The Confederacy was About Slavery

@InfraBlue,

"What if's" are games that doesn't accomplish much concerning the Confederacy and slavery: It's past history.
What's more important is to look at current issues of discrimination - especially about Trump's statements about Muslims and Mexicans.

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@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

What's more important is to look at current issues of discrimination - especially about Trump's statements about Muslims and Mexicans.

Those too are past history. You guys always want to quickly forget the voluminous evil history and pump up the limited quantity of good stuff.

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@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

Quote:
what if the north suddenly decided to be comfortable with a slave south, and each new territory would become slave or free, each taking its turn. Would there still have been a civil war?
I suggest that you read more deeply about the various "compromises" that preceded the Civil war. Three of the Union States were still slave states, did you know that??.
The articles of secession of most of the states clearly spelled out that their "unique culture of slavery" was a central issue to their leaving the Union . Of course their were other issues mentioned but none rang out as clearly as slavery when you read the articles of the several states.

You seem to want to mix it in a gumbo of ingredients , each no more important than the others. I think that most historians (that dont have their books under critical review, like Shelby Foote)agree that slavery was THE issue.

My intentions are to not put salt in ANY wounds; many southern whites will not just ignore that they had family in the antebellum south that participated in a part of U.S. history. The Civil War was a civil war, and Nazi Germany was an effort to colonize Europe and eliminate those that were not deemed worthy of being part of the Third Reich. Adding apples to oranges, so to speak. I guess I adopted a different kind of Americanism in my time in the military; we must learn to live with our alienation towards others, even if it seems justified, in my opinion. A tolerance for ambiguity. My opinion only.

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@Foofie,

what, do you think that we wish vengeaance on our SOuthern citizens because of the geography of their forbears?

Nazi Germany had a leader who, as part of his manifesto, blamed Jews for everything bad that hppened to Germany. So the analogy IS relevant.
Really, Theprinciple thing that separated The Confederacy form the third reich was 90 years

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@farmerman,

I agree there are parallels; not the least of which is the necessary suspension of human empathy that had to be in effect for a whole race of people.

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The most pernicious thing about the "Lost Cause" myth is the fact that contemporary white southerners find an opportunity to deny that the war was about slavery, and to claim that they are innocently celebrating their family's heritage.

As for that jackass Foofie/Miller, it's just a right-wing provocateur who's trying to yank people's chains. Ignore the troll, and don't feed it.

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@farmerman,

Quote:

Theprinciple thing that separated The Confederacy form the third reich was 90 years

Bullshit. Both north and south had been committing a century plus long genocide. That's you and your ancestors, farmer. You have continued it to today supporting war crimes, US genocides.

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@camlok,

We all wish we could be as pure as you JTT.

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The Civil War was certainly about slavery but it was not ONLY about slavery, slavery was one facet of it. The Civil War was largely about the dialectic between what was then called the American system of economics, espoused by George Washington, Hamilton, Friedrich List, Matthew Carey, Abraham Lincoln... and the mercantilistic and exploitative system which the British Empire was and still is intent upon foisting upon the world. Otto Von Bismarck, a huge fan of Abraham Lincoln's, claimed that the Rothschilds had not only created the conditions for the American Civil War, but were instrumental in the assassination of Lincoln as well.

I am not aware of any reason to view the people in charge of the Confederacy as anything other than a bunch of treasonous assholes, nor was there any glory attached to fighting or dying for such causes. Far as I'm concerned, they can break up all the Confederate statues they want.

The same evil forces, of course, are allied against Donald Trump at present.

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@glitterbag,

We all wish that the US was remotely close to the bullshit you were/have all been fed.

If that hadn't happened, if you actually had been told the truth, then you wouldn't need to reply with these childish, inane comments.

You could address it as an adult.

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@gungasnake,

If you read the Confederate Constitution you can very plainly see what the war was about. It's right there in black and white (no pun). The leaders got together and wrote out exactly what they believed and what kind of a world they envisioned.
It was about the supremacy of the white race (capitals purposely omitted), the subjugation of the black race, the elevation of Christianity to the status of official religion and the adoption of it's principals into national law.
The Confederate Constitution was an abomination, a pale perversion of the US Constitution born out of ignorance and fear.
Those that fly the Confederate flag today either support those principles or are ignorant of them and so fittingly carry on the "Rebel" heritage.

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@TomTomBinks,

There is a contradiction in that. Elevating Christianity to the status of state religion would ultimately have eliminated slavery as well as any mistreatment of blacks. Christianity cannot be used as a philosophical basis for racism. Evolutionism, of course, is very well suited for use as such a basis.

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@gungasnake,

What a joke. Are you really trying to pretend the Confederacy wasn't 'Christian'? That brand of Christianity is thriving today and they support Trump as a Jesus supporter. It's perverted, but that's the way they like it, those supporters of a bastardized Christianity.

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Important leaders of all the Christian denominations publicly spoke out in favor of slavery, and of the war. Leonidas Polk, the Archbishop for Louisiana of the Episcopal Church, was a commissioned officer in the Confederate States army, who rose to the rank of Lieutenant General, and who was killed in the fighting around Atlanta in 1864. Confederate politicians and military leaders frequently asserted the support of "the Almighty" on the basis of the evidence of military victories. Thomas "Stonewall" Jackson frequently used quasi-biblical language to account for his successes as "mercies" and "providences" of God.

Gunga Dim knows even less about history than he does about science, and he knows next to nothing about that. There are few things easier here, when dealing with right wing nut bags, than making Gunga Dim look like the dope that he is when it comes to history.

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@Setanta,

Besides the wording of the Constitution of the Confederacy, the Following was the "Bill of Rights". According to this document, being a "Negro Slave" was a poor career choice, even though the CSA "abolished" s;avery in their contitution, they wanted the Congress to first establish "phase out" laws..

check it out.

Quote:

Bill of Rights of the Confederate States of America
1st Amendment
The importation of negroes of the African race from any foreign country other than the slaveholding States or Territories of the United States of America, is hereby forbidden; and Congress is required to pass such laws as shall effectually prevent the same.

2nd Amendment
Congress shall also have power to prohibit the introduction of slaves from any State not a member of, or Territory not belonging to, this Confederacy.

3rd Amendment
The privilege of the writ of habeas corpus shall not be suspended, unless when in cases of rebellion or invasion the public safety may require it.

4th Amendment
No bill of attainder, ex post facto law, or law denying or impairing the right of property in negro slaves shall be passed.

5th Amendment
No capitation or other direct tax shall be laid, unless in proportion to the census or enumeration hereinbefore directed to be taken.

6th Amendment
No tax or duty shall be laid on articles exported from any State, except by a vote of two-thirds of both Houses.

7th Amendment
No preference shall be given by any regulation of commerce or revenue to the ports of one State over those of another.

8th Amendment
No money shall be drawn from the Treasury, but in consequence of appropriations made by law; and a regular statement and account of the receipts and expenditures of all public money shall be published from time to time.

9th Amendment
Congress shall appropriate no money from the Treasury except by a vote of two-thirds of both Houses, taken by yeas and nays, unless it be asked and estimated for by some one of the heads of departments and submitted to Congress by the President; or for the purpose of paying its own expenses and contingencies; or for the payment of claims against the Confederate States, the justice of which shall have been judicially declared by a tribunal for the investigation of claims against the Government, which it is hereby made the duty of Congress to establish.

10th Amendment
All bills appropriating money shall specify in Federal currency the exact amount of each appropriation and the purposes for which it is made; and Congress shall grant no extra compensation to any public contractor, officer, agent, or servant, after such contract shall have been made or such service rendered.

11th Amendment
No title of nobility shall be granted by the Confederate States; and no person holding any office of profit or trust under them shall, without the consent of the Congress, accept of any present, emolument, office, or title of any kind whatever, from any king, prince, or foreign state.

12th Amendment
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble and petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

13th Amendment
A well-regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

14th Amendment
No soldier shall, in time of peace, be quartered in any house without the consent of the owner; nor in time of war, but in a manner to be prescribed by law.

15th Amendment
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated; and no warrants shall issue but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched and the persons or things to be seized.

16th Amendment
No person shall be held to answer for a capital or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor be compelled, in any criminal case, to be a witness against himself; nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

17th Amendment
In all criminal prosecutions the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor; and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense.

18th Amendment
In suits at common law, where the value in controversy shall exceed twenty dollars, the right of trial by jury shall be preserved; and no fact so tried by a jury shall be otherwise reexamined in any court of the Confederacy, than according to the rules of common law.

19th Amendment
Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.

20th Amendment
Every law, or resolution having the force of law, shall relate to but one subject, and that shall be expressed in the title.

21st Amendment
Slavery is hereby abolished in the Confederate States.

Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.

22nd Amendment
The right of citizens of the Confederate States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the Confederate States or by any State on account of race, color, or previous condition of servitude.

The right of citizens of the Confederate States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the Confederate States or by any State on account of sex.

Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.

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@gungasnake,

They would have and do use another abominable document to justify it, the Bible. The "with like kind" language in the Old Testament is used to deny the humanity of people with different colored skin.

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@glitterbag,

glitterbag wrote:

What a joke. Are you really trying to pretend the Confederacy wasn't 'Christian'? That brand of Christianity is thriving today and they support Trump as a Jesus supporter. It's perverted, but that's the way they like it, those supporters of a bastardized Christianity.

That's probably the least deranged load of bollocks Gunga believes. This is the lunatic who believes in pyramids on Mars, Peruvians riding around on dinosaurs, an Earth that's a few thousand years old and global warming denial. Don't expect him to say anything that's not barking mad.

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@glitterbag,

glitterbag wrote:

We all wish we could be as pure as you JTT.

I don't feed that particular troll, but I get how his redundant batshit refrain makes you want to say something to shut him the hell up. I can't help but wonder... If everyone - everyone - all admitted we are lowdown rotten hypocrites, liars and cowards... would that do it for him?

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@snood,

It might if he was of sound mind, but furious-boy would just haul out another set of grievances.

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@snood,

thats the entire point. It will NEVER shut up even though it is ignored by 90+% of A2Kers. It is obsessed with something that may require heavy medication. In any case ,it lives in a world of conspiracy fantasies.
Ya have to pity it though, Lonely and creepy JTT.

1 Reply

The Confederacy was About Slavery

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