68
   

The Republican Nomination For President: The Race For The Race For The White House

 
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Jan, 2012 11:18 pm
@cicerone imposter,
You seem to be heavily relying upon a retort that breaks down to:

"That you don't have a clue to what I mean, tells me enough about your ignorance."

Quite self-serving and, at this point, expected.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Jan, 2012 11:22 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Of coarse; some people like you fail to understand common knowledge issues like "moral majority" that has been used for several decades - especially during presidential elections.

The Moral Majority was a political organization of the United States which had an agenda of evangelical Christian-oriented political lobbying established in the late seventies by Jerry Falwell.
roger
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Jan, 2012 11:43 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Finn dAbuzz wrote:

I'm liking Romney more and more and Gingrich and Santorum less and less.


Me too, but I won't be staying home.

Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Jan, 2012 11:56 pm
@cicerone imposter,
You're hopeless. Go take a nap.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Jan, 2012 11:57 pm
@roger,
I probably won't either, truth be told.

It will be a good measure, though, of how much I think a second Obama term will harm this nation if I find myself voting for Gingrich.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  2  
Reply Fri 20 Jan, 2012 12:13 am
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
Mr G said Mrs #2 lied, and that his daughters support his claim. I wonder if anybody is going to do a follow up on this story. It's hard to believe this is the end of that issue.

Quote:
The Truth About Marianne Gingrich
By John H. Richardson

In the spring of 2010, I began reporting on a story about Newt Gingrich and the empire he'd built since his spectacular fall from the speakership, from elective office, and from polite society, twelve years before. I was doing the piece because I was astonished at the news that I'd been picking up that however unlikely it might have sounded at the time, and in spite of all, Newt Gingrich was planning to run for president in 2012. In the ensuing months, I interviewed Gingrich several times, and found him to be as facile and slippery as ever.

Frustrated at this, and feeling as though I needed someone to tell me the truth about such a fascinating and vaguely human character who had been such an important actor on the political stage for decades, I sought out Gingrich's second ex-wife, Marianne, whom he had left ignominiously after carrying on a six-year affair with a member of his staff. Marianne and Gingrich were married for eighteen years, throughout his rise from a backbencher in the minority to the speakership, and she had been both his closest confidant and most important advisor. She hadn't spoken to anyone since the divorce. She didn't speak up for ten years and refused dozens and dozens of interview requests, including ours. She said she'd speak up because she didn't think he should be trusted with the presidency, given his emotional instability. Is it so inconceivable that she might actually have decent motives?

Her portrayal of Gingrich was devastating, complex, nuanced, and compassionate. She held nothing back. And we continued talking after the piece was published, a conversation that continues (more on that in a moment.)

And so it's kind of funny, actually, seeing news that you broke a year and a half ago being blasted out on the Internet as some kind of world exclusive. Why, it's as if we're all amnesiacs. All last night and into today, alarmed headlines have blared across the masthead of the Drudge Report.
SHOCK CLAIM: Newt moved for divorce just months after she had been diagnosed with Multiple Sclerosis.... Or: Gingrich Lacks Moral Character to Be President, Ex-Wife Says... Bitter Marianne Gingrich Unloads, Claims Newt Wanted Open Marriage... Or: Adviser: Marianne 'very bitter'...

All of this — the "open marriage," Gingrich leaving his wife shortly after her diagnosis with MS, etc. — appeared in the September 2010 issue of Esquire.

Follow those links and you arrive at breathless stories about Marianne Gingrich's "first television appearance," which will be aired tonight on ABC. She will say that Gingrich "lacks the moral character to serve as President" because "his campaign positions on the sanctity of marriage and the importance of family values do not square with what she saw during their 18 years of marriage."

The real problem is that the marriage dispute is actually the most forgivable part of Gingrich's behavior. Love makes fools of us all, etc., and liberals who believe in parole and rehabilitation really should think at least once before they snicker at the religious folks who have decided to believe in Newt's remorse for his past behavior. But the story Marianne told in Esquire went much, much deeper — a story of wildly erratic behavior that went back to the very first night they met, full of manic ups and downs, secrets and betrayals and passionate reconciliations. More important was his behavior in Congress, the ferocious and manic drive that accomplished much (for better or for worse, depending on your point of view) but collapsed in a breakdown so severe his own Republican peers had to force him out of power. Or the story about his midnight visit to Bill Clinton, immediately followed by Gingrich backpedaling on the Clinton impeachment. Or her ultimate conclusion about his financial ethics and the truly grotesque amount of lobbying he has done since he left Congress — that he chose corruption.

But focusing on the divorce makes it easy to dismiss Marianne as just a bitter ex-wife — the marital version of "disgruntled employee." This would be really unfortunate.

After I wrote the story, I ended up spending more time with Marianne while we explored a book project. She picked me up at the airport at midnight, I stayed at her house, we spent a lot of time together. And I really think what I wrote in the article is true — sure, she's angry that he cheated on her and divorced her for a much younger woman. Who wouldn't be? But she still has a genuine affection for their life as a couple, for Newt and Marianne — for the hope and love of their early years and for the morning-in-America conservative dream they shared. She took care to never say a bad thing about him that wasn't also accompanied by a good thing.

In the time I spent at Marianne's place, we talked mostly about their early days. It wasn't for publication, her guard was down, and we'd developed a comfortable level of mutual trust, so I think I got a pretty unvarnished version of the truth — unvarnished enough that she freaked out when I showed her the pages and decided she couldn't go forward with the project. I would be breaking my promise to her to reveal much of what she said, but the takeaway was more positive than negative: a troubled, idealistic, spontaneous, sweet, affectionate and loving Newt Gingrich.

This is the real story, which is almost the opposite of the one that's hitting the media now. (This happens so much on television and the Internet. Last week, I did a TV interview about another of my profile subjects, Ron Paul, and they wanted to focus on the racist newsletters he didn't write twenty years ago instead of the nutty ideas he says on TV every day.) The real story isn't that Gingrich committed adultery — an act every bit as offensive as sodomy to the actual Bible, if not to modern Christians — over and over and over again. The real story is that Newt Gingrich is so deeply conflicted and strange, so erratic and unreliable, so scheming and secretive, that he's way too much like a character out of Dostoevsky than a politician should ever be.

Read more: http://www.esquire.com/blogs/politics/marianne-gingrich-interview-6641643#ixzz1jybXXk45
http://www.esquire.com/blogs/politics/marianne-gingrich-inter view-6641643


This is a link to that earlier interview with Marianne Gingrich that was part of an indepth article about Newt that appeared in Esquire last year. It is interwoven with a great deal of background information about Newt, and it concludes with a look at his financial dealings and empire. It is a very interesting read.
http://www.esquire.com/features/newt-gingrich-0910

cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Jan, 2012 12:52 am
@firefly,
Thanks for posting that article on Newt. It gets stranger with every bit of new knowledge about this character running for the president of this country. "Strange, erratic, and unreliable" should put the fear of god in most anyone who learns this about Newt.
0 Replies
 
revelette
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Jan, 2012 09:05 am
If Newt wins the republican primary, it is a sure sign of the republican disarray. Personally I don't think it is going to happen and I hope Obama focuses all his re-election attention on Romney.

That said, it is odd in a heavy Evangelical state like South Carolina Newt got applause for going off on the media for questioning him concerning his open marriage thing. I think it is just another sign of just how much most of the republicans don't like Romney.
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Jan, 2012 09:17 am
@realjohnboy,
I disagree, in that I think Newt did very well and Romney did BADLY.

The dodges were terrible, the "maybe" was terrible.

And Newt scored real points several times. One that I saw that I thought was very good was his response to Romney saying that Obama was going to go after his taxes and he didn't want to release them until he was the definite nominee, pretty much. Newt said something like, if there is anything dangerous in your taxes, voters need to know now, BEFORE they decide you're the nominee.

Newt's opening cavalcade was exactly what he needed to deal with the Marianne situation. Turn it around on the media, do the righteous indignation thing. Got a great response.
djjd62
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Jan, 2012 09:25 am
@Joe Nation,
Joe Nation wrote:
Joe(Do you think we should have listened more closely to Roger Williams, not a Founder, but still.... . ?)Nation


i think we should have listened more closely to Will Rodgers
0 Replies
 
revelette
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Jan, 2012 09:29 am
@sozobe,
Quote:
Got a great response


I was busy all day yesterday so didn't watch the debate, watched the rewind so to speak on morning joe. It is kind of odd though that he got that kind of response for the question in that state in particular. Guess the Evangelicals are loosing some of the hold on the republicans?
izzythepush
 
  0  
Reply Fri 20 Jan, 2012 09:33 am
@revelette,
There was a report on Channel 4 yesterday, saying that the economy is the number 1 concern for voters, even in South Carolina where attitudes to abortion, gun ownership and homosexuality usually take centre stage.
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Jan, 2012 09:35 am
@revelette,
I think it's a sign of how much disdain they have for the media, hence the standing ovation. Evangelicals are all about grace and redemption. Newt is the anti-media candidate. That will play big in SC.
revelette
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Jan, 2012 09:37 am
In response to my on question I got curious and googled, came across this:( Of course this is before the debate)

South Carolina Primary Election 2012: GOP Candidates Fail To Inspire Social Conservatives



0 Replies
 
revelette
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Jan, 2012 09:41 am
@JPB,
I am not sure if is as much redemption as just getting older. Has he made any public declarations or regret for his past behavior?

But your right it is probably an applause for a hit to the media to whom they all watch just along with the rest of us.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Jan, 2012 09:58 am
@izzythepush,
Quote:
There was a report on Channel 4 yesterday, saying that the economy is the number 1 concern for voters,...


The stick rattling in a bucket approach. Again.

The voters are probably sat on their sofas with a pocket calculator following the minor adjustments to their assets, both real and potential, being flagged up by each subtle inflexion of the voice or bodily reflex.

It's a bit much don't you think izzy that revel should suggest that men only become contrite because they are going a bit flaccid and become more interested in an all-purpose and well-trained domestic appliance to keep things in order so they can concentrate on more important matters like booting Mr Obama out of the White House.
H2O MAN
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 20 Jan, 2012 09:59 am


Of the 4, Newt is the better choice to defeat Obama.

Obama will be made the fool we all know he is in any debate with Newt.
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Jan, 2012 10:05 am
@H2O MAN,
Really, of all the reasons I'd like Newt to be the nominee, that's about number one.

Conservatives are so caught up in the Fox nexus that they actually believe that bullshit about Newt being "knowledge" and Obama being a "teleprompter."

But the thing is, if it actually is Newt vs. Obama in a debate, the filters come off.

And that would be fun fun fun. Very Happy
revelette
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Jan, 2012 10:07 am
@spendius,
Quote:
It's a bit much don't you think izzy that revel should suggest that men only become contrite because they are going a bit flaccid and become more interested in an all-purpose and well-trained domestic appliance to keep things in order so they can concentrate on more important matters like booting Mr Obama out of the White House.


Laughing
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Jan, 2012 10:07 am
Meanwhile, Newt's lead in SC is growing.

The Marianne stuff hasn't had enough time to percolate, so that's unclear still. My own gut feeling is that Marianne's interview coming just before the debate and Newt's chance to react forcefully (and blame the media in the process) means that it will be mostly a wash. But we'll see.

And revelette, yes, Newt's definitely been pushing the reformed/ different person/ seen the light/ repentant sinner line.
 

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