25
   

Hey, Can A Woman "Ask To Get Raped"?

 
 
BillRM
 
  -2  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 02:06 pm
@firefly,
Hawkeyes you are 100 percent correct these posters on this thread are crazy indeed and wish to write laws and rules concerning sexual relationships between men and women that are not sane in any regards.

The more the laws are push in their desire direction the crazies cases we will all get to reads about in the paper with special note of the increasing cases of women trying to extorted men with threat of false charges.

Oh well I am far from the sexual zoo of single bars of my youth thanks god.

I can only pity the poor young people of both sexes until this wave of craziness had passed into history .

With such things as female combat marines coming into existed this silliness of women as children can not last long.
hawkeye10
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 02:39 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
will all get to reads about in the paper with special note of the increasing cases of women trying to extorted men with threat of false charges.
There is some reason for optimism on that as we have been able to tamp down the practice of women making routine child sex abuse charges against men during custody conflicts. What happened was that false charges happened so often that new charges have come to be viewed with scepticism. We are a long way from this success on sexual conflicts however, as we are currently at a place where all charges are assumed to be true until proven not, even though we know that a lot of the charges are false. A whole lot more stem from honest conflicts which should never have been given access in the criminal justice system both because the results tend to be unfair to men and because this system is not able to make progress on solving the creation of sexual conflicts. Education is the driver for this desired change, not punishment after the fact and here I am defining the desired changed as the reduction of conflict not the desired change that pushes sex law currently, which is that women should get what ever they want.

Feminists have backed down slightly from the stance that all sex not initiated by women is abuse to the stance that all sex that the woman decides after the fact that she did not want is abuse. Memory shifts, as science knows full well, it tends to get molded around what the person wants to believe so any person who after the sex decides what happened is not what they wanted is going to craft a memory of the consent process that conforms to their needs. Most guys have enough personal experience with women shifting responsibility for their own behaviour onto men to know what the end result of this scheme is going to be.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 03:30 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
With such things as female combat marines coming into existed this silliness of women as children can not last long.
Unfortunatly affirmative action is likely to the be model, where blacks who are capable often feel discredited by affirmative action because everyone assumes that preferential treatment and not ability got them to where they are. However, the rest of the blacks don't want to give up the extra help and some don't want to give up the excuse that racism is what holds them back because to face the fact that their own personal deficiency's are the cause is too much for them. But look how affirmative action is still around, still perpetuating the culture of victimization amongst blacks after all these years. Blacks who personally experience affirmative action as a negative are none the less loath to lobby to end it, partly because of the personal abuse they get for taking this position, and partly because they think there there really are victimized blacks out there somewhere who do need the program so they don't want to take it away.

My fear is that this will how is goes with the female victim culture as well, that even women who are insulted or hurt by the cultures programs will none the less not be very willing to work to end this travesty.
Intrepid
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 04:47 pm
@hawkeye10,
Why are you turning this into a thread about race?
BillRM
 
  -2  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 04:51 pm
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
My fear is that this will how is goes with the female victim culture as well, that even women who are insulted or hurt by the cultures programs will none the less not be very willing to work to end this travesty.


Do not forget Hawkeye however that males who are burned by this silliness are going to have very mad and upset mothers and sisters and aunts and females friends that are not going to think locking up the guy for twenty years over protecting some drunken woman from herself is a great idea.

We will reach the point where a woman is view with having the same duty as a male to apply commonsense in such areas as drinking and sex. If she does end up in bed with a person she is unhappy about because of her drinking all that would be call for is that she will in the future be more careful in the amount she drink.

I am rolling over when I picture a man going to the police and filing rape charges because he had gotten himself drunk and ended in bed the next morning with a real female dog that had been hopefully buying him drinks just before the bar closed for the night.

As women begin to be view by themselves and others as real adults a similar reaction of laugher will occur at the very idea of a drunken woman trying to file rapes charges on a man who she ended up in bed with in a similar manner.
hawkeye10
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 05:09 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
Do not forget Hawkeye however that males who are burned by this silliness are going to have very mad and upset mothers and sisters and aunts and females friends that are not going to think locking up the guy for twenty years over protecting some drunken woman from herself is a great idea.
Yes, this is a big difference between perpetuating the culture of black victimization and perpetuating female victimization. Also, there is more connection and empathy between men and women than between blacks and non blacks in general. Using the female victim argument to hurt men will be more difficult for women to do then using the black victim argument to advance blacks above others at the expense of others is for Blacks.

It is good to see that we are starting to get women objecting to how feminists have treated and are treating men, who are saying straight up the feminists have become male bashing and that it needs to stop. However, while I think that there are a lot of women who feel this way they have not generally found their voice yet. Hopefully they do.

My fear is that the Female Victim culture will prove as enduring past its legitimate use as the black victim culture has, but the differences that you and I seem to agree on between the two give reason for hope.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  -2  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 05:12 pm
@hawkeye10,
Oh I had a female friend once tell a great funny story of going out drinking and getting completely wasted and then ending up waking up the next morning is a stranger bed with someone pressing up tightly against her back.

She was not happy and begins wondering who bed she was the hell in first and who was the guy she had gone home with now pressing against her back happen to be.

She could not remember anything about most of the night before.

Slowly she reached backward and ran her hands lightly over the other sleeping person in order to try to get a clue who he might be only to get another shock as all she feel was hair!

It turn out she was in the extra bedroom at one of her girlfriends homes and the very hairy guy sleeping by her was her girlfriend great dame.

She ended the story by declaring that she had gone home with some hairy old dogs in the past because of her drinking but this was the last straw and she was going to reduce her drinking from then on.


0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  2  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 06:51 pm
@Intrepid,
Quote:
Why are you turning this into a thread about race?


Because Hawkeye has a problem with blacks, just as he has a problem with women.

And he can't stop babbling his pseudo-sociological nonsense about sex laws and those big bad feminists who want him to keep his hands off female children and child pornography. One minute the women are victims, the next minute they have too much power. Men have the rape gene as part of their evolutionary heritage, so no one should expect them to exercise self control. The only solution is to overturn the sex laws, so none of them will get into trouble "for just acting like a man".

Blah, blah, blah....


firefly
 
  2  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 06:56 pm
And in today's news...

Quote:

Suspect faces trial in rape, killing of girl in Sheraden
Friday, August 06, 2010
By Sadie Gurman, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

Tushon Brown A convicted sex offender will stand trial in the rape and fatal stabbing of a 14-year-old East Liberty girl, a judge ruled this afternoon.

District Judge Eugene Ricciardi held Tushon Brown, 35, on charges of homicide, statutory sexual assault, tampering with evidence, abuse of a corpse and failing to comply with registration of sexual offenders in the July death of Lauren Deis. His ruling came after a short preliminary hearing during which a lone city homicide detective testified.

Detective James R. Smith said that Mr. Brown told him he killed Ms. Deis, whom he encountered July 7 when he left his home in Sheraden "looking for sex."

At an alley near his home, Ms. Deis "caught his eye," Detective Smith said. "He knew he wanted to have sex with her."

He said she agreed to have sex with him for money, and the two walked back to his house on Glen Mawr Street, where the deadly encounter took place.

Mr. Brown told police he stabbed Ms. Deis after she picked up a kitchen knife and cut him. Detective Smith said he saw wounds on Mr. Brown's left wrist and chest, which Deputy District Attorney Mark Tranquilli said could have happened as Ms. Deis tried to defend herself.

He read from an autopsy report that showed the 14-year-old was stabbed nine times in the trunk, in the neck and in the face. She had cuts on her hands that Mr. Tranquilli said were "a desperate attempt to ward off knife stabs."

"This child," he said, "was basically a pin cushion.

Read more: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10218/1078196-100.stm#ixzz0vsRdWhcD
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 07:22 pm
And, from today's news, more on that man accused of raping a Russian tourist in NYC...a very typical date rape scenario...

Quote:

At least 10 women say phony French TV reporter Hugues-Denver Akassy is a sexual predator

BY Melissa Grace and Alison Gendar
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITERS

Friday, August 6th 2010, 4:00 AM

At least 10 women have come forward to say a phony French TV reporter is a sexual predator who molested or harassed them, sources told the Daily News.

Hugues-Denver Akassy, a smooth-talking con artist accused of raping a Moscow tourist on a Riverside Park date, will face additional charges, law enforcement sources said.

"Women are calling every day, saying he stalked or harassed or in several other cases, attacked them," a source said. "This was his real profession - harassing women."

Aside from the tourist, 10 to 12 women have told cops Akassy tormented them in some way.

At least four are expected to testify before a Manhattan grand jury, sources said. While some say they were stalked, one woman says she was raped, sources said.

One of the women includes an assistant prosecutor, but details of that attack were not disclosed.

Akassy claims the sex he had with the Russian tourist was consensual, and he will testify before the grand jury Monday, said his lawyer, Howard Simmons.

Simmons said he had not been told of any new allegations against his client.

The 43-year-old Russian tourist told investigators she met a flirtatious Akassy at the Time Warner Center two days before the July 27 attack during a picnic near the Boat Basin.

The same day he met the tourist, he was busted for criminal trespass when he was caught on a fire escape, allegedly trying to peep into the bathroom window of a woman on W. 75th St.

He was charged with aggravated harassment in March 2009 after he chased after a 33-year-old woman who wanted nothing to do with him.

And he was banned from the New York Sports Club for abusive screaming matches inside.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_crime/2010/08/06/2010-08-06_more_accuse_fake_reporter_of_being_sex_predator.html
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 07:37 pm
Still more from today's news...Hopefully this one will rot in prison..

Quote:

South End man faces life in prison
August 6, 2010 03:52 PM
By Brian Ballou, Globe Staff

A former South End resident was sentenced today to 17 to 20 years in prison for raping two women in the Boston neighborhood more than 20 years ago.

Because he is already serving other sentences, he may never walk free again.

Michael Johnson, 41, was convicted Thursday in Suffolk Superior Court of raping the women in April and May of 1990.

He is already serving four sentences that will keep him in prison until 2039. After those sentences are completed, his sentence in the South End rapes would begin.

In addition to his 17-to-20 year sentence for aggravated rape, Johnson was sentenced today to a concurrent term of 15 to 20 years for rape, and to 7 years of probation after his release for assault with intent to rape.

Prosecutors said Johnson broke into a 23-year-old woman's apartment on Wellington Street on the morning of April 10, 1990 and raped her after binding her hands behind her back and covering her face with a towel.

He broke into a West Concord Street apartment on May 7 of that year at about 1 a.m., prosecutors also said, and held two women, ages 24 and 30, at knifepoint, raping one before the other woman struck him with a fireplace poker and he fled.

Johnson was convicted in another home invasion in 2003, and DNA from that case tied him to the earlier attacks, prosecutors said.

Travis Andersen of the Globe staff contributed to this report.
http://www.boston.com/news/local/breaking_news/2010/08/south_end_man_c.html
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 07:53 pm
Gee...an ohio sportscaster arrested for alleged rape. And the prosecuror says the alleged victim was too intoxicated to be able to give legal consent...another date rape scenario.



Terry Brooks, WEWS NewsChannel5 weekend sports anchor in Cleveland, was indicted Wednesday on charges of rape, attempted rape and kidnapping.

According to the Cuyahoga County Prosecutor's Office, a 21-year-old woman went to a sports bar with Brooks between Sept. 1 and Sept. 14, 2009.

"Instead of taking her home, Terry Brooks took her to his residence in South Euclid," said prosecutor Bill Mason. "He raped her and dropped her back off at Jack's Sports Bar to get her car."

Brooks, who is on a leave of absence from the station, told NewsChannel5 that he is innocent.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/08/06/terry-brooks-indicted-on_n_673281.html[/quote]
BillRM
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 08:13 pm
@firefly,
Firefly it seem clear you have no sons or any other young males of a dating/courting age who well being and future you care about in any manner.

The fact that you see nothing wrong with constructing a legal minefield to destroy young men lives almost at random if they happen to be unlucky enough to come into contact with any unstable females during this period of their lives are also interesting.

I am also in love with the image you had painted of an army of young men with eyes glaze over being prepare/train to rape women by way of video games.

Off hand, I would bet a large amount of money that Hawkeye is right and you are not now and likely never had been in an intimate relationship with any man.
BillRM
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 08:18 pm
@firefly,
I bet the females nuts are coming out of the woodworth after running the man picture in the paper and requesting them to do so.

Good thing that they did not run the pope picture also.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 08:24 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
Terry Brooks, WEWS NewsChannel5 weekend sports anchor in Cleveland, was indicted Wednesday on charges of rape, attempted rape and kidnapping.


Poor guy........................
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 08:25 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
I am also in love with the image you had painted of an army of young men with eyes glaze over being prepare/train to rape women by way of video games
do you remember all that hell raising about violent video games causing human violence? about how they should be outlawed and ended up being restricted for purchase (not that it has any effect because like with porn any kid who wants this stuff can get it) ? Do you know why we dont hear about that anymore? It is because the science does not support the assertion, in fact there are well regarded studies that show that allowing the getting the aggression out by way the the virtual actually creates a better environment for humans for exactly the same reason that sensible leaders have for all of history provided prostitutes for their armies.

This zero tolerance BS that Firefly flings around is actually the exact wrong thing to do. I would have thought between the science and all of the really bad personal experiences that most of us have had with zero tolerance policies during our life times that Firefly would not find so many buyers for her crap argument. Sad times.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 08:51 pm
Quote:

Men -----–Lower the Risk of Rape

Legal Consent IS:

• Valid, LEGAL consent is freely, mindfully, and actively given
• Uses mutually understandable words or actions
• Indicates a willingness to engage in mutually agreed upon sexual activity
(in other words, people agree to do the same thing, at the same time, in
the same way, with each other, and are not too intoxicated or drugged
to give consent).

Consent may be broad or narrow, and can be limited. Consent to one form of sexual activity does
not automatically imply consent to other forms of sexual activity.

Consent may be given verbally or non-verbally, based on an active, informed, mindful, freely decided
choice. A high level of intoxication (drug or alcohol) may make this legally impossible.

Consent means that you cannot make assumptions about what your partner does or does not want.

Absence of clear signals is a sign to stop. Without consent, a crime occurs!

Legal Consent IS NOT:

• Kissing. Going to dinner is not sexual consent. Dancing close is not
sexual consent. Blowing in ears is not sexual consent.
• Accepting a gift is not sexual consent. Grabbing an ass is not legal
consent.
• Passing out in your bed is not legal consent. Passing out on the floor is
not valid consent. First base is not a homer. Second base is not a homer.
Do you know the rules of the world? Can you spell F-E-L-O-N-Y?

DID YOU GET A YES??? No means no, but nothing also means no. Silence and passivity do not
equal permission. SUBMISSION DOES NOT EQUAL CONSENT!

If you receive a “no” and keep right on pressuring/continuing to interact sexually, your behavior is
considered to be a coercive influence on the other party.

To be valid, consent must be given BEFORE sexual activity. “After the fact” is not the time to
discuss boundaries. Communicate!

http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:w6GYylWbjs0J:www.k-state.edu/womenscenter/Violencework%2520Advocacy/Womens%2520Center%2520Materials/Materials/Men%2520Teach%2520your%2520friends.pdf+did+you+have+her+consent+for+sex&hl=en&gl=us&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESgOdh_tzR73XFDHA5UKOI2kwq7-wD9DwNUK-3z2GNqcCt3nU8LWb4eazk3zb0RSSpuRXshqruMmhC8xjX4LBzYt1Vzi5KTzUQSedgck89nxEM3SPhlxmbA3_1ZqMruavw7nJ-uU&sig=AHIEtbS2scUoj-W5__cOotQG8pdz9sm8tg



firefly
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 08:55 pm
Quote:


Manufacturing Consent – Is It Rape?

by Ben Atherton-Zeman--August 2006

How do you know when your partner has consented to sex? Do you ask, or do you assume they’ve consented if they don’t say anything? Do you watch for body language? Do you try to “make them relax” if it seems like they’re not consenting? Rather than seeking consent, you may be attempting to “manufacture” it.

When I was a college student, my primary goal was to “hook up.” I never saw myself as a “bad guy,” certainly not a rapist. However, in retrospect, I am ashamed and embarrassed by some of my behavior. I’m writing this partly to warn other young men – don’t do what I did!

Every two minutes in the United States, a man rapes a woman. According to Bureau of Justice statistics, in 2004 seven out of ten female rape or sexual assault victims knew the offender. But most rapes are not reported, and most rapists don’t consider what they’ve done to be rape. Often, sexual assault and rape prevention are seen as “women’s issues” – yet, if it’s our gender committing most sexual violence, it seems like it’s our gender’s responsibility to raise our voices until that violence stops.

Of course, anyone can be a victim or perpetrator of sexual violence. Some sexual assaults occur where men, especially boys and young men, are the victims. Lesbians can also be victims and perpetrators of rape, as can gay men, bisexuals, and transgender folks. But the vast majority of perpetrators are heterosexual men - as a man, I feel a responsibility to work to stop people who identify as men from perpetrating rape and sexual assault.

Most young men believe that sexual assault is wrong, but they define sexual assault as using physical force. While many reported sexual assaults involve physical force, most sexual assaults involve verbal or emotional force, manipulation or the threat of physical force. Many victim/survivors blame themselves for their own rape, and most may find reporting the assault more difficult in instances where no physical force was used.

Many in the rape prevention movement speak of a “rape culture.” I’d like to suggest some “C”s that I believe belong on the continuum of rape culture.

Constraint: Some victim/survivors are raped and assaulted with the use of force, the threat of force, weapons, etc. Some are forcibly drugged by so-called “date rape” drugs such as Rohypnol. Some are raped by a stranger, but most rape victims know their attacker. And most college males would never admit to committing such a rape.

Coercion: Some victim/survivors are coerced into having sex or being sexual. The guy cares about the person he’s with, but cares about the sex more. Her saying “No” is ignored – he continues to ask and ask until her defenses crumble – she might even say, “Yes,” just to get it over with. Her “consent” is therefore coerced and “manufactured” by him.

Convincing/cajoling: The guy wants the sex or the “fooling around” to be consensual, but edits out all her responses that don’t sound like consent. He manufactures her consent by giving her a massage, kissing her, putting his arm around her – all towards the goal of “getting her to relax” and agree to become sexual. She may “consent” in the end, but may regret it afterwards – having no outward “rape” to point to, she blames herself and dismisses her feelings that something was wrong about the whole situation.

Charm: Using playful humor even, her response of “no” is changed to a “yes” by his charm. Some of what we know as “romance” comes to play here – he buys her dinner, compliments her on how she looks, gives her alcohol or drugs which she freely accepts. She is attracted to him, and may want to kiss him initially – using this charm, he successfully increases her arousal until she agrees to have sex or be sexual.

But what’s wrong with a little charm? Many girls and women say they love being “swept off their feet.” Many even admit to saying “no,” when they are in fact playing a game – they want us (guys) to not take “no” for an answer, to continue to woo and charm them.

And what’s the worst that can happen if we assume someone’s playing a game, and we’re mistaken? Or vice versa?

What’s the worst that can happen if we’re mistaken? Well, if we take someone’s “no” seriously, the worst that can happen is that we won’t get to date this person. The worst that can happen if we assume she’s playing a game, and continue despite the “no,” is that we may have sexually assaulted someone. That’s not something I’m willing to live with.

Every rape can be prevented, and every rape victim suffers in ways the rest of us can only imagine. My colleagues and friends who are survivors tell me that any kind of forced or coerced sex causes damage. It is difficult for many survivors to trust anyone in any relationship afterwards. Some survivors suffer from post-traumatic stress disorder – you don’t get that from a night of bad sex, you get that from a traumatic event akin to having been in a war.

When I was in college, I never constrained anyone I wanted to be with. But, sadly, I did all four other things: I charmed, cajoled, convinced and even coerced occasionally. I cared about the women I was with, but I also cared about being with them sexually. I never would have fooled around with anyone without their consent, so where the consent wasn’t immediately present, I manufactured it as best I could.

Guys! Don’t make the same mistakes I did. These five “C”s are dangerous for you and damaging for the women and/or men you’re with. Choose instead some other “C”s:

Communication: Find out what your partner’s desires, preferences, moods are. You can be romantic and sexy while also being communicative. Learn her/his bodily responses – when is s/he turned on? Turned off? Tense? Check out your assumptions.

Consent: If you’ve been kissing and you want to fool around, ask if it’s okay. If you’ve been fooling around and you want to have sex, ask if it’s okay. Better still, make the decision together as a couple, “should we?” Watch for body language, tensing up, closing eyes, etc.

Choice: Even young men sometimes choose not to have sex! It’s important that we check in with ourselves, our desires, and not simply go for sex when what we might want is intimacy, closeness, or nothing at all. And, of course, respect our partner’s choice to do the same.

In 1988, noted linguist and activist Noam Chomsky authored the book, “Manufacturing Consent,” about the mass media’s ability to manipulate the public’s response to an authoritarian government. As the fall college semester approaches, many young men will seek to “manufacture consent” when they return to campus. I urge you to resist this impulse to put physical gratification over morality, over responsibility, over accountability. Sexual assault is about power and control – we may not intend to exert that power, but the effect is that we do exert it.

Guys – we may not have ever committed a sexual assault, but respectful behavior on our parts will help create a climate where true communication becomes the norm in relationships. This will certainly reduce the harm done to women and men on our campuses, and in our communities. And we’ll be better men – better people - because of it.

Ben Atherton-Zeman lives in Acton, MA with his amazing wife Lucinda. He performs a one-man play, “Voices of Men,” www.voicesofmen.org. Ben can be reached at [email protected].

Anyone who thinks they may have been sexually assaulted can call the Rape, Abuse and Incest National Network hotline: 1-800-656-HOPE
http://www.nomas.org/node/150.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 09:06 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
Men -----–Lower the Risk of Rape

Legal Consent IS:


I am so very happy I do not need to put up with this level of bullshit and so sad for the young men who do.

Poor poor young men.........................

I need to picked up some flowers for my wife to let her know how graceful I am to her that she is my shield from the sick anti-male society people like firefly are trying to build.
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Fri 6 Aug, 2010 09:12 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
Poor poor young men.........................
You dont mean to include the ones who like to have a mommy figure for a mate do you? I should think that they would be fine with being ordered around by their wife, and getting into huge trouble when they dont do what the boss tells them to do and fast.
 

Related Topics

 
Copyright © 2025 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.08 seconds on 04/27/2025 at 04:32:44