Are men (and women) who habitually cheat just creeps?

cjhasa

I'm sorry...actually I didn't recall the instance of craven using the term, so I just made a joke...Elizabethan audiences understood 'purse' to refer to the scrotum. They had a better sense of things than William Bennett.

It appears in his signature, sometimes, it simply says "purse", and is not a link.

Abuzz thread. Something about bleeping and codes. Blatham is on the right track, but I think it referred to the female... apparatus.

(It's one of those Nutella things, I wasn't there, but heard about it.)

soz

Believe me, I do understand your point, and I do share your sense of ethics/morals here. But if we disagree at all, it is in how attainable that worthy ideal might be.

Sure, I agree it's an ideal that is not necessarily attainable. Sans rationalization, I have no particular problem with ideals unattained. That's life.

I wouldn't know, I have never read one. ;-)

cjhsa,

It's a reference to things that happened on Abuzz before I joined.

Thanks for the additional information, Lola. Not required of course, but thanks.

I hope I have been clear that I don't think anything can be absolutely wrong in all circumstances... that there are always factors that push it in one direction or another on the ethics scale. If I steal a car that is sitting there with doors open and keys on the dash to get my sick daughter to the hospital when there are no other options, that is not absolutely wrong, though I think that in general stealing a car is inethical. Etc.

I understand what you're saying, Lola, think we may have to do one of those agree to disagree things. This is not all theoretical to me, I've been through it in various ways, and also have been a close confidant of people who have been through it, and have also dealt with it in a professional capacity -- I'm really quite familiar with the surrounding emotional complexity.

I do think there is a place for ethics in personal relationships. Again, of course it can't be perfectly hewed to at all times, but there is that feeling/ acting distinction again -- one cannot control one's feelings, but one can control one's acts. So I try (and, again, of course often fail) to act ethically where I can, including in personal relationships. As I'm sure we all do.

Yes, couldn't agree more, sozobe.

Blatham - tks! Will be checking this convenient bulletin board for updates. Btw: read the responses here and understand nothing (what's "inethical"?) not even the title ("cheating" is clearly understood in poker games only) so will look for you at Lola's next establishment if she opens one.

Er... "UNethical"...

I response to the title of the thread, i offer the opinion that, Yes, they are creeps. For whatever one may adduce about possible poor potty training, or unresolved psychological issues from the past, infidelity (which is what cheating means here, as i'm certain HoT knows, whether or not she be willing to admit as much) shows a selfish and childish disregard for the feelings of one's partner. It is, among all the other vile qualities entailed, a display of childish inconsideration.

set

Reading between the lines, I'm adducing that you are against it then.

I'm gonna start callin' ya Swifty the Mountie . . .

No, nor does a misplaced compassion serve to draw anyone's attention to the scurrilous nature of their self-indulgent and selfish behavior.

Anyone sufficiently intelligent to be reasonably described as an adult knows full well whether or not their lust is a passion of the moment, or a symptom of a profound and enduring attraction. In the former case, indulging that lust is a childishly selfish act, and shows a complete lack of consideration for their partner (were there no partner, such an example would not be germaine to this discussion). In the latter case, then a rather simple adherence to a personal ethic of honesty and decency in their treatment of anyone--let alone a partner with whom they are ostensibly emotionally and physically involved--would compel them to defer the consumation of said lust until such time as they could end their previous relationship in a decent and dignified manner. I acknowledge the pain and difficulty involved; i also recognize that no part of one's emotional life can be expected to always be easy to manage, and it would be simple ethical cowardice to try to sneak, hide or lie.

I suffered some very ugly treatment as a child. I forgive those who did so, and have some idea of the pathology at the root of it. I also have nothing to do with those people, and do not consider that the pathology justifies, it only mitigates a statement of the degree of their guilt. Certainly this involves finding fault; when one hurts another needlessly, one is at fault.

You needn't presume that what i've written is entirely about fault. It is more about what i consider the scurrilous behavior of those who, as described in the title, habitually cheat on a partner. I am frankly amazed that you would suggest that such an individual would not be entirely responsible. Does the "betrayed" partner bear the blame for the actions of someone who habitually cheats? I find that implausible. Certainly "right" and "wrong" matter in such a discussion. What you propose about finding the cause is a matter for the post mortem of the relationship. At the time that the partner learns of the betrayal, guilt is very much to the point, and any appeal to a pathology which makes the "guilty" party behave that way is going to be justifiably seen as making excuses. If someone is incapable of remaining loyal to a partner in an intimate relationship, the partner has very good reason to find fault, and the pathology of the "cheater" is meaningless to the pain they suffer. Perhaps, then, you should not have asked the question as you did. I understand what you mean by this, but i will still call anyone who habitually cheats on a partner a creep, because they either haven't learned, lack the ethical basis to recognize the socially unacceptable nature of their behavior, or have not sought help for what is obviously a problem. Anyone comfortable with a habit of "cheating" on their partner, and resentful of any accusation of guilt against them, might well be described as sociopathic.