25
   

Hey, Can A Woman "Ask To Get Raped"?

 
 
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 02:07 pm
@mysteryman,
Quote:
There is really only one change I would like to see, and that is the "rape shield law"


One big chance in the law I would like to see is that the punishment for bringing knowing false charges of rape is as serous of a crime as rape itself.

Firefly had brushed this aside claiming as it not the woman who bring charges but the state that falsely charging rape should remain a minor misdeed.

By that logic it is not the gunman who did the murder it is the gun instead.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 02:23 pm
@mysteryman,
Quote:
Quote:
There is really only one change I would like to see, and that is the "rape shield law".
the change you will get is the same change that you have been getting, and ever increasing range of behaviors which are prosecuted as rape.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  0  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 05:58 pm
Quote:
Jameis Winston Case Just One Instance In Broader Climate of Rape and College Football
By Ty Duffy
November 21, 2013

Florida State quarterback Jameis Winston was accused of sexual battery. Recent reporting suggests the alleged victim dropped the allegations after inactivity and “big football town” pressure from the Tallahassee Police Dept. The story, if true, is disturbing. Though, it’s important to remember this is a drop in a much larger bucket with football. The only thing unusual is the man accused happens to be the Heisman front-runner.

Rape, of any sort, is under-reported. RAINN estimates there are 237,868 sexual assaults per year, with 60 percent going unreported. A new National Intimate Partner and Sexual Violence survey conducted by the CDC, using better questioning, estimates the true number per year to be around 1.27 million. Reasons are varied. A criminal process that begins with an invasive medical procedure, an investigative phase that forces a victim to relive her attack and a trial that may force her to defend her sexuality in public clearly plays a role.

Beyond being under-reported, rape is hard to prove beyond a reasonable doubt. The majority of cases involve a known assailant and no direct witnesses. The accused can claim the sex act was consensual. He said vs. she said may not lead to charges, let alone convictions. Even with direct evidence, the case is not a slam dunk. Using the more conservative RAINN figures, 97 percent of sexual assailants serve no jail time.

Prosecuting a rape is already delicate and torturous. Football amplifies that process. Prosecutors bring forward cases they can win. When the accused is a football player, the case becomes open to tremendous scrutiny, on a local or national level. Pro bono legal representation is not an amateurism violation. So football player X often ends up with aggressive, powerful defense attorney Y who happens to be an alum. Consciously or subconsciously, the balance gets tipped in favor of the athlete.

Football increases the burden on alleged victims as well. Stonewalling, inaction, character assassination, diminishing the crime itself and threatening texts after an alleged attack by a Notre Dame football player led Lizzy Seeberg to take her own life. Her experience reportedly led at least one Notre Dame student not to report an alleged rape by another player. This is not just a major college football problem. We saw a similar problems in high school football in Maryville, Missouri and Steubenville, Ohio. Looking at the statistics, we can presume the aforementioned cases and others at Missouri, Montana or Vanderbilt are mere iceberg tips.

The undercurrent of sexual assault, if the newer numbers are correct, has been unflagging, despite reductions in virtually every other type of violence, the advent of modern feminism and all forms of media attention. Football culture, at every level from high school onward, stops for nothing. Not rape. Not apparent long-term brain damage. Not even a player shooting his girlfriend, driving to the stadium parking lot and shooting himself in front of the team’s coach and general manager.

Where the two trends intersect something has broken. That’s before even getting into the broader cognitive dissonance about sexual assault that tolerates Mike Tyson and Kobe Bryant working the talk show circuit and Ben Roethlisberger’s name being read with anything but disgust.

Change is needed. Men reinforcing to other men that manliness is about more than scoring touchdowns and semen release may be a simple place to start.
http://thebiglead.com/2013/11/21/jameis-winston-case-just-one-instance-in-broader-climate-of-rape-and-college-football/
0 Replies
 
panzade
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 06:49 pm
Quote:
According to a 2011 Newsweek report, women are more likely to be assaulted by a fellow soldier than killed in combat. The Department of Defense estimates there are about 19,000 sexual assaults in the military per year but according to the latest Pentagon statistics (2013), only 1,108 troops filed for an investigation during the most recent yearly reporting period and during that period, only 575 cases were processed. Of the cases processed, only 96 went to court-martial


Wow! of 19,000 sexual assaults in the military only 96 went to court martial . .5%...and 56% of the assaults were on men.

Now that the powerful documentary The Invisible War has caught the attention of Congress they are drafting legislation to deal with this problem.
I'm not sure if I understand why there are two bills being drafted, and what the difference is in their approach.
Anybody?
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 06:58 pm
@panzade,
if you knew anything about the military you would know that court marshals are rare across the board. what you should look at are the number of substantiated cases where punishment was handed out. almost all cases are resolved before a court marshal is held, and the punishments lower than court marshal are very often career enders. rape a woman and end your career is a big deal, but your numbers ignore this reality.
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 07:05 pm
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
But many of those lawyers also share a sense — highlighted by a recent independent review of Navy legal requirements — that commanders are increasingly opting to dispose of cases at the lowest form of court-martial or through administrative means..
.
.
.

"What we're finding is a lot of commanders are using other methods to get people out of the military quicker," said Greg Rinckey, a former Army lawyer who frequently represents military clients. "It's a trend that seems to be continuing."

An adjunct professor of law at Georgetown University and military law expert put it more bluntly.

"Commanding officers just want their troublemakers gone! Now!" .
.
.
.
The Navy tried 252 cases at general court-martial in fiscal 2000, a figure that fell to 108 in fiscal 2010. A total of 755 cases were tried at special court-martial in fiscal 2000, a number that plummeted last fiscal year to 127.

http://www.navytimes.com/article/20110611/NEWS/106110307/Navy-sees-steady-decline-in-courts-martial
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 07:22 pm
@panzade,
so here is the test for for you panzade, do you feel manipulated by BS arguments or are you going to stick with your rape feminist talking points?

your reputation holds in the balance.
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 10:20 pm
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
if you knew anything about the military you would know that court marshals are rare across the board.


Duuuuhhh. The US military, being one of the grand criminal organizations on the planet, operates just like, well, one of the grand criminal organizations on the planet.

Quote:
almost all cases are resolved before a court marshal is held, and the punishments lower than court marshal are very often career enders. rape a woman and end your career is a big deal,


Gee, "career enders". Now that's the rule of law operating in one of the grand criminal organizations on the planet.
0 Replies
 
panzade
 
  2  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 10:45 pm
@hawkeye10,
Don't get so dramatic hawk...this is just a forum for posting our views.My reputation here solely consists of reading others opinions and replying if I agree...or...if I disagree.
It's not rocket surgery.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 10:48 pm
@panzade,
Quote:
My reputation here solely consists of reading others opinions and replying if I agree...or...if I disagree.
bullshit. it depends on how closely your opinions correspond with reality.

hint: you are not doing well in this thread.
0 Replies
 
panzade
 
  2  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 11:10 pm
@hawkeye10,
If you'd been following the news you'd have realized that the military has a big problem with rape and that Congress as a representative of the people has had a belly-full.
Army Chief of Staff Gen Raymond Odierno's face reflects the fact that he's just been bitch-slapped by Sen Kirsten Gillibrand, his boss.
http://www.propublica.org/images/ngen/gypsy_big_image/MSThearing_getty630x420.jpg

Here's five ways our armed forces can discourage the act of rape according to Congress

1.Stop giving military commanders the final say on rape convictions.
Under the military’s criminal procedures, commanders have clemency powers, which means they can dismiss military court convictions “for any reason or no reason. The fox guarding the hen house
2. Have lawyers determine which assault cases are credible — not the defendant’s boss
Quote:
Commanders have an incentive to ignore rape allegations, advocates of the change say, because it reflects poorly on their leadership.


3. Make sure a sex crime conviction means losing your job.
Ever heard of dishonorable discharge hawk?

4. Scrutinize officers appointed to prevent sexual assault
Quote:
In the past month, there have been not one but two instances of soldiers working in Sexual Assault Prevention and Response offices charged with sexual assault. The chief of the Air Force’s prevention office was arrested last month for groping a woman. A week later, an Army sergeant working as a sexual assault program coordinator was arrested on multiple accusations of sexual abuse and for running a prostitution ring.


5. Make it easier for sexual assault victims to access disability benefits
Quote:
While the Senate was hearing testimonies by military officials, the House unanimously passed legislation to increase access to disability benefits for sexual assault victims in the military. Veterans battling military sexual trauma face a higher burden of proof than those with post-traumatic stress disorder, or PTSD. And because most sexual assaults go unreported, there is often little evidence available. Under the proposed law, veterans would only have to show they were diagnosed with a mental health condition that stems from military sexual assault.


These aren't talking points hawk, they're talking changes coming to your military base...real soon.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 11:20 pm
@panzade,
Quote:
Army Chief of Staff Gen Raymond Odierno's face reflects the fact that he's just been bitch-slapped by Sen Kirsten Gillibrand, his boss.


you are very confused my friend

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/61/US_National_Command.png/464px-US_National_Command.png
0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  2  
Reply Mon 25 Nov, 2013 07:18 pm
The oz military is going through a major purge at the moment - trying once and for all to remove the cultural elements that foster sexual abuse (or at least prevent if from being prosecuted)
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/26/defence-taskforce-investigates-senior-officers-abuse
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Nov, 2013 07:49 pm
@hingehead,
hingehead wrote:

The oz military is going through a major purge at the moment - trying once and for all to remove the cultural elements that foster sexual abuse (or at least prevent if from being prosecuted)
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/26/defence-taskforce-investigates-senior-officers-abuse
this will work fine so long as the force is not needed for military operations. the alternative looks like the breakdown of the Dutch military at Srebrenica.

we all have to pick our priorities.
hingehead
 
  2  
Reply Mon 25 Nov, 2013 10:29 pm
@hawkeye10,
Am I off the planet or are you suggesting that soldiers must sexually assault female soldiers to be an effective military force?
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Sat 7 Dec, 2013 04:26 pm
@hingehead,
hingehead wrote:

Am I off the planet or are you suggesting that soldiers must sexually assault female soldiers to be an effective military force?
soldiers must be aggressive to be effective war fighters. We found out ourselves the cost of zero tolerance when after the cold war we shrunk our military in part by having a zero tolerance policy for unwanted extracurricular activities of our officers, as well as other BS like not being great at paperwork. After 9/11 we learned the hard way that a lot of the officer corps were pretty lousy war fighters. Mistakes made during the 90's in shaping the military go far to explaining our military incompetence post 9/11.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Sat 7 Dec, 2013 04:28 pm
Quote:
One thing is clear: It is uncommon for victims to make false accusations of sexual assault. Yes, it happens, causing terrible damage for men who are falsely accused. But the evidence suggests that the vast majority of the time, women who go to the police about rape are telling the truth.

http://www.slate.com/articles/sports/jurisprudence/2013/12/jameis_winston_sexual_assault_how_did_the_florida_state_quarterback_evade.html

which means

Quote:
One thing is clear: It is uncommon for victims to make false accusations of sexual assault. Yes, it happens, causing terrible damage for men who are falsely accused. But the evidence suggests that far more than 50% of the time, women who go to the police about rape are telling the truth.


What we have here is another Firefly, user of words to deceive.
0 Replies
 
panzade
 
  1  
Reply Sat 7 Dec, 2013 05:11 pm
Quote:
Florida State quarterback Jameis Winston will NOT be charged with a crime stemming from allegations he raped an FSU student back in 2012.

The announcement was just made by State Attorney Willie Meggs, who said, "No charges will be filed against anyone in this case."

Meggs said there were "several people in the room" when the incident happened.

Meggs said there was a 2ND MAN'S DNA discovered ... insinuating the accuser slept with another person around the time she had sex with Jameis. Meggs said the 2nd man's DNA belonged to an unidentified person.

Meggs says Jameis' DNA was on the accuser's underwear ... and the 2nd person's DNA was on her shorts. He also said there were no outward signs of trauma.

Meggs said the timing of the case was NOT driven by the FSU football schedule.

Meggs said the case would've gone a lot better if "we all would have gotten involved earlier."

Meggs said the accuser's blood alcohol level was .04 at the time it was taken ... which Meggs described as "not very high."

Meggs says ... the State Attorney will NOT investigate the Tallahassee PD ... though he did admit things might had gone differently had they known about the case earlier.

He also criticized the police for not interviewing more witnesses in the aftermath of the incident.

Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2013/12/05/jameis-winston-no-charges-rape-case/#ixzz2mpkKsAek



Meggs is well-thought-of in Florida and perhaps justice has been served...FF, what do you think?
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Sat 7 Dec, 2013 05:15 pm
@panzade,
this case goes back to the old axiom that one cant rape a slut. no jury was going to bite on this, not prosecuting is a no brainer.
panzade
 
  6  
Reply Sun 8 Dec, 2013 11:19 am
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
the old axiom that one cant rape a slut.

I'm appalled.
463 pages and almost 10,000 replies and you truly don't get it.
 

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