12
   

what is freedom?

 
 
Reply Thu 30 Jun, 2011 06:08 pm
what makes someone free?
 
Lustig Andrei
 
  2  
Reply Thu 30 Jun, 2011 06:14 pm
@hamilton,
OK, I'll bite. What?
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Jun, 2011 06:21 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
how the hell should i know?
i asked the question, right?
0 Replies
 
Sturgis
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Jun, 2011 07:14 pm
@hamilton,
That will depend on who you ask.

According to some, Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose, nothin' I mean nothin' honey if ain't free. (thanks to Kris Kristofferson, Me and Bobby McGee, very nice version done by Janis Joplin, youtube it.)


to others freedom is a flame that burns within you, freedom's in the state of mind. Freedom's in the how you think about you...freedom is the right of all mankind.
(Thanks to Shenandoah, Broadway musical)


Ask any 2 people you're like as not to get 5 different answers. first had a talking through on the subject a long time ago, still don't have any permanent answer, it's flexible...kind of like freedom.



.
0 Replies
 
vikorr
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 Jul, 2011 12:15 am
@hamilton,
-Consciousness
-Self Programming
-Understanding
-Choice
-Balance
-Self-direction
-Self-directed growth
-self-honesty
etc
0 Replies
 
Lustig Andrei
 
  3  
Reply Fri 1 Jul, 2011 06:03 pm
For me -- and I speak only for myself -- freedom means that I can do whatever the hell I want to and choose to do . . . as long as I realize that no matter what I do, my actions will have consequences, either for good or for ill.
0 Replies
 
number1GOD
 
  2  
Reply Sat 2 Jul, 2011 09:18 am
@hamilton,
your own thoughts make u free you if u think u are a free man inside no matter what u will always be free
0 Replies
 
JLNobody
 
  1  
Reply Sun 3 Jul, 2011 10:57 am
@hamilton,
Free from what?
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Sun 3 Jul, 2011 11:08 am
@JLNobody,
not necessarily free from something.
it could be anything, oppression, consequence, slavery, obligation, anything.
0 Replies
 
existential potential
 
  3  
Reply Mon 4 Jul, 2011 02:23 pm
@JLNobody,
If we are talking about freedom in terms of freedom from something, would it not be right to say that a person is free when they are not constrained in any way? So "freedom" is freedom from constraint.

Not just external constraints but I suppose also "internal" constraints, self-limiting thought patterns, assumptions, prejudices etc. Vaguely, "freedom" is probably something that is learnt-people do not simply possess "free will" or "freedom" which allows them to act freely 100% of the time. Freedom can be learnt, through learning about what currently constrains what you can do.
hamilton
 
  2  
Reply Mon 4 Jul, 2011 02:44 pm
@existential potential,
i guess that because no one is truly free, freedom doesnt exist.
0 Replies
 
JLNobody
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Jul, 2011 10:54 pm
@existential potential,
Bingo, EP.
0 Replies
 
vikorr
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Jul, 2011 11:43 pm
@existential potential,
Quote:
Not just external constraints but I suppose also "internal" constraints, self-limiting thought patterns, assumptions, prejudices etc.
Our brain wires itself continuously. It makes literal connections between nerves that 'join the dots' for us - providing us with motor skills, memories, language, habits etc. It's not possible to be 'free of internal constraints' - they are built into us.

It is possible to guide (a lot of) the wiring, and it is possible to rewire the brain. How we wire our brain can be done consciously or unconciously - with will or willynilly. It's up to us.
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 Jul, 2011 07:49 am
@vikorr,
not constraints. liberations. these connections give us the freedom to perform these actions better, worse, or how ever we feel like it.
0 Replies
 
existential potential
 
  1  
Reply Wed 6 Jul, 2011 04:40 pm
@vikorr,
By using the phrase "internal constraints", I was referring to things like particular thought processes, particularly unconscious processes, and also thought processes that are barely aware of themselves, and have become automatic in some sense. Assumptions we make about ourselves and the world, and our general understanding of things can become a kind of prison that we reside in. Becoming free of these things is possible, through learning and reflecting on how we behave and live, the way we make decisions and how we tend to think.

There are internal constraints that are beyond our power to manipulate, but I
wasn't referring to them. My point was I suppose that those parts that we can guide in a particular direction, if "neglected", can become very difficult to change in any substantial or significant way. That's probably why we have to be alert to ourselves right, so that we are aware of the process that is "us", which enables a perception of the probable direction that we are going in at any one time?



hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Wed 6 Jul, 2011 06:36 pm
@existential potential,
only insane people have the power to manipulate those internal constraints...
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Thu 7 Jul, 2011 12:36 am
@hamilton,
Freedom its a coincidence...nothing more.
0 Replies
 
existential potential
 
  1  
Reply Thu 7 Jul, 2011 03:29 am
@hamilton,
Probably insane people have the least amount of power over such things.
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Thu 7 Jul, 2011 07:04 am
@existential potential,
your right. their constraints are worn away, and erased. not manipulated.
there is a joy in insanity that only mad men know...
i forget who said that...
0 Replies
 
Pamela Rosa
 
  1  
Reply Thu 7 Jul, 2011 10:31 am
Freedom is slavery
 

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