9
   

Is the Head of the IMF a Sex Criminal?

 
 
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Wed 1 Jun, 2011 08:43 pm
@hawkeye10,
Does machismo cause rape?

Quote:
The arrest of Dominique Strauss-Kahn, and the conspiracy theorizing and sympathy he garnered in response, has reportedly inspired some cultural soul-searching in France. We're told that French women will no longer put up with the sort of machismo that celebrated a man nicknamed the Great Seducer -- not to mention Georges Tron, the junior minister who was accused of sexual assault by two women promptly after DSK's arrest. At the same time, feminists have been quick to point out that there is a world of difference between womanizing and rape. Seduction is not sexual assault, not even in Puritan America.

All of this raises the question of whether there is an actual connection between an environment of machismo and rape. And that question taps into an even bigger query about how cultural mores influence sexual assault.

I went to Owen D. Jones, a professor of law and biological sciences at Vanderbilt University, for some insight. "Biology and culture are inextricably intertwined," he told me by email. "While sexual aggression therefore cannot be disentangled from biology, cultures that disinhibit sexual aggression against women will have more of it." To put it more simply: Cultures that accept sexual aggression against women will have more sexual aggression against women.

That seems incredibly straightforward, doesn't it? Things get much more complicated, though, when trying to clearly define something like sexual aggression, which encompasses a vast spectrum of behavior. French philosopher Genevieve Fraisse, author of "On Consent," told the New York Times, "Womanizing and rape are of course two different things," but, as the Times paraphrases, "on a sliding scale from aggressive courtship to harassment to sexual assault to rape, the borders between each of the categories are much harder to pin down."

I asked Jones, who has written extensively about how biology and culture influence sexual aggression, whether we might expect rape to be more common in a culture that embraces machismo. "Yes, if all else were equal," he said. "But ... all else is not always equal. For example, just to illustrate, you could have a culture of heavy machismo but also heavier than average penalties." As it happens, there are more reported rapes per capita in the United States than in France. Of course, cultural mores also influence the reporting rate -- which not only skews the data but also can affect the perceived risk to perpetrators, which in turn affects the likelihood of assault.

Jones explains that perps are influenced by the extent to which they think "they'll actually be reported" and, if so, "investigated and charged." There's also their perception of the likelihood "that jurors might convict, as well as an estimate of for how long, if at all, a perpetrator might be sentenced. " He says, "Although no one is suggesting that sexual transgressors think it through like a calculating machine, it is likely the case that the holistic assessment of how risky it is to assault someone is -- for better or worse -- affected by a wide variety of cultural factors."

On the one hand, it seems only natural to assume that culture would have a significant impact on sexual violence. On the other, it can seem a disturbing excuse for inexcusable behavior; just consider the recent report blaming child sexual abuse by Catholic priests in part on the sexual revolution of the '60s, or the claim by Roman Polanski's wife that his "unlawful sexual intercourse with a minor" was simply a product of the "sexual liberty and permissiveness" of the time. Then again, what purported explanation for sexual violence isn't in some way unsettling? Perhaps the most disturbing answer of all is that there isn't any one cause.

http://www.salon.com/life/feature/2011/06/01/dsk_culture/index.html?source=rss&aim=/mwt/feature
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Wed 1 Jun, 2011 08:51 pm
@hawkeye10,
The knives are out for Jack Lang.......the alleged new French willingness to talk about how bad French men allegedly suck is the perfect cover for the attack...
Quote:
After the DSK scandal, the French press's so-called "code of silence" about the private lives of public figures has been thrown to the wayside.
And it's revealing some disturbing crimes.
Take Jack Lang, the former Socialist culture and education secretary and a DSK ally, for example.
The Daily Mail now says that Lang is being accused of having an orgy with little boys in Morocco.
No one directly came out and accused Lang of the orgy, but Luc Ferry, a former minister of the Socialist party in France hinted about it on TV, by saying that an attack took place in Marrakech and "All of us here probably all know who I'm talking about."
He wouldn't give the man's name, saying, "If I let his name out now, it's me who will be charged and doubtlessly convicted, even if I know that the story is true."
But Ferry said the crime was uncovered by police and that it was an open secret which had been discussed openly by a former Prime Minister. And then L'Express printed Lang's name in connection with the rumor.
Lang seems to be disputing the story. He told the Daily Mail, "I don't want to get involved in these stories for now. I will speak in due course....This case is sadly trivial. Vulgarity is part of our world. All those who question my honour - newspapers and individuals - will be all be prosecuted."


Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/dominique-strauss-kahn-ally-accused-of-an-orgy-with-little-boys-in-morocco-2011-6#ixzz1O5E2zUfj

hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Wed 1 Jun, 2011 09:04 pm
@hawkeye10,
French reaction to IMF scandal: Media 'lynching' to 'wait-and-see'

Quote:
French reaction to the rape charges against International Monetary Fund chief Dominique Strauss-Kahn range from charges of an anti-French plot to letting the justice system run its course.


Former Socialist culture minister Jack Lang is strongly defending Strauss-Kahn against rape charges, claiming the whole matter is a "lynching."

"He is a brave man on whom a contemptuous fate has been inflicted," Lang says, according to Britain's Sky News. "It is not unthinkable that certain judicial officials, the prosecutor in particular or the judge, is driven by a desire to take down a Frenchman, a Frenchman who is moreover well known."

Likewise, former justice minister Robert Badinter claims Strauss-Kahn had been "put to death by the media," accusing police of a "provocative exhibition," Sky News reports.

But Martine Aubry, the first secretary of the Socialist Party, is counseling a wait-and-see attitude until the facts are clear and Strauss-Kahn has given his version of events.

"We have only heard the words of a prosecutor, whose job is to bring charges," she says.

The French newspaper Liberation, normally viewed as sympathetic to the left, says in an editorial Monday that Strauss-Kahn "knew that he was his own worst enemy."

But some political figures zeroed in on the U.S. justice system, particularly the infamous "perp walk" in which a suspect in handcuffs is photographed by the media.

The New York Times reports that former French justice minister Elisabeth Guigou, a Socialist party MP who strongly supported France's anti-perp-walk law, says she found the photos of a handcuffed Strauss-Kahn indicative of "a brutality, a violence, of an incredible cruelty, and I'm happy that we don't have the same judiciary system."

Guigou tells France Info radio, The Times reports, that the U.S. system "is an accusatory system," while in France, "we have a system that takes perhaps a little more time but which is, despite everything, more protective of individual rights."

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/ondeadline/post/2011/05/french-reaction-to-imf-scandal-ranges-from-lynching-to-wait-and-see/1?csp=34news
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Jun, 2011 10:48 pm
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
The Daily Mail now says that Lang is being accused of having an orgy with little boys in Morocco.
No one directly came out and accused Lang of the orgy, but Luc Ferry, a former minister of the Socialist party in France hinted about it on TV, by saying that an attack took place in Marrakech and "All of us here probably all know who I'm talking about."


HA! Luc Ferry is now getting his...the demand has been made that he flesh out his charges against Lang, with support given for charging him with failure to report a crime if what he says is true, and if false that Lang will sue him for defamation. http://www.lemonde.fr/politique/article/2011/06/01/pedophilie-luc-ferry-en-a-trop-dit-ou-pas-assez_1530303_823448.html#ens_id=1530707

It appears that the assertion that it is now open season for the laying of sex charges on the male leaders of France is over rated......OOPS
firefly
 
  4  
Reply Wed 1 Jun, 2011 11:34 pm
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
The people were never told the truth about the extent and purposes of the sexual assault reform laws, we have never really had our say,,,

The public is constantly educated and reminded about the content of the sexual assault laws--in rape education campaigns, in public school sex-ed classes, in the posting of the state sexual assault laws on every college and university Web site, and in the coverage of sexual assault trials in newspapers and television and the internet. And, the purpose of sexual assault laws is to deter and punish the types of sexual assaults described in the state laws.

Your repeated assertion that the public is unaware of the content and purpose of the laws is absurd, as is your statement, "we have never really had our say" in the passage of those sexual assault laws. When duly elected representatives in state legislatures write and pass laws, after allowing public debate on the legislation, that is "the people" having their say in the matter--no state laws pertaining to sexual assaults come into being in a clandestine fashion--these things are done in a very public, and democratic, and open way.

You don't like the state sexual assault laws because they conflict with your own sexual motivations and sexual preferences and sexual behaviors--and you've made that abundantly clear. Laws prohibiting forcible violent sexual assaults against an unwilling person have been around for a very long time. If that is your preferred mode of sexual contact, you are being "disadvantaged" by such laws, and it would help to explain your perception that they are "unfair". Well, such laws might be unfair to you, but they help to protect the rights of others not to be subjected to your unwanted behaviors.
Quote:
jury nullification of bad laws has a long tradition in America and an honorable one... making sure that we do our part to stop injustice as we sit on juries is our duty. It kinds looks like two cops got cleared of sex charges in just this way recently.

Where are juries nullifying laws that pertain to forcible violent sexual assaults? Who, beside you, and probably a lot of convicted sex offenders, is objecting to those laws?
The two NYPD officers were found not guilty of rape because the case lacked DNA evidence, and the woman's recollection of events was spotty, so the jury was not convinced beyond a reasonable doubt. But the officers were found guilty of departmental misconduct, and they were immediately kicked off the police force. No one, including the jury that decided the case, thought that there was anything wrong with the sexual assault/rape law under which they were charged. No one including the NYC police commissioner, thought that either the rape charges, or the trial, were unjust or unfair. That you cite this particular case as an example of "jury nullification" or juries stopping the injustice of a "bad law", is such a distortion of reality, that it borders on the bizarre.

You deny the reality of serious, violent felony, sexual assaults because it apparently hits too close to home in terms of your own behavior. So, the charges against DSK are, in your mind, "at best, minor crimes", rather than acts the state regards as so heinous that they can result in a 25 year prison sentence. And DSK's victim, if she's not outright lying, has an "inaccurate perception" because "DSK is flirty and entitled", but he's not an abuser. So, if the hotel maid isn't out to shakedown DSK for money with a fabricated accusation, she's clearly delusional in even believing she was sexually assaulted. In your mind, serious, violent felony, forcible sexual assaults don't even exist if they are committed by white guys, like you and DSK, in nice rooms. Again, your denial goes to such lengths that it borders on the bizarre.

No wonder the French are reeling in shock--a man who might have become the next president of France, might also be a criminal sexual predator, and they've possibly been covering up such behavior, thanks to their privacy laws. So they, and you, Hawkeye, sputter in righteous indignation that we photographed him in handcuffs for a "perp walk"--a "terrible humiliation" for the man--with no words about the terrible humiliation and sense of profound violation that his alleged victim (or victims) might have suffered because of this man's actions.

You have to pretend that DSK is being victimized, that he's the real victim, because the police and D.A. had the gall to act on a credible report of a crime, as well as other evidence of the crime, and went ahead and "unjustly" arrested him and charged him with the crime--and now they are going to put him on trial. Well, if that's not a gross miscarriage of justice, what is, right, Hawkeye? The nerve of them to victimize DSK that way. Rolling Eyes It's only "machismo". It's only misunderstood seduction. It was only some groping and a blow job--he didn't kill anyone, what's the big deal, right, Hawkeye? Victim? There is no victim--it's all in her mind, right, Hawkeye? DSK is the real victim, because these are "bad laws", right, Hawkeye? Forcible, violent assaults of unwilling victims are just the way some people express themselves, it's their individuality, and the rights of the individual are paramount, right, Hawkeye?

You overidentify with Strauss-Kahn, Hawkeye. You've told us that you and he are similar. That's why you can understand him. That's why you're defending him with all sorts of rationalizations and denials. That's why you can't acknowledge he might have serious psychological problems regarding his sexuality. That's why you can't acknowledge he might be a criminal sexual predator. It's all about, "There but for the grace of God go I" when you see him doing the "perp walk".







hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Thu 2 Jun, 2011 12:09 am
@firefly,
Quote:
Hawkeye? Forcible, violent assaults of unwilling victims are just the way some people express themselves, it's their individuality, and the rights of the individual are paramount, right, Hawkeye?
I can not picture the DSK that I have read about forcing a woman to do anything, nor being violent, and as I have already said I strongly suspect that if Ophelia was not willing that she neglected to tell DSK that. But at the end of the day a he said/she said over a blow job is not a matter for the criminal system. As per usual Americans fail at the job of prioritizing.

I am personally invested, not only because I am a libertine and because I come from an abuse back ground and am married to a sexual abuse survivor and because my kids were sexually assaulted, but more so because I have seen the states abuse of the citizen under the excuse of the need for the nanny state to protect alleged victims....because I have personally witnessed gross injustice carried out under a programs of lies which were intended to cover up what the state was actually doing. I no longer believe that the state goal in running over the citizens is to protect citizens...this is a power game, and unless we start resisting it will be the american people who lose it.
Ionus
 
  0  
Reply Thu 2 Jun, 2011 12:46 am
@engineer,
Quote:
The mother who persuaded her daughter not to press rape charges against DSK nine years ago speaks out.
I wonder what happened to the feminist campaign encouraging mothers to report rape, especially of their children . All I have seen is to encourage the victim yet their are few familial rapes where the mother is not suspicious at least .
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  3  
Reply Thu 2 Jun, 2011 01:54 am
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
I can not picture the DSK that I have read about forcing a woman to do anything, nor being violent...

That's because, thanks to the French privacy laws, there may be a lot you haven't gotten to read about him. And, what has been written, is not exactly inconsistent with a man who could easily cross a legal line in terms of being "forceful", if he had the opportunity and the perception he could safely get away with it.
Quote:
I strongly suspect that if Ophelia was not willing that she neglected to tell DSK that

Mightn't he have realized she wasn't consenting when she ran from him, and kept trying to push him away, and he had to drag her from one room to another, and she escaped and ran from the suite at the first opportunity?

Well, I wonder if the NYPD Special Victims Unit and the Manhattan D.A.'s sex crimes division have managed to convince him yet that she really was unwilling. Rolling Eyes

If DSK is in as much denial as you are, it's no wonder he's in such deep legal trouble right now.
Quote:
I have seen the states abuse of the citizen under the excuse of the need for the nanny state to protect alleged victims

That "nanny state" has laws against forcible sexual assaults of unwilling people to protect everyone from the harmful actions of those who would violate such laws--the laws are meant to have deterrent effect--to prevent potential victims--and they are meant to punish transgressors--those who have actually victimized someone. And that you might feel "abused" by such laws, or that you might see DSK as "abused" by such laws, just shows how screwed up your egocentric priorities are, and how warped and distorted your perception of reality is.





hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Jun, 2011 02:50 am
@firefly,
Quote:
That's because, thanks to the French privacy laws, there may be a lot you haven't gotten to read about him
so are you saying that he only abuses French women, in France? The man is 62 years old, he travels the world constantly, he has houses in Washington DC and Morocco as well as in Paris, and and yet weeks into this we dont have a bunch of women coming forward to claim that DSK abused them because of the French Privacy Law? You are playing stupid, Right?
Quote:
And, what has been written, is not exactly inconsistent with a man who could easily cross a legal line in terms of being "forceful", if he had the opportunity and the perception he could safely get away with it.

That depends upon how idiotic the laws are...ours are pretty bad.
Quote:
Mightn't he have realized she wasn't consenting when she ran from him, and kept trying to push him away, and he had to drag her from one room to another, and she escaped and ran from the suite at the first opportunity?
Really? None of that is listed on the charge sheet.

Quote:
That "nanny state" has laws against forcible sexual assaults of unwilling people to protect everyone from the harmful actions of those who would violate such laws--the laws are meant to have deterrent effect--to prevent potential victims--and they are meant to punish transgressors--those who have actually victimized someone
This is nothing more than most of your mantra of " The government is here to help, we have laws and those who violate those laws are criminals... all criminals will be harshly dealt with". You build in the assumption that the government is helping, that their help is wanted, and that the government has the right to take care of all those whom they deem victims by making criminals out of all those whom they deem to be trangressors. I simply disagree with your assumptions, values and priorities. I think your approach makes people weaker and dumber, which is not in our best interests. I also think that you trash the Constitution and that the inevitable result of your way is an enslaved people.

Quote:
And that you might feel "abused" by such laws, or that you might see DSK as "abused" by such laws, just shows how screwed up your egocentric priorities are, and how warped and distorted your perception of reality is.
Right, because anyone who disagrees with your values and your hierarchy of victims is warped, is insane. We often see this habit of yours to pathologize away any disagreement so that you dont need to deal with it. You have a very closed mind Firefly, my guess is that it is a function of old age.




spendius
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Jun, 2011 03:13 am
@firefly,
Quote:
That's because, thanks to the French privacy laws, there may be a lot you haven't gotten to read about him. And, what has been written, is not exactly inconsistent with a man who could easily cross a legal line in terms of being "forceful", if he had the opportunity and the perception he could safely get away with it.


Where are you getting all this from ff? All that with a "may" to get you out of difficulties but to give an impression to the unwary.

Quote:
Mightn't he have realized she wasn't consenting when she ran from him, and kept trying to push him away, and he had to drag her from one room to another, and she escaped and ran from the suite at the first opportunity?


Is all this true? I think you want her to have been assaulted much more than that there is another explanation which involves her not having been. As do many more.

The "nanny state" just blew away 12 Afghan children and 2 women and no doubt injured a few more due to some careless operational detail. We know it has laws against forcible assaults but it is what overblown allegations of a trivial nature, compared to that, lead to for everybody that hawk is concerned about. As I am. It's obvious you are a full blown racist. It's obvious you are using this alleged trivial incident for some other purpose which, if it gets out of hand, is economically dangerous for the US and its allies and those who follow its examples. And it will be out of hand if every woman is to be fitted with a panic button and a dust-cap camera signalling that she expects to be attacked at any moment just as a bloke wearing body armour is signalling that he expects to be shot at at any moment. The obvious acute anxiety and paranoia will no dount benefit the medical profession as they dole out comfort and medications to calm all you women down.

We can't protect everyone without locating them in an individualised air-conditioned room with cotton wool padded walls.

I think you are off your rocker ff. You sense of proportion has gone into orbit. This lady is no Ann of Green Gables. You are heading for the segregation of the sexes if your ambition is to protect everyone. The militant lesbian's ultimate objective.
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Thu 2 Jun, 2011 03:24 am
@spendius,
Quote:
The militant lesbian's ultimate objective.
She denies that she is a lesbian, but Bill and I both say she acts like one....Ionus might have as well but I am not sure.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  0  
Reply Thu 2 Jun, 2011 03:28 am
@hawkeye10,
I don't think you are a libertine hawk if the word means what I understand it to mean. Even I don't qualify for that title.
spendius
 
  0  
Reply Thu 2 Jun, 2011 03:41 am
@firefly,
Quote:
no state laws pertaining to sexual assaults come into being in a clandestine fashion--these things are done in a very public, and democratic, and open way.


That is not true. Those politicians who pass laws in this area are frightened out of their wits in case what they say is misinterpreted by interested parties and blown out of proportion. That happened two weeks ago here when our Justice Secretary had the temerity to suggest that there are different degrees of rape.

There are different degrees of rape and yet the minister had an apology dragged out of him after an almighty row. For stating the facts. The whole judicial system has, for as long as anyone can remember, acted on the basis that there are different degrees of rape. As has the parole system.

The laws have come into being on the basis of who can make the most indignation noises and get the most publicity and forcing politicians to cower in their rooms and pass anything in an area they really don't care about all that much but want a quiet life. All the while the noisemakers can maintain sex at the top of their consciousness.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Thu 2 Jun, 2011 03:42 am
@spendius,
spendius wrote:

I don't think you are a libertine hawk if the word means what I understand it to mean. Even I don't qualify for that title.
De Sade would not agree with my taking the title, that is for sure. Have we a better word for an erotic freedom fighter?
spendius
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 2 Jun, 2011 03:57 am
@hawkeye10,
Yes-- normal bloke not all hung up. L'Homme qui aimait les femmes.
spendius
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 2 Jun, 2011 04:10 am
@spendius,
Possibly the idea is to render women unloveable. And it is definitely succeeding. The seaside girls of my youth were nothing like the young women of today. Politicising sex is disastrous for women. This case is disastrous for women.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 2 Jun, 2011 06:12 am
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

Quote:
The Daily Mail now says that Lang is being accused of having an orgy with little boys in Morocco.




Don't believe a bloody thing you read in The Daily Mail. It's the UK's printed version of Fox News, but not as evenly balanced.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eBT6OSr1TI[/youtube]
ehBeth
 
  2  
Reply Thu 2 Jun, 2011 07:06 am
@spendius,
spendius wrote:

Yes-- normal bloke not all hung up. L'Homme qui aimait les femmes.


b.s. he doesn't like 'em, let alone love 'em
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  0  
Reply Thu 2 Jun, 2011 07:06 am
@izzythepush,
Fox News is well to the left imo.
0 Replies
 
Irishk
 
  3  
Reply Thu 2 Jun, 2011 07:47 am
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
Have we a better word for an erotic freedom fighter?

Creep.
0 Replies
 
 

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