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The Trial that JUST WON'T END

 
 
Reply Mon 10 Jun, 2013 05:15 pm
What WOULD or WOULD NOT have happened if Rudy Guede had he been held after being arrested the few days prior to the murder of British student Meredith Kercher? He had committed a burglary.

Hint: It's not a difficult answer

...and GO.
 
View best answer, chosen by michellesings
Lordyaswas
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 05:45 am
@michellesings,
How much would would a would not not, if a would not could not not?

Total speculation.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 06:02 am
@michellesings,

Well there's the one you're thinking of, which is that Meredith would not have been raped and murdered.

Also, Mignini might not have been able to inspect the computer Guede possessed when he was arrested. It had been stolen from a law firm that opposed him on the Monster of Florence case.

With Guede not being able to break in through her window, Mignini would have been unable to examine Filomena's computer. She worked for a different law firm that opposed him on the Monster of Florence case.

Guede would not have thrown Meredith's phones down a ravine.

There would not have been a bomb threat called to the exact house where the phones landed, less than an hour after the phones landed there.

And the local police would not have responded to the bomb threat by conducting a search of the area where the phones were likely to have landed.
0 Replies
 
Lordyaswas
 
  0  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 06:07 am
Like I said....total speculation.
oralloy
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 07:06 am
@Lordyaswas,

It is not speculation to point out that someone who is being held in a jail will not be committing crimes outside that jail.
Lordyaswas
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 07:09 am
@oralloy,
I could speculate that a craft of little green men came down to take his place and carry out the burglary, but it would be pure speculation.

The whole basis of this thread is a waste of time.

Ifs and ands....
parados
 
  2  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 07:17 am
@Lordyaswas,
Lordyaswas wrote:

I could speculate that a craft of little green men came down to take his place and carry out the burglary, but it would be pure speculation.

The whole basis of this thread is a waste of time.

Ifs and ands....


And don't forget some big butts...

oralloy
 
  2  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 07:52 am
@Lordyaswas,
Lordyaswas wrote:
I could speculate that a craft of little green men came down to take his place and carry out the burglary, but it would be pure speculation.

That would be more nonsense than speculation.

In reality, Guede's crimes would not have continued if he had not been released from jail.


Lordyaswas wrote:
The whole basis of this thread is a waste of time.

It is never a waste of time to point out the truth.
oralloy
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 07:52 am
@parados,
parados wrote:
Lordyaswas wrote:
Ifs and ands....

And don't forget some big butts...

How would Guede have continued to break into places and steal the computers of Mignini's enemies if he was locked up in jail?
tsarstepan
 
  4  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 07:57 am
@michellesings,
Lambchop, ESQ JD wrote:

This is the trial that doesn't end
Yes it go's on and on my friends.
Some people started trying it not knowing what it was
And they'll continue trying it forever just because
This is the trial that doesn't end

Lordyaswas
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 08:07 am
@oralloy,
."......In reality, Guede's crimes would not have continued if he had not been released "....

but he was released, and he did continue.....and?

Here's a few more contentious "what ifs".......what if Kercher had not acted like a totally insensitive sociopathic weirdo immediately after the event, and had showed genuine concern, respect and shock/horror like the vast majority of rightminded humans would have, in similar circumstances?

What if the Italian Police were actually capable of organising a piss-up in a brewery, and carried out all the forensic procedures properly?

What if the poor victim had realised sooner that she was sharing accommodation with a weirdo sociopath, and had found somewhere else to live?

We could speculate forever...

izzythepush
 
  2  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 08:23 am
@Lordyaswas,
Lordyaswas wrote:
"what ifs".......what if Kercher had not acted like a totally insensitive sociopathic weirdo immediately after the event, and had showed genuine concern, respect and shock/horror like the vast majority of rightminded humans would have, in similar circumstances?


I think you mean Knox, not Kercher.
Lordyaswas
 
  2  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 08:23 am
@izzythepush,
Correct.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
  Selected Answer
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 08:36 am
@Lordyaswas,
Lordyaswas wrote:
Here's a few more contentious "what ifs".......what if [Amanda] had not acted like a totally insensitive sociopathic weirdo immediately after the event, and had showed genuine concern, respect and shock/horror like the vast majority of rightminded humans would have, in similar circumstances?

Since Amanda never acted the way you accuse, and did in fact react in shock and horror, the entire premise of your question is a lie.


Lordyaswas wrote:
What if the poor victim had realised sooner that she was sharing accommodation with a weirdo sociopath, and had found somewhere else to live?

First, the victims are Amanda and Raffaele. They are the ones who were illegally held in prison for four years, even though it was clear from the start that they are innocent.

And second, your callous slander of the victims is despicable. You should be ashamed of yourself.
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  0  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 11:14 am
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:

parados wrote:
Lordyaswas wrote:
Ifs and ands....

And don't forget some big butts...

How would Guede have continued to break into places and steal the computers of Mignini's enemies if he was locked up in jail?

And how could Amanda Knox have been arrested in Italy if she hadn't been allowed to study abroad?

OMG.. it's the fault of the US State Dept.
wandeljw
 
  4  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 01:35 pm
When I first heard this story in 2008, I assumed Knox and Sollecito were guilty. As more facts came out I could see why many people supported their innocence.

Nina Burleigh, a reporter who covered the trials of Amanda Knox, was interviewed for the University of Chicago magazine. Below is an excerpt from the interview:
Quote:
Why did the Italian press coverage seem so one-sided?
Italy is only 49th in press freedom in the world, and I came to understand what that meant. The judiciary doesn’t have a public face, so, for example, reporters just get information from favored lawyers, or the other way around: lawyers give favored reporters information. They just print this stuff as fact. There’s no official comment about what’s going on, so no one ever corrects things that lawyers say, that advance their narrative, their point of view.

Did you think Knox was guilty?
When I went over there, I basically thought she was guilty as charged. … After about a month of reviewing documents—the actual case record was available—and beginning to interview various lawyers and the prosecutor himself, I realized that almost everything I had been reading wasn’t true, or it wasn’t actually in the case record.

How did that happen?
It was really a case built on the sense that the police and the prosecutors had that there was just something wrong with this young woman. And they couldn’t put their finger on it. Part of it was the mistranslation, the clash of cultures and the way that young women are expected to behave here and there. She was a soccer player from age 8, and she’s into yoga, and she’s from Seattle, and she has no physical boundaries, in a way. She’s not formal—she’s totally informal—in this country where the bella figura is the be-all and the end-all, the thing that people judge you by. So she’d do things like break into a downward dog whenever she needed to stretch, and she was doing this in the police station. And in Italy, young girls don’t play soccer, that’s for sure, and they don’t exercise in public.
0 Replies
 
wandeljw
 
  4  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 01:44 pm
In "Why the Hunt for Witches Never Ends" Nigel Burke writes:
Quote:
Witchcraft manuals such as Heinrich Kramer’s Malleus Maleficarum of 1487 made it clear that “all witchcraft comes from carnal lust, which is in women insatiable”. It advised prosecutors that women who did not cry during trial were certain to be witches. Half a millennium on that sounds oddly familiar. When the American student Amanda Knox faced prosecution for the murder of her British housemate Meredith Kercher in Perugia, Italy, the prosecution’s language was redolent of a witch-trial. At an appeal hearing, lawyer Carlo Pacelli described Knox’s “double-faced soul”. One side was “angelic, good, compassionate and in some ways even saintly” but the other side was “demonic, satanic, diabolic”.

SHE was further described as an “enchanting witch”. Her failure to cry or demonstrate expected emotions was used in evidence against her, much in line with Malleus Maleficarum.

Anyone who followed the case could see that this language wasn’t a Rumpole-ish flourish. It was intended as character evidence.

British women may feel relieved that such naked misogyny would not be tolerated here. Amanda Knox was an American woman in an Italian court so why worry? Step in the European Arrest Warrant. If a court in Perugia wishes to try a woman for a crime, it merely needs to send a couple of British police officers to her door who can put her on a plane immediately.

She could meet that charmer Carlo Pacelli across a courtroom where she might not know the language. Suspects transported under the EAW can be kept on remand for months. Britain cannot help them. The European Arrest Warrant does not go through embassies. It arrives hot from the jurisdiction of Italy, Bulgaria, Romania or any EU member state. There is nowhere in Europe where you can be tried as a witch but there are places where you might be tried like a witch.

To an extent that also includes Britain. My own experience of jury service taught me how jurors, both male and female, tune in to a woman’s demeanour and emotions when she is giving evidence far more acutely than when a man is doing so.

For any slightly unusual female such as Amanda Knox the courtroom is a dangerous place. The ghost of the witch trial remains.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 01:57 pm
@wandeljw,
It's quite easy to put the blame on institutional misogyny. I don't think gender has anything to do with it, if a man had behaved in the same way people wouldn't have thought any differently.
wandeljw
 
  3  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 02:11 pm
@izzythepush,
Misogyny is not the problem. Western culture has certain expectations for appropriate female behavior.
izzythepush
 
  0  
Reply Tue 11 Jun, 2013 02:25 pm
@wandeljw,
What about appropriate male behaviour? Do you honestly think a man would have been treated differently had he behaved like that?
 

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