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West Memphis 3 Are Going To Be Freed!

 
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 08:49 pm
@boomerang,
Oh I cried the first time I watched that! Knowing the parents now believe the WM3 were inoocent was the best news.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  2  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 08:49 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:

You know for sure that the defendants lawyers was allow to give them lied detectors tests?

BillRM, the case is CLOSED.

The state got it's convictions and accepted 18 years as time served. The case is over. The state considers the WM3 the people responsible for the murders, and guilty of the murders.

You won't solve those murders with some lie detector tests. You really sound like a jerk because you are so uninformed about this case.

The issue with the WM3 is how they have been treated by the criminal justice system.
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 08:50 pm
@firefly,
Well they are free so we are not talking about death row any longer or a prison cell for that matter and assuming they do not fail such tests given by known and respected experts it would go long way to lay the question of their guilt aside.

AM is now claiming such tests was already given beside the one police test that was fail and I find it remarkable that the state would had allow such testings by their lawyers after convictions.

Love to hear more about that AM.
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 08:52 pm
@Arella Mae,
You know what bugs me, AM, and I'm not suggesting that I know this to be the case in this situation, but I think in situations like this, the state has a duty to make things right. I personally think that there should be investigations into overzealous police and prosecutors.

What they have missed out on if they truly are innocent is unbelievable.
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 08:55 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
You won't solve those murders with some lie detector tests. You really sound like a jerk.


So greatly reducing the public feelings/questions that they are indeed the killers would not be helpful to them in their future lives?

Of course that is assuming they are innocent and pass such testings.
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 08:59 pm
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:

Well they are free so we are not talking about death row any longer or a prison cell for that matter and assuming they do not fail such tests given by known and respected experts it would go long way to lay the question of their guilt aside.

AM is now claiming such tests was already given beside the one police test that was fail and I find it remarkable that the state would had allow such testings by their lawyers after convictions.

Love to hear more about that AM.


Bill, I THINK I read that the WM3's own lawyers gave them a lie detector test but it was before the trial. I am not going to swear to it though. I am trying to find it. What I did find though and I'll post it, is this:

Quote:
On this flimsy evidence Damien Echols, a loner who liked heavy metal music and the occult, was blamed for it. His friend Jessie Misskelley, 17, was coerced into a confession even though a lie detector test proved that he was innocent. Through a tearful confession of more than five hours the police concluded that this young man, whose IQ was 72, was guilty as well.

Jason Baldwin was found guilty for no other reason than merely being associated with them. The evidence, what little of it was available, was so contaminated the conclusions were ineffectual.


I will keep looking but it is possible I am wrong and if I am I'm sorry. This has to be confusing enough for you as it is.

0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  2  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 09:02 pm
@JTT,
JTT wrote:

You know what bugs me, AM, and I'm not suggesting that I know this to be the case in this situation, but I think in situations like this, the state has a duty to make things right. I personally think that there should be investigations into overzealous police and prosecutors.

What they have missed out on if they truly are innocent is unbelievable.


Oh I am right there with you on that. There was so much incompetence by the police, judge, and others and it was soooooooo blatant! The night of the murders a bleeding and muddy man was reported near the crime scene. This was NOT investigated until 24 hours later! The judge that presided over the trials should have recused himself from any of the following hearings. I am still blown away that he could make decisions in those.

They missed a whole lifetime. But amazingly, they don't seem bitter. That may change I don't know.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 09:02 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
Love to hear more about that AM.

Then look it up yourself.

Why are you pumping AM for trivial info rather than looking it up yourself?

She's told you to go do reading on the case--why are you continuing to post and ask meaningless questions rather than doing reading and learning more about this case on your own?

You don't know enough about this case to discuss it. If you have questions about the case, look up the info on your own.
Quote:

So greatly reducing the public feelings/questions that they are indeed the killers would not be helpful to them in their future lives?

No, I don't think it would make any difference. They are legally guilty. And, after 18 years, those in the public who are interested in this case have already made up their minds about guilt or innocence and nothing is likely to change that.

I hope the many supporters of the WM3, which include many prominent people, will help them build new lives for themselves. That's what will make a difference for them.
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 09:10 pm
@BillRM,
Bill, if you watch that video that Boomerrang posted, it'll help. You can also watch it here:

http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=6710065n
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 09:17 pm
Sheesh, there is not one single video of Paradise Lost on the net anymore! I guess they pulled every single one of them. Part 3: Paradise Lost: Purgatory is supposed to be the complete story the trailer said.
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 10:56 pm
@Arella Mae,
HBO has announced that the first two Paradise Lost documentaries will be available on the network's mobile app, HBO GO, beginning Tuesday, August 23rd, and HBO On Demand beginning Wednesday, August 24th. They will then air on HBO — the first one on Monday, August 29th and the second one on Tuesday, August 30th.

0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 11:47 pm
@Arella Mae,
Arella Mae, they will be allowed to write books and participate in the making of movies...
Quote:
Despite earlier information, attorneys said their plea agreement did not include restrictions on book or movie deals for the West Memphis Three, which may be one possible source of revenue in the outside world.
http://downtown.wmctv.com/news/news/57915-two-west-memphis-3-spend-first-free-night-downtown-hotel


I am glad. Let them tell their side of the story, and what this entire ordeal has been like for them.

I can't imagine what a horror it must be to be imprisoned for a crime you know you did not commit--and particularly, to be on death row in 24hr lockup for all those years. I saw Damien in an interview tonight say that it didn't get easier with the passage of time, it got harder.

If it wasn't for all the publicity about this case, and the books and the documentaries, and the donations of money for legal fees, the case might never have ended this way, with their release, because all of those things kept this case alive. Damien might even have been executed by now had it not been for those things.

0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Sat 20 Aug, 2011 12:44 am
@firefly,
Quote:
Then look it up yourself.

Why are you pumping AM for trivial info rather than looking it up yourself


Odd that you guys have a problem with sharing information on this case.

I also find it interesting that you Firefly are taking the interesting moral position that it does not matter if the three of them are in fact guilty of killing those children or not they still should go free because of the poor treatment they was given by the justice system.

To me it matter one hell of a lot if they are three innocent men walking free or three murderers of young children walking free no matter how badly the case was mess up in the first place.

That why personally I would love to see all three take lied detectors tests and once more if they are innocent and pass those tests it would be helpful to them in getting their lives back and perhaps pressuring the state to find the real killer or killers.
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Sat 20 Aug, 2011 01:07 am
I found the comparison of these two cases interesting.

Quote:
What do the West Memphis Three and Amanda Knox Have in Common
Bruce Fisher
August 20, 2011

After 18 long years the West Memphis Three are finally free. Damien W. Echols, 36, Jason Baldwin, 34, and Jessie Misskelley Jr., 36, were wrongfully convicted of killing three 8 year old boys, Steven Branch, Christopher Byers, and Michael Moore, in West Memphis, Arkansas in 1993.

The plea deal agreed to by all parties and confirmed by the district court judge is known as an Alford plea in Arkansas, which allows the men to maintain their innocence but it does not result in full exonerations. The plea that provided freedom may be seen as a disappointment to those expecting full exonerations. Damien Echols released a statement today explaining the decision to accept the plea:

"I have now spent half my life on death row. It is a torturous environment that no human being should have to endure, and it needed to end. I am innocent, as are Jason and Jessie, but I made this decision because I did not want to spend another day of my life behind those bars. I want to live and to continue to fight for our innocence. Sometimes justice is neither pretty nor is it perfect, but it was important to take this opportunity to be free.”

The miscarriage of justice that took place in West Memphis, Arkansas, was due in part to a rush to judgment based on information obtained from a coerced confession. For those following the Amanda Knox case in Perugia, Italy, those words are haunting.

Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito currently stand convicted of murdering Meredith Kercher in late 2007. Both have vehemently denied any involvement in the murder. The case is currently on appeal.

Though the cases are unrelated, similarities in the course taken by authorities to secure convictions are difficult to ignore. In both cases conclusions were made quickly based on perceived behavior rather than actual evidence. Guilt was determined quickly in the Amanda Knox case based on observed behavior. Lead investigator Edgardo Giobbi had this to say regarding Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito:

“We were able to establish guilt by closely observing the suspects’ psychological and behavioral reactions during the interrogations. We don't need to rely on other kinds of investigation as this method has enabled us to get to the guilty parties in a very quick time.”

Keep in mind that Giobbi made these claims long before a single piece of evidence was analyzed and before he had even heard of the real killer, Rudy Guede.

Guilt was decided in a similar fashion in the West Memphis Three case. Damien Echols was brought to the attention of authorities by Crittenden County juvenile officer Jerry Driver. Driver had somehow determined that Echols was a violent person from past interactions with him. Driver also believed that Echols was the leader of a satanic cult. There was never any evidence that the cult existed and Echols strongly proclaimed his innocence. With nothing to go on, the police questioned anyone that had ever come in contact with Echols.

Jessie Misskelley was brought in for questioning based on a tip that he had been seen with Echols. Misskelley was seventeen at the time of his questioning. Arkansas law states that anyone under the age of eighteen must not be questioned without the express written consent of a parent or guardian. However, consent wasn’t given by Jessie Misskelley, Sr. Misskelley is mentally handicapped with an IQ of 72 and a severely diminished reading capacity. He should never have been questioned alone without the knowledge of his caretakers. After twelve hours of intense pressure and coaching, he told police he had seen Damien Echols and Jason Baldwin attack the three boys. Misskelley was no match for the seasoned interrogators and was heavily influenced by their demands for information. His answers clearly showed that he was simply doing what he could to appease the authorities and his answers contradicted the actual evidence. He told police the three victims had skipped school the day of the murders and that the attack occurred at noon. He said that Damien and Jason raped and murdered the victims and tied their bodies with rope.

History shows that coerced confessions do not lead to accurate information. School records proved that all three had attended school that day, so not only did they not skip school, but they were in class at noon. The medical examiner found no evidence of rape, and the boys were not bound with rope but were tied using their own shoestrings. As soon as Jessie realized he wasn't going home he recanted his entire testimony.

Similar interrogation techniques were used by authorities in the Amanda Knox case. Knox was subjected to an all night interrogation putting her in a situation that she had absolutely no control of. Knox was thousands of miles from home, in a country where she had a very limited knowledge of the language, with no legal counsel, confronted by aggressive police officers who were accusing her of a horrible crime that she did not commit. Physical force was used on Knox and she was lied to intentionally to make her believe the police had evidence against her.

Knox was told that they had proof she was at the crime scene at the time of the murder. This was a lie. She was told that she was going to prison for 30 years and she would never see her family again. Knox was told that her boss, Patrick Lumumba was the killer. The interrogators told Knox to imagine she was at the cottage and that Lumumba committed the crime. The interrogators kept telling her over and over again to imagine that she was there. When she could not imagine what they were saying, she was slapped across the back of her head and called a stupid liar.

The abuse went on for hours until Knox was finally broken and desperate to end the questioning. Suffering from extreme exhaustion the twenty year old college student gave in to the interrogator’s demands by describing an imaginary dream or vision. In this vision, she was in the kitchen covering her ears to block out screams while the man she worked for, Patrick Lumumba, was in Kercher's bedroom. In accordance with Italian law, along with Lumumba, Knox implicated herself by stating her presence at the crime scene.

In both cases, statements obtained during coerced confessions were quickly recanted as soon as the suspects were out of the hostile environment. Information obtained during the interrogation of both Jessie Misskelley and Amanda Knox contradicted the evidence and was found to be unreliable. It cannot be stressed enough that coerced confessions do not provide reliable information. Unfortunately the erroneous information was accepted in both cases.

Both crimes were horrific, leaving many citizens fearing for their own safety, creating an environment that led to a rush to judgment. Authorities have been unwilling to admit mistakes in both cases leading to drastic measures in an attempt to save face including but not limited to; the manipulation of evidence, providing misinformation to the media, and neglecting to investigate other possible suspects. In the Knox case, the real killer, Rudy Guede has already been convicted but authorities refuse to see that all credible evidence points to him as the lone attacker. In the West Memphis Three case there are several possible suspects that have not been properly investigated.

One possible suspect is Christopher Byers' stepfather, John Mark Byers. Christopher's injuries were more violent than the other boys. His body showed signs of previous abuse. It appeared that more aggression was aimed at Christopher during the attack. John Mark Byers admitted at trial to striking Christopher with a belt as a form of punishment in the past. Another possible suspect is Terry Hobbs, the stepfather of Steven Branch. A hair found tied in the knots used to bind one of the victims may belong to Hobbs. Another possible suspect is a black man that was sighted at a restaurant not far from the crime scene covered in blood and mud. The suspect became known as Mr. Bojangles, named after the restaurant. He left the restaurant before authorities arrived. The truth is there were several leads that should have been more thoroughly pursued. Due to inexcusable negligence, this crime may never be solved.

The thought of spending 18 years in a cage for a crime you did not commit is enough to make anyone sick but the long timeframe also played a factor in the West Memphis Three’s freedom. The deal to release the three was made possible by DNA testing that showed definitive proof that they were not present at the crime scene. Testing of this nature was not available in 1993. The newfound DNA evidence prompted the Arkansas Supreme Court to schedule a hearing in November to take another look at the case. Thankfully that hearing will no longer be necessary.

Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito have spent nearly 4 years in prison for a crime they did not commit. On appeal the court has finally heard from independent experts regarding crucial DNA evidence. The defense request for independent testing was refused by Judge Giancarlo Massei in the first trial. If Massei would have allowed an independent review, Knox and Sollecito would have never been convicted in the first place.

The presiding appeals court judge, Claudio Pratillo Hellmann, appointed forensic experts Stefano Conti and Carla Vecchiotti, from Rome's Sapienza University to review the DNA. Conti and Vecchiotti, appeared in court July 25, unleashing a scathing attack on the prosecution, detailing gross negligence on the part of lead forensic scientist, Patrizia Stefanoni, regarding the key DNA evidence used to secure convictions in the first trial. The alleged murder weapon and a DNA laced bra clasp have been fully discredited by Hellmann’s experts leaving absolutely no credible evidence to confirm the convictions of Knox and Sollecito.

When court resumes in early September, Judge Hellmann will be obligated by Italian law to fully exonerate Amanda Knox and Raffaelle Sollecito as he cannot confirm convictions without evidence. For the West Memphis Three the fight to clear their names will continue. Hopefully all three will be able to find happiness and finally begin to live again. The same well wishes go out for Amanda Knox, Raffaele Sollecito and many others who have been wrongfully convicted.

My work with Injustice in Perugia no doubt led me to compare these two cases but the sad reality is that the same comparisons can be made with many wrongful conviction cases throughout the world with many found right here in the United States; Marty Tankleff, The Norfolk Four, Kelly Michaels, and Christopher Ochoa, to name a few.

Please take time to learn more about wrongful convictions. When a person has an injustice done to them, it is the responsibility of the masses to stand up for that person; for one day that person just might be you. Even worse, that person might be your son or daughter.
http://www.groundreport.com/article.php?articleID=2940932&action=print_article

Do other people here also feel that Amanda Knox was wrongfully convicted?

Anyone here feel that the West Memphis 3 were not wrongfully convicted, and that they are, in fact, responsible for those murders?
BillRM
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 20 Aug, 2011 01:14 am
@firefly,
Quote:
The miscarriage of justice that took place in West Memphis, Arkansas, was due in part to a rush to judgment based on information obtained from a coerced confession. For those following the Amanda Knox case in Perugia, Italy, those words are haunting.


Hmm interesting that the writer is taking the position that there was a miscarriage of justice when that is clearly still an open question to say the least.

Second from my fast reading the confession of the one boy could not be used in the trials of the other two boys and that why there was two trials not one.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 20 Aug, 2011 05:10 am
@firefly,
Quote:
Anyone here feel that the West Memphis 3 were not wrongfully convicted, and that they are, in fact, responsible for those murders?


An odd question from someone who had been frank enough to state that she herself is not sure if they are guilty or not of the crimes.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Sat 20 Aug, 2011 06:42 am
@firefly,
firefly wrote:
Do other people here also feel that Amanda Knox was wrongfully convicted?

I don't know anything about the Memphis 3, so I can't comment. Meredith Kercher's family don't seem to have a problem with Knox's conviction.
wandeljw
 
  0  
Reply Sat 20 Aug, 2011 07:40 am
@izzythepush,
Meredith Kercher's family deserves to have their feelings respected. However, as in the case of the West Memphis Three, there is no physical evidence linking Knox to the crime. Also, the Italian prosecutors chose a satanic ritual theory as was put forward against the West Memphis Three. Such theories have lost favor in the United States.
izzythepush
 
  2  
Reply Sat 20 Aug, 2011 07:49 am
@wandeljw,
I have not heard anything about Satanic ritual re Knox case. It may be commonplace where you are to talk to the press whilst a trial is ongoing, but that is not the case over here, and in some cases may be illegal. The Knox family seemed to do their utmost to put the Italian judiciary's collective noses out of joint even before a verdict had been reached. There is an appeal going on, and all of the evidence will be re-examined. I get the impression that a lot of people think she's innocent just because she's pretty, white and American.
wandeljw
 
  0  
Reply Sat 20 Aug, 2011 08:23 am
@izzythepush,
The satanic ritual remarks were made by the Italian prosecutor to the Italian press. Your impression is not evidence.
 

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