...

0 Replies

@reasoning logic,

I thought you may think this is funnier and more tasteful...

1 Reply

@reasoning logic,

Sorry, I want to repost it...Because of all the errors in it...I can't stand to look at them any longer...Truth is, I posted the reply...Then had to run....And I have no spell checker right now...but am going to download one now...

Let me ask you this...

So I better understand your position...

If someone was to do an immoral act and kidnap someone from your family...Would you need to prove that it was immoral? Or would you already believe it was? Without proving it was immoral? Because of logical consistency of how math problems are solved? And such...

Would you even need to believe it was provable? Or try to prove it?

Or would you know it is proof, because you already believe it is an immoral act?

It is the same exact thing with a God...

That is much better...Now for the spell checker...

1 Reply

@reasoning logic,

reasoning logic wrote:

but to say it is an obsession is just a little obsessive on your part and not as intelligent as you may think but I guess you are entitled to your subjective opinion as the rest of us.

That's just a round about way of saying, 'No I'm not, you are.'

You are obsessed with sociopaths/psychopaths, to the extent that everytime you mention them you undermine your argument.

0 Replies

@XXSpadeMasterXX,

Quote:

If someone was to do an immoral act and kidnap someone from your family...Would you need to prove that it was immoral? Or would you already believe it was? Without proving it was immoral? Because of logical consistency of how math problems are solved? And such...

What I shared with you was an easily understood moral problem that is universally understood, it would be similar if I asked you what 1+1= "would have to work it out and prove it on paper? Would you already understand what the answer is or would you just believe you have the correct answer?
Some math problems are harder to figure out and than others that is why we study the concepts so that we can understand and work out the problems.

1 Reply

@XXSpadeMasterXX,

giggity

0 Replies

@reasoning logic,

Just because someone knows that 1+1=2...Does not mean that they also do not believe that it is as well...

People believe it is, so they believe they can prove it, and they try to prove it...

You did not answer anything that I have posted really...

If someone was was to kidnap someone from your family...Would they have to kidnap someone in your family for you to prove that it would be immoral if they had?

Or do you already believe that if they had, you would find it to be immoral?

Because you already believe that kidnapping is immoral?

BEFORE it happened?

Since, I assume it has never happened to you or your family in order for you to be able to actually prove it...

And hearing someone else explain it...= proof for you...Is a very valid reason...but from an objective view, and not subjective...That still is not proof persay...And too is just a belief...You could not understand what is proof about it...Unless you could experience everything about it...Or you simply could not fully understand what the "proof is" but only why you believe it is...and why it is immoral from a belief standpoint...

It is indeed immoral....But it is because all who are moral believe it is....There is no real way to physically "prove" why it is...especially based upon the structure of math problems....

2 Replies

@XXSpadeMasterXX,

0 Replies

@XXSpadeMasterXX,

Quote:

If someone was was to kidnap someone from your family...Would they have to kidnap someone in your family for you to prove that it would be immoral if they had?

That would be like someone saying they were going to add 1+1 together but they had not done it yet would they have to do it before you new what the answer was going to be.

1 Reply

@XXSpadeMasterXX,

Quote:

.There is no real way to physically "prove" why it is...especially based upon the structure of math problems....

Well we could test this on you or someone who thinks it cant be proven and see how long you or they "who do not think slavery could be proven immoral. would keep claiming that it is still not provable. We could perform psychological test on you and your love ones and see how you all fair from the experience.

1 Reply

@reasoning logic,

No its not...What you said is what you said....What I asked you...Is what I have asked you this will be 3 times now...

If someone has not kidnapped someone in your family, Do you have to wait until it actually happens, if it did (Lord I hope not) in order for you to know it was immoral? If you answer is anything but a yes, then you have a belief about it...Whether you want to believe you can prove it, and prove it also...The belief is already there...

And I want to change the subject because it is becoming morbid just to try to prove a point...

1 Reply

@reasoning logic,

Quote:

Well we could test this on you or someone who thinks it cant be proven and see how long you or they "who do not think slavery could be proven immoral. would keep claiming that it is still not provable. We could perform psychological test on you and your love ones and see how you all fair from the experience.

Or we would also KNOW that we would think it is immoral because we Believe that it is and would not have to "prove it"?

And you said it backwards again mate...If its your position who says you need to "prove it", then it is your position that would have to go through slavery to "know" it is immoral....Mine suggests people already "know" without even having to do it....because a belief is as good as knowing...

Yours suggests it is not true unless it is proven with empircal data....Which would mean that someone would have to go through slavery to know and understand exactly how to prove that it would be immoral...Because you would have to be able to see, feel or expereince it yourself...And you do not believe or trust what others have to say, as you do not believe...

1 Reply

@XXSpadeMasterXX,

Quote:

And I want to change the subject because it is becoming morbid just to try to prove a point...

I do not blame you because if I was standing in your position I would probably be doing the same.

I have to run off for an hour or so but I will talk at you later.

1 Reply

@XXSpadeMasterXX,

Quote:

.If its your position who says you need to "prove it", then it is your position that would have to go through slavery to "know" it is immoral.

It is sad but most if not all of what we know about immorality did have to happen in order for us to see that it was wrong.

2 Replies

@reasoning logic,

Quote:

I do not blame you because if I was standing in your position I would probably be doing the same.

Well no offense mate...But I think that is arrogant to say...you are way off on that also...It was you (both times who brought those topics up) and it was me who decided that it was inappropriate...And was nice enough to kill them...both...

Quote:

I have to run off for an hour or so but I will talk at you later.

See ya later mate...

0 Replies

@reasoning logic,

Quote:

It is sad but most if not all of what we know about immorality did have to happen in order for us to see that it was wrong.

And that is because conforming was never a bad thing...But some genius invented atheism...Where people want everything to be about themselves....It just does not go smoothly because people want to be all about themselves rather than conforming to beliefs about morality, for the sake of everyone elses well being....

But want to prove everything, because everything is about them....And everything is offensive to them...And this is wrong because it should be this...etc...or that...

They would rather have other people suffer just to be able to say that they are correct....

Because they have no interest in progressing humanity with a weak claim, that they are free thinkers or skeptics, but claim they have rejections of God...

And you can't claim it was all religion who had done it all, because everyone in their time and place was happy with everything that came their way and did not complain...Even if it seems immoral today...to us...

But when the first "free thinker" came by...

All he did was basically tell everyone in the world before and after him or her...To go **** off because his ways were smarter than the billions of people before his time....

There is not a problem with being a free thinker...There is a problem if the world suddenly becomes nothing but you....And you are the center...

1 Reply

@XXSpadeMasterXX,

I agree with your reasoning so far, on this page at least..

You have presented a structured argument which proves belief is dominant in ways of thought related to answers.

You slip up however by presuming atheism is kind of dogma which contains by default that very same problem. You also enact that problem in the discussion.

Atheism is not inherently selfish, without man as man, how could God deduce mans intentions or wishes?. At least in any genuinely close to the facts kind of way?.

**** off is a disgusting term by the way, they force this on Christians, Satanists and atheists alike.

If the world suddenly becomes nothing but you and you are the center it is exactly the same as a quiet view out of the window, unless you are being stripped of life in the process, I am fortunate, that happened through previous years.

I realize you wish me gone from your talks, but I am permitted to post.. rather strangely, I feel if you must nuke a server, it is up to you to do it.

No your job is not to carry me and vica versa.. I am an intelligence, not a puppy cresh maintainer.. Much as yourself.
When will people see that the care they provide is the curse of the later learning?.

1 Reply

Question to those who do or do not doubt Christianity

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know