meaning is God.

@Ola,

Ola wrote:

There is only meaning if there is a God.
Philosophers and scientists have no answer to the meaning of life.
But if there is one (God) he/she/it does know.
And therefore just the possibility of a God outweighs anything humans can come up with. (You are at a junction. You can take a road that goes nowhere or an unknown one. The logical choice is the unknown road.)

But who knows what God (is)?

The meaning of life can be really boring mundane stuff or can be what ever you like it to be, without bounds. God has no purpose for me that you can describe that suits my reasoning..so the scales are balanced to man as far as im concerned..

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@Ola,

Meaning is being to us... Our lives are the totality of our meaning... So that does not mean that God could not be meaning... and being, or that being could not have been shared with us...It is just, that for us, there is no difference between meaning and being... We don't get being directly we can only see what seems to have some meaning... We don't have any way to tell our mean from the meaning of God... We might find greater meaning in our lives than in the life of God, and we might even find meaning in God when God has no being... We can give meaning to ideas without any substance to them what ever, so it is possible that God is only imaginary...

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@Ola,

Why does there have to be a meaning?
Why are those that feel that they need meaning?

Why does there need to be a God?
Why can't there be many Gods?

There is nothing that has ever been said by any of the Gods that Men did not say first.

Men create Gods. Gods do not create men.

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@gre107,

Good questions...

... what I'm curious about is what has ones' belief in god anything to do with finding 'meaning'. Aren't we still left with that same question; each to find for themselves?

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@Ola,

Ola wrote:

Philosophers and scientists have no answer to the meaning of life.

A definite answer? No. No answer? Of course not! Take one of the first examples, Aristotle. His idea of a meaning, the purpose of life, was to achieve eudaimonia, the happiness achieved through virtue and learning, reached through reasoning with moral situations. There's probably a million more, I just don't know them.

1 Reply

@Ola,

Ola wrote:

But who knows what God (is)?

Hello Ola. Not to be brash. I do. You want to know who God is? You are. Just a very tiny piece. How's that grab you? Smile

William

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@Kolbe,

Quote:

Why does there have to be a meaning?

As a philosopher I can't wrap my brain around that question.

Kolbe wrote:

A definite answer? No. No answer? Of course not! Take one of the first examples, Aristotle. His idea of a meaning, the purpose of life, was to achieve eudaimonia, the happiness achieved through virtue and learning, reached through reasoning with moral situations. There's probably a million more, I just don't know them.

Well, a definite answer was what I meant.
Sounds like Aristotles purpose of life, eudaimonia, isn't a truth/fact but a subjectiv opinion. There is however this: If the meaning of life is unknown - then the search for the meaning of life becomes the meaning of life.
(Till the answer is found. One should therefore be aware of one's limits (denial, social conditioning) and constructively question oneself and learn to listen to others. Anyone might have the answer.(!))

William wrote:

Hello Ola. Not to be brash. I do. You want to know who God is? You are. Just a very tiny piece. How's that grab you?

William

lol
Grabs my funny bone. Smile

Think there is someting in the bible about that. :whistling:

1 Reply

@gre107,

Sorry to interject here, but this really caught my eye:

gre107 wrote:

Why does there have to be a meaning?

Ola wrote:
As a philosopher I can't wrap my brain around that question.

One should, particularly as a philosopher, don't you think? Before you try and decide what to eat, don't you need to first decide if you're hungry at all?

I think the answer to the basic question of "What is this meaning and why do I need it?" is fundamental to the ability to answer the second question. We toss 'meaning' around a lot, but I fear its definition amongst us is disparate. Is this 'worth'? Is it 'purpose'? Meaning has to do with definition or 'what it is'?

So the basics, defined and understood by the individual, must first needs be established before we embark on the next logical step, don't you think? If so, the question stands as valid.

Hope this helps

1 Reply

@Ola,

Ola wrote:

As a philosopher I can't wrap my brain around that question.

How insane??? A wrap-able Brain??? You must be vain!!!!

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@Khethil,

Khethil wrote:

Sorry to interject here, but this really caught my eye:

One should, particularly as a philosopher, don't you think? Before you try and decide what to eat, don't you need to first decide if you're hungry at all?

I think the answer to the basic question of "What is this meaning and why do I need it?" is fundamental to the ability to answer the second question. We toss 'meaning' around a lot, but I fear its definition amongst us is disparate. Is this 'worth'? Is it 'purpose'? Meaning has to do with definition or 'what it is'?

So the basics, defined and understood by the individual, must first needs be established before we embark on the next logical step, don't you think? If so, the question stands as valid.

Hope this helps

What is meaning, and why you need it is simple...Meaning is being...Life is all meaning... We do not get life, being, directly... We see this or that is, and we say he or she lives, but we can no more understand what that is than we can grasp the crystal structure of metal by holding a coin... We Get so much of meaning when we get something...Our concepts are not the thing, but the meaning of the thing as we can get it... But meaning is no different for us than it is to all that exists outside of our lives... We see ourselves has having a certain meaning, which is a value...We do, we are, we stand for something, and represent something, we are to ourselves the highest value, perhaps the only value, usually so... Like our lives, which cannot be defined, we have so much of our reality that is built solely of meaning... What is Justice???What is Liberty??? What is Virtue, Art, Vice, God, or Love??? We have as essentials in our lives so many meanings without any specific being, so it is easy enough to confuse being with meaning since we see so much as real only on the basis of meaning...Perhaps such confusion is inevitable...Maybe we want God to be real, and justice too, and if we can make them real by sharing our meaning with them then our lives are richer to some degree if less rational...In any event, being is meaning... We are what we signify...

1 Reply

@Fido,

Nice, Fido... I'm not sure I'd disagree with much there at all.

But I still think there's a differentiation to be made; a differentiation that's necessary. This isn't semantics, it strikes to the core of the question. And yes, life, itself, has meaning. But what is this? Surely they're not completely-synonymous (within the construct of philosophical inquiry):[INDENT]

I peer over the martian landscape and cry, "We've discovered meaning on Mars!"
Over human history, we've asked ourselves, "What is the meaning of meaning?"
At what point, in fetal development, does meaning begin?
Spot lies run over on the road; the SUV speeds off, he now has no meaning

[/INDENT]So no, although contextually there are certain overlapping themes, when we ask "What is the meaning of life?" we're not asking "What is the meaning of meaning?". So, while I share the general sentiment, I think for the question "What is my meaning - what is the meaning of life?" to have any worth, we can't treat them as completely synonymous.

And if there is, indeed, this differenciation (on any level, at any point and within any context), then what is "meaning" within this question?

That is what I think needs examination; individualized, perhaps, but a basic construct established before the larger question can be employed.

Thanks

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@Ola,

Mars has meaning to the extent that it has an effect on human life; no more and no less...
Asking the meaning of meaning is like saying one of one, or as the Rands roids say: existence exists... Nothing can be defined as itself, or by itself except perhaps nothing, which has only the meaning we give it..How wet is water and what is movement if everything is moving???
Meaning in fetuses does not begin... We are not created equal...That is some metaphysical garbage... We have life... What is life...Who cares since it is all, and the only way we can say we ever had it is to give it...
I knew spot... I let him smell my butt before I smelled his... Spot was a good doggy, because all dogs are good...We have no choice in the matter...It is our nature... But Spot was loved, and he will be missed; and as long as people live who loved Spot, Spot will have meaning...

1 Reply

@Fido,

Depending on your understanding of the word, either there is no such thing as meaning, or life is meaning. I prefer the latter.

1 Reply

@BrightNoon,

BrightNoon wrote:

Depending on your understanding of the word, either there is no such thing as meaning, or life is meaning. I prefer the latter.

Perhaps I'm thinking about this cockeyed. I make a differentiation between the words as having perhaps overlapping themes and/or disparate definitions, depending on context.I see what you're saying, but I get wrapped around the axle on it, I'll have to admit.

I understand quite clearly the statement "Life gives meaning to itself" and happen to agree, but I take that to say: Life is its own value. But I still get the distinct impression folks mix up purpose and meaning; two overlapping themes - to be sure - but wherein the potential for murkiness and miscommunication abound when they're used synonymously.

It's like the posts I see like this:[INDENT]"All is One! One is All! You are All, One... stuff! Yada, even!"
[/INDENT]My mind says, "huh?" and I fall to the ground in a mass of mental agony from endless circular logic. Hehe... Help me understand this: Either there is no meaning at all or Life is meaning -thing.

Thanks

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@Khethil,

Khethil wrote:

Perhaps I'm thinking about this cockeyed. I make a differentiation between the words as having perhaps overlapping themes and/or disparate definitions, depending on context.I see what you're saying, but I get wrapped around the axle on it, I'll have to admit.

I understand quite clearly the statement "Life gives meaning to itself" and happen to agree, but I take that to say: Life is its own value. But I still get the distinct impression folks mix up purpose and meaning; two overlapping themes - to be sure - but wherein the potential for murkiness and miscommunication abound when they're used synonymously.

It's like the posts I see like this:
[INDENT]"All is One! One is All! You are All, One... stuff! Yada, even!"
[/INDENT]My mind says, "huh?" and I fall to the ground in a mass of mental agony from endless circular logic. Hehe... Help me understand this: Either there is no meaning at all or Life is meaning -thing.

Thanks

Life is the value of all values..Life is the meaning of all meaning...Its enough to say, as Schopenhaur that: the world is my idea, or when I die, the world dies with me...We try to see meaning beyond our lives, and the spiritual conception of self helps with this, but it cannot at all be justified...We are sharing our life's meaning with time beyond our life...We are projecting meaning in the same sense that we do for moral concepts like justice, virtue, or love....What is their meaning to you, or their value??? What is the meaning you give to them??? Love your life...It is all you have of meaning, and sans life, sans everything...

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@Khethil,

Khethil wrote:

Perhaps I'm thinking about this cockeyed. I make a differentiation between the words as having perhaps overlapping themes and/or disparate definitions, depending on context.I see what you're saying, but I get wrapped around the axle on it, I'll have to admit.

I understand quite clearly the statement "Life gives meaning to itself" and happen to agree, but I take that to say: Life is its own value. But I still get the distinct impression folks mix up purpose and meaning; two overlapping themes - to be sure - but wherein the potential for murkiness and miscommunication abound when they're used synonymously.

It's like the posts I see like this:
[INDENT]"All is One! One is All! You are All, One... stuff! Yada, even!"
[/INDENT]My mind says, "huh?" and I fall to the ground in a mass of mental agony from endless circular logic. Hehe... Help me understand this: Either there is no meaning at all or Life is meaning -thing.

Thanks

Gladly. In the first instance, we understand 'meaning' as some external justification or value, which is nonexistant: e.g. life justified as a preparation for afterlife. In the second, as you said, meaning is always per se, whatever se happens to be: e.g. the meaning of an apple is its apple-ness.

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@Ola,

I have to disagree...Meaning is value and value is relative...If we find more meaning in an apple than a rock, it is because we find more value in the apple...If the rock is a diamond, and we are starving; then...Only our own lives will seem as an absolute even when absolutly worthless to us... As some times happens, that we have no value in a being without meaning...

1 Reply

@Fido,

Thanks guys,

I think I get where you're coming from; and if i understand it correctly, I'd agree. I think my head's getting locked on my perception of the word 'meaning'; that it defines (as in provides a substantive description) -or- describes value (as in what it's worth). It looks as if the context in which we're talking takes elements from both, speaking more to value (if that's a fair judgment).

Thank you

1 Reply

@Khethil,

i think its human nature to have meaning in something. our brains are attuned to locate things that have some purpose for us, and everything else is just background. humans need a reason to do something (like continue living) otherwise why do it?

also, i wonder, if meaning is God, does God have meaning? does God know why God exists?

1 Reply

meaning is God.

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