May I see your papers, citizen?

@Cycloptichorn,

Quote:

You 'think you'll be fine,' because you're not a Hispanic guy and down deep, you know what the score really is, don't you? Other people don't feel that way.

so long as the cruiser has a computer the cop can punch in my data and get confirmation that I am a citizen. The only thing he will not get is a current pic of me, because I am driving on a military deferred Drivers License and my pic is out of date. This claim that I would ever need to go to jail is ridiculous.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Yeah, it'd be crazy. I'm pretty upset with how all immigration is handled across the world. The USA is probably no better/worse than any European country. I think people should have the right to live in whatever country they choose, regardless of their country of birth.

I don't think it'd lead to the decline of America. Sure these people will come over here and they will be eligible for the same benefits that citizens get. I don't think that causes any problems. Once they get here, they will pay taxes and pay their own way. Even benefits like social security are based on how much money you put into the system, so an immigrant will receive less money because they put less money in.

I don't agree with one world government, but people of the world should be able to live in the country they choose.

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@hawkeye10,

hawkeye10 wrote:

Quote:
You 'think you'll be fine,' because you're not a Hispanic guy and down deep, you know what the score really is, don't you? Other people don't feel that way.

so long as the cruiser has a computer the cop can punch in my data and get confirmation that I am a citizen. The only thing he will not get is a current pic of me, because I am driving on a military deferred Drivers License and my pic is out of date. This claim that I would ever need to go to jail is ridiculous.

But what if you don't have your ID with you? C'mon.

Even more so, do you really think that a young Hispanic guy in your same situation, when asked for the cops for ID and doesn't have any, isn't going to jail? Seriously?

Cycloptichorn

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@hawkeye10,

The study was commissioned by the Oklahoma Bankers Association; if there is a reliable source for the economic impact of the bill, this is it (since they are only interested in business profits).

They claim that an estimated $1.8 billion dollars was lost because of the anti-immigrant legislation. A report on the savings to the state on social services from an anti-immigrant group said that $200 million was saved (a figure that was almost certainly exaggerated given the source).

Republican politicians from Oklahoma are on record lamenting the bill.

Quote:

Why are leaders from other states coming to talk to them to inquire about replicating the law?

Apparently populist hysteria is a powerful political force in Republican dominated states.

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@hawkeye10,

Is that enough for you Hawkeye...couldn't illegal aliens just memorize some legal Mexican's information then? Will that be enough to convince the cops? Should it be enough if the law is supposed to be effective?

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I have been away from this discussion a while. Thought I would put in some news about a similar bill for Texas. Hope nobody else posted it already.

AUSTIN, Texas, April 28 (UPI) -- Texas could follow Arizona's trailblazing immigration law if two lawmakers can get enough support to pass bills they say they intend to introduce next year.

Texas state Rep. Leo Berman says he is planning a package of bills next January that include one measure that would make it a crime to be an undocumented worker and another allowing law enforcement officials to ask people they believe may be in the country illegally about their status, the Fort Worth Star-Telegram reported Wednesday.

"I think almost every state in the union will follow suit," Berman said.

Rep. Debbie Riddle, R-Tomball, has said she also plans to introduce a similar bill.

"The first priority for any elected official is to make sure that the safety and security of Texans is well-established," Riddle told Hearst Newspapers. "If our federal government did their job, then Arizona wouldn't have to take this action, and neither would Texas."

Tyler's KLTV-TV reported Berman also wants to require U.S. presidential and vice presidential candidates to prove their citizenship to the Texas secretary of state before their names can be put on the ballot, a nod to the so-called birther movement.

The station said opponents of the proposed legislation say it will get a different reception in Texas than in Arizona.

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@maporsche,

Quote:

Is that enough for you Hawkeye...couldn't illegal aliens just memorize some legal Mexican's information then? Will that be enough to convince the cops? Should it be enough if the law is supposed to be effective

if the cops computer has access to information which proves your story, then it is enough. There is nothing in the law about what is required to document your citizenship, that is up to the cops. If the cop does not have access to your documents from his computer because you are new to the country and have not gotten a state ID or LD then it would be a good idea for you to carry something one you that proves your status.

Me, having both military ID and documents from two states which the cop can access on his computer....I don't have a problem.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

Lucky you then.

I hope every other citizen is equally as lucky.

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@ebrown p,

Quote:

The study was commissioned by the Oklahoma Bankers Association; if there is a reliable source for the economic impact of the bill, this is it (since they are only interested in business profits).

They claim that an estimated $1.8 billion dollars was lost because of the anti-immigrant legislation. A report on the savings to the state on social services from an anti-immigrant group said that $200 million was saved (a figure that was almost certainly exaggerated given the source).

do you not know how to read, or rather do you skip the parts you don't like??

The whole thing was a hypothesis, what COULD happen IF a certain number of illegals left.

Quote:

If 50,000 immigrants leave Oklahoma, the state would lose about $1.8 billion annually in productivity and wages, according to a study released Tuesday by the Oklahoma Bankers Association

Read more from this Tulsa World article at http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?articleID=20080326_1_A1_hThes24500

The state in March had a 6.6% unemployment rate...maybe THAT is why you don't hear any complaint's from citizens that some of the illegals may have vacated. Ya think!

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our economy has major problems, but not having enough low skilled undocumented Mexican workers for businesses to exploit will not be a problem again for a long time to come. They can go home now, or better yet go sponge off of the Canadians for awhile.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Why not? I don't really give a **** that they are here, I just want their money!
Cycloptichorn

that's if you get their money

i've seen folks with citizenship working under the table when i was working in the agricultural business, one woman from africa and her daughters worked for cash while her husband had a legit job for the books, another chinese woman who had worked quite happily under the table suddenly wanted a check when she became pregnant (she'd worked out how long she could work so she could collect a maternity leave through unemployment), she got laid off a week before she qualified (oops), if she'd worked legally from the start she'd have been fine by months

lots of citizens working for cash already in your country and mine, and the onlly money your getting is sales tax, just like you get from the illegals

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@Thomas,

Given what I know of her NOW, no I dont.
But at the time, she was violating the law so yes she should have been put in jail.

But if you are saying that either of them were rewarded years after the fact, I gladly concede the point.
However, neither of them was rewarded AT THE TIME of their actions, and that was what the claim by Cyclo was.

1 Reply

@ebrown p,

Quote:

American truck drivers refusing to go to Arizona

I'm afraid you are going to have to document this part.
I know of no trucking organization or firm that has called for a boycott of Az.

OOIDA, the largest organization for independent truckers and owner-operators, has not called for any type of boycott of AZ
http://www.ooida.com/

And neither have the teamsters.
http://www.teamster.org/

So while there might be a few truckers that are going to boycott Az, there is no concerted effort or call from any trucking organization for any type of boycott of Az.

I think you are letting you imagination run wild on that score.

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@ebrown p,

I'm going to to root for the Arizona Diamondbacks vs. the Chicago Cubs on Saturday.

I'll be proudly displaying the Diamondbacks jersey.

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Those of you that want to open the borders, I have another solution that you would have to agree is 100% fair to everyone.

Let our laws regarding illegal immigration mirror other countries laws.

If someone is caught being here illegally, we treat them EXACTLY the same way that their home country treats illegal immigrants.
If their country jails them, then so do we.
If their country deports them, then so do we.
If their country accepts them, then so do we.

What could be more fair then that?

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@maporsche,

If they are playing in AZ, then so will I.
If they are playing in Chicago, its a toss-up.

1 Reply

@mysteryman,

It's in Chicago....I'll be at Wrigley.

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@mysteryman,

Quote:

If someone is caught being here illegally, we treat them EXACTLY the same way that their home country treats illegal immigrants.
If their country jails them, then so do we.
If their country deports them, then so do we.
If their country accepts them, then so do we.

Mexico is offering an amnesty to their undocumented immigrants. Strangely enough, there are US citizens (numbering in the thousands) living illegally in Mexico. It doesn't seem to be a big issue to anyone.

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@maporsche,

You will walk past protesters. Personally, I don't think this is the best avenue for protest... but so be it.

If the players (a fair number of whom are Latino) decide they are upset enough, that is when baseball will start to make a difference.

Not that long ago, Arizona pissed off enough NFL players Ia fair number of whom are black) to make a difference in the last racial dustup.

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@ebrown p,

I'm going to think of a sign to bring....something controversial.

1 Reply

May I see your papers, citizen?

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