Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 03:52 am
@dlowan,
dlowan wrote:

This can't be the first thread can it?


No. Another one started a couple of hours earlier.
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  4  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 03:52 am
@izzythepush,

As soon as something like this happens, news outlets go into headless-chicken mode.
"Al-Qaida suspected" was all you could hear on our TV all evening, but it turned out to be a Norwegian fascist instead.
No doubt his views will be aired later.
izzythepush
 
  2  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 04:09 am
@McTag,
You're quite right, those right wing posters on other threads are already trying to paint this as 'the exception that proves the rule.'
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 04:12 am
@izzythepush,
Another thing that's not been mentioned is Norway's Liberal gun policy. The vast majority of victims were killed not by the explosion, but by a gunman on a rampage with legally held weapons. Could this be Norway's Dunblane moment?
Walter Hinteler
 
  3  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 04:15 am
@McTag,
Wich really is surprising - or not.

As I'd posted yesterday evening on the other thread, from about 8 o'clock onwards more details, leading to the right-wing corner, were known.

But even now, when I type this, you can read on some US-conservative blogs "I’m not buying it. It's all only from the left-wing media ..." [that's a quote from "freerepublic"]
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 04:19 am
@izzythepush,

They've similar gun laws like elsewhere in Europe - definitely stronger than e.g. in Germany.

Shooting undisturbed for 30 minutes on a rather small but crowded island with an automatic weapon ... 84 is the death toll now.
0 Replies
 
saab
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 05:40 am
It seems like he had the licence for three guns: two hunting and one pistol.
According to Aftenposten Oslo he might have planned this for a long time, maybe even years.
He started a firm for vegetables and in May he bought 6 tons of artificial manuring. A material used for bombs. For the bomb in Oslo he would not have needed that much - probably 500 kilo.
He might have started the firm to be able to buy the artificial manuring.

The police think there is a second man - that according to witnesses.
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 05:44 am
@saab,
Hope they catch anyone else involved fast.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 05:47 am
@dlowan,
It's quite unusual that they caught the gunman, usually those that go on a shooting rampage kill themselves.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 05:49 am
@dlowan,
A second person (armed with a knife) has been arrested in Sundvollen, where many victim's relatives are assembled in hotel.
(He said that he was a member of Social-Democratic youth and was armed only for self-defence, according to NRK)
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  2  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 06:11 am
@Walter Hinteler,

Brilliant work by the SWAT team who took him alive.
jespah
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 06:20 am
@McTag,
NY Times and CNN were both saying 80 dead at the youth camp and 7 dead from the explosion.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 06:35 am
@jespah,
The Norwegian police said this morning (local time) that at least 84 died in Utøya.
http://i51.tinypic.com/qyya7q.jpg
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 07:06 am
Now the toll is up to 91...
wandeljw
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 07:09 am
@sozobe,
I think the 91 includes the 7 who died from the bombs. The 84 youths that were killed were between the ages of 13 and 19.
sozobe
 
  3  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 08:16 am
@wandeljw,
Right. (Toll of the murders in Norway....)

I guess we still don't know if the bomb was related, but certainly seems to be (the camp gunman was a farmer of sorts and received a normal-for-farming shipment of fertilizer that could be used for bomb-making in May).

But my post was after Walter's, even though it didn't reply to it, so I see how it could look like I was correcting his number, that wasn't my intent. (I'd last said "at least 17," now up to 91 total.)
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 01:23 pm
@sozobe,

Four still not accounted for, I believe. They may still be in the water.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 01:33 pm
@McTag,
Perhaps five - including the two leaders of the camp (aged 19 and 20).
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 01:58 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
There were reports on the BBC, that the perpetrator had been visiting fundamentalist Christian websites.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2011 02:33 pm
@izzythepush,
I've read such as well.
He seemed to have some ideas about Christianity:
Quote:

Men dagens protestantisk kirke er en vits. Prester i jeans som marsjerer for Palestina og kirker som ser ut som minimalistiske kjøpesentre. Jeg er tilhenger av en indirekte kollektiv konvertering fra den protestantiske kirke tilbake til den katolske. I mellomtiden stemmer jeg på de mest konservative kandidatene ved kirkevalg.

Det eneste som kan redde den protestantiske kirke er å gå back to basics.

But today's Protestant church is a joke. Priests in jeans who march for Palestine and churches that look like the minimalist shopping centers. I am a supporter of an indirect collective conversion of the Protestant church back to the Catholic. In the meantime, I vote for the most conservative candidates in church elections.

The only thing which can save the Protestant church is to go back to the basics.

Source (2009-12-09 17:14:41, last phrases)
 

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