@BillRM,
Okay, you have now exposed yourself as a complete liar on the only subject you have been harping about throughout this thread.
You have been making things up, for the purpose of vilifying women, and derailing the focus of the thread from victims of rape, and you cannot supply a single case of even one man who has served 10 years on a rape conviction that was obtained solely on the basis of a deliberate false accusation by a woman.
You claim you know of a case where a man served 7 years, and his conviction was based only on a deliberately false accusation by a woman--no bad police work, no coerced confession, no misidentification, no other evidence to support rape, just her false accusation--and you further claim that the woman received no punishment for her crime
of perjury. Put up or shut up. Post that case to back up your claim that such things occur. If you can't do that, you continue to expose yourself as a liar who is simplying fabricating things in order to perpetuate a myth that women often lie about being raped, and that innocent men are jailed for years and years and years because of those lies. Post that case, about the man incarcerated for 7 years, soley on the basis of a deliberate false accusation, or shut up about the topic of false allegations once and for all.
No, the Duke University lacrosse players were not as harmed "as most rape victims". To even make such a comparison clearly shows you do not understand the physical, emotional, and psychological impact of rape on the victim. They suffered damage to their reputations, and considerable stress while they were being investigated for rape charges, but those things were temporary because they were exonerated--which means their names were cleared and that was made widely public, so no stigma hangs over their heads. The damage to the rape victim is not temporary, it lasts a lifetime--as you have heard directly from the women posting in this thread who have been the victims of rape.
In addition, the real damage to the Duke players was not done by the woman who accused them, it was done by the police department and an unethical D.A. who deliberately withheld evidence that would have exonerated them. The D.A. was disbarred for his actions. The woman made a claim of rape, but there was apparently a repeated mis-identification from a photo lineup--she did not deliberately name particular men. So, stop blaming the woman for everything that happened to these young men--they were really victimized by the actions of other men in the law enforcement and justice systems. Which is why they brought civil lawsuits against the police department and the county--but not against the woman who accused them.
In fact, the three men charged, Evans , Finnerty and Seligmann asked that she not be pursued criminally because, "We felt sorry for her, and we felt to some degree, she had been victimized by the process."(http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/3421612/)
Let's also look at the sexist (and possibly racist) attitudes that existed among athletes at Duke, including members of that lacrosse team, as well as a history of criminal activities by some members of the team.
Quote:
U.S. .DURHAM, N.C., April 6, 2006
E-Mail Shocker In Duke Lacrosse Case
Now-Suspended Player Allegedly Wrote Of Wanting To Kill Strippers
(CBS/AP)
A lacrosse player's e-mail rant about killing strippers and cutting their skin off in his Duke University dorm room has started a chain reaction resulting in his coach's resignation, the season's cancellation and an internal probe into the university's response to alleged violence by athletes.
Wednesday's cascade of events was the latest fallout from allegations that three players on the lacrosse team raped an exotic dancer at an off-campus party on March 13. The players were white and the stripper was a black student at a nearby state college. ..
Professor Houston Baker, who teaches English at the university, called for changes at the very top of the school administration.
"There's a kind of macho, cock-of-the-walk, boys culture that is characterizing this administration now and I hope there will be purges in the administration as there have been voluntarily, we're told, in the sports dept with the resignation of the lacrosse coach," he told Regan...
No charges have been filed in the case, but sophomore Ryan McFadyen, 19, of Mendham, N.J., the player who wrote the e-mail, has been suspended. The school’s president has called the e-mail "sickening" and "repulsive."..
On Wednesday, authorities unsealed documents from a search warrant for McFadyen's residence, stating that less than two hours after the alleged rape, McFadyen sent an e-mail saying he was planning an encore to "tonights (sic) show." The message, addressed "To whom it may concern," said, "however there will be no nudity."
"I plan on killing the bitches as soon as the(y) walk in and proceeding to cut their skin off," wrote McFadyen, a 6-foot-6, 225-pound Atlantic Coast Conference honor roll player who was one of five Duke players from the exclusive Delbarton School in Morristown, N.J., adding in vulgar terms that he would find the act sexually satisfying. The e-mail was signed with McFadyen's jersey number, 41....
However, McFadyen's name does not match the three names the woman gave to police as those of her attackers...
N.C. Central Chancellor James Ammons called the e-mail "very disturbing" and encouraged students to remain calm...
Brodhead said McFadyen is the only player suspended so far, and that he was removed from campus...
The (Raleigh) News & Observer reports that during the past three years, 15 players had criminal charges brought against them, and that most of those charges were resolved in deals with prosecutors that allowed the players to escape criminal convictions...
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/04/05/national/main1476021.shtml?tag=contentMain;contentBody
We are not talking about a group of innocent choir boys. These men were part of a macho sexist culture at Duke with very disturbing attitudes toward women, and a strong sense of entitlement based on their athletic accomplishments. That is a perfect atmosphere for actual rape to occur. And other actual, unreported rapes may well have occured on that campus. They might or might not have raped that woman, but how do you think they treated her? Then again, that woman had ingested drugs and alcohol that night, and her degree of impairment might have met the legal standard for rape--but that aspect of the case is never mentioned. This woman had a long history of psychological problems and had been treated for bi-polar disorder with anti-psychotic medications. She may well have been sexually abused that night--she was certainly the victim of racial slurs at that party. And, she has not admitted to lying about the fact that she was sexually assaulted, so there is no evidence that this was ever a case of a deliberate, false allegation of rape. Because there was not enough credible evidence to bring this particular case, against those three men, to trial, does not mean that this woman was not raped that night, possibly by other men.
Quote:l Mangum, who appeared publicly Thursday for the first time since making the allegations more than two years ago, says in her forthcoming book she is not “looking forward to opening old wounds” but that she had to defend herself.
“Even as I try to move on with my life, I still find it necessary to take one more stand and fight,” she writes in the book, “The Last Dance for Grace: The Crystal Mangum Story.”
“I want to assert, without equivocation, that I was assaulted. Make of that what you will. You will decide what that means to you because the state of North Carolina saw fit not to look at all that happened the night I became infamous.”
Mangum told police that she was attacked at a March 2006 lacrosse team party where she was hired to perform as a stripper. After a disastrous local prosecution that eventually led to downfall of the district attorney, the
state attorney general’s office concluded there was no credible evidence an attack ever occurred.http://newsone.com/nation/associated-press/duke-lacrosse-accuser-maintains-she-was-assaulted/
Quote:
The New York Times
March 25, 2007
Sports of The Times
Closing a Case Will Not Mean Closure at Duke
By SELENA ROBERTS
"What happens if all the charges are dismissed? There is a tendency to conflate the alleged crime at the Duke lacrosse team kegger on March 13, 2006, with the irrefutable culture of misogyny, racial animus and athlete entitlement that went unrestrained that night.
"Porn-style photos of two exotic dancers -- one of whom was the accuser -- emerged from cellphone camera downloads. Heated exchanges between players and dancers occurred. Racial slurs were heard. And in an 'American Psycho' reference, a repulsive e-mail message depicting the skinning of strippers was sent by a player, Ryan McFadyen, who, to his credit, has since apologized."...
Some readers argue no one would have known about the lacrosse team’s misogyny bash last year if not for the initial rape charges by the hired dancer. True, but that’s how we often discover what goes on behind the curtains: by a botched break-in, through a door left ajar...
http://select.nytimes.com/2007/03/25/sports/othersports/25roberts.html?_r=1
So, it was never proven that the woman in the Duke case deliberately lied--about anything. Her story was inconsistent, she repeatedly misidentified people in a photo lineup, all of which might be due to the fact she had consumed prescription drugs and alcohol before that party, but it does not mean she was not sexually assaulted that night. It does mean she was a poor informant to base a rape case on, and the police and D.A. should have considered that before they made a hasty decision to charge three young men this woman had never specifically and consistently named as her attackers.
You have milked this Duke case repeatedly. It's time you took a good look at all the facts in this case, and not just the few issues you have selected, and distorted, in order to make your case about deliberate false accusations. These three young men were victimized by law enforcement and a crooked D.A., and not by this women. They did not want her punished--they saw her as a victim in this saga. If they didn't want her punished, why the hell have you been harping about it?
So, don't bother bringing up the Duke case again. It supports no points you are trying to make. This woman did not deliberately make a false rape charge--she believes she was sexaully assaulted that night.
And put up or shut up. Post the case of that man who served 7 years on a rape conviction, where the woman eventually recanted her testimony, admitted she lied about being raped, yet escaped any punishment for her crime of perjury. Post that case to back up your claim that such things occur. If you can't do that, you continue to expose yourself as a liar who is simplying fabricating things in order to perpetuate a myth that women often lie about being raped, and that innocent men are jailed for years and years and years because of those lies. Post that case, about the man incarcerated for 7 years, soley on the basis of a deliberate false accusation, or shut up about the topic of false allegations once and for all.
He can't make up his mind about which lie to stick with.
