Atheism

@layman,

Quote:

The way you put it, if you don't believe there is a god, then you have to believe there isn't.

To spell it out more, Arg: The way you put it, you have only two choices:
1.Believe there is a god, or
2.Believe there is not a god.

Quote:

A third possibility would be to say that you don't have a definite belief on the topic either way

In other words, the recently outlawed state of "agnosticism." But, here again, it seems you've already said there can be no discussion if that possibility is raised, so....

2 Replies

@Setanta,

Go back and read your last several posts . Apart from indulging your delusions of superiority, how have you contributed ? You seem to think quantity of posts makes you an expert but most of your posts are below average insults .

Quote:

Tell us again how you've turned over a new leaf, Mr. Civility.

I never said that, **** for brains . I made a truce with one member and have an unwritten agreement with another...but you are still a target . How could I miss the biggest, stupidest mouth here ?

1 Reply

@layman,

Quote:
The way you put it, if you don't believe there is a god, then you have to believe there isn't.

Quote:

To spell it out more, Arg: The way you put it, you have only two choices:
1.Believe there is a god, or
2.Believe there is not a god.

Quote:
A third possibility would be to say that you don't have a definite belief on the topic either way

In other words, the recently outlawed state of "agnosticism." But, here again, it seems you've already said there can be no discussion if that possibility is raised, so....

There is either a god(s) or there isn't that is how I put it. So what is the third option?

1 Reply

@argome321,

Quote:

There is either a god(s) or there isn't that is how I put it. So what is the third option?

That's not all you said.

1 Reply

@argome321,

People are certainly indoctrinated into religion . Most of the "atheists" here I suspect are former religious members, at least in childhood . Orientation I believe depends on how your brain is wired, and this means if you took away religion you would have to effectively change a fundamental aspect of the human brain .

Quote:

I guess the only way to tell is to have some kind of experiment.

Right . Well, short of bringing back the Nazis, I suggest the only evil arsehole we have, being **** for brains, should be put in charge of any human experiments .

0 Replies

@Ionus,

Your remarks about civility were general, and unqualified. I'm not surprised to see you give yourself the lie, though. Layman is making claims here for which he offers not even bad logic, let alone any other substantiation. Given that you have never offered any better than that yourself, i'm not surprised to see you attempting to ally yourself with Layman by attacking me. This is the kind of thing which represents the best you've got going for yourself.

You've never proven me wrong, nor anyone else here. You just shoot your mouth off, and apparently, unaccountably, expect to be taken as authoritative, just because you say so. You're a pathetic case.

If Layman or anyone else here makes claims, without substantiation, it is a contribution for me, or anyone else to call them on it.

3 Replies

@Setanta,

Quote:

If Layman or anyone else here makes claims, without substantiation, it is a contribution for me, or anyone else to call them on it

Your speciality, sho nuff. Lay in wait, misconstrue something and call it a mistake, come out of hiding with an ostentatious display of bluff, bluster and unmitigated arrogance, cuss them out, call them stupid, then retreat.

A great service to all!

0 Replies

@Setanta,

Quote:

Your remarks about civility were general, and unqualified.

Your depth of understanding is notoriuosly inadequate . Allow me to qualify so that your senile mind can grasp it . I will not be civil to you .Do you need me to repeat it ?

Quote:

You've never proven me wrong, nor anyone else here.

Unbelievable . You are the clown who didnt know Napoleon abdicated and returned in 1815 WITHOUT conscription . Google didnt cover for you then, did it ? Will you deny it and we will have our usual bet ? If I win you leave never to return ?

1 Reply

@Setanta,

Setanta, I will be forthright and honest with you for a minute.

I will preface what I'm about to say with the acknowledgement that this is simply my opinion, based upon my experience with you (and with watching you) and comes from my limited perspective. I could be wrong.

That said, you have impressed me as a person with low self-esteem and a lot to try to prove. A typical "bully" type personality. One which is unattractive, unsavory, and uninviting. As a consequence, I, like some others here, have no desire to try to interact with you on a sincere basis. I am convinced that your intellectual integrity is quite low, if not non-existent. Long story short, I don't see anything to be gained by taking you seriously.

I won't ignore you. I just won't take you seriously, sorry to have to say.

1 Reply

@layman,

Quote:

Quote:
There is either a god(s) or there isn't that is how I put it. So what is the third option?

That's not all you said.

There is either a god(s) or there isn't that is how I put it. So what is the third option?

1 Reply

@layman,

I'm sure it's gratifying to you to belittle someone who has criticized you. Really, though, all you've done is hold a mirror up to your own personality. This thread is about atheism. It has been active for years and years. The topics of theism and agnosticism have come into the mix because others have bullied their way in and insisted upon them.

You made a claim, without substantiation, that agnosticism does not in fact exist. When challenged by FBM, your response was yet another unsubstantiated claim that "free thinkers" make your initial claim. With no evidence for either claim, why should anyone take you seriously?

But more than that, having already had these objections voiced to your claims, your response is some bullshit, street corner psychology. The fact of the matter is, no matter what sort of snide remarks you make about me, you have been challenged and you have made no attempt to back up your claims.

I won't ignore you, and i won't take you seriously, and i'm not sorry to say it.

1 Reply

@Ionus,

That's a fantasy in your own head. I made no remarks about conscription, you got your little lace panties in a twist on a topic which i had not addressed. This is typical of the way you express yourself. You're a legend in your own mind.

1 Reply

@argome321,

Quote:

There is either a god(s) or there isn't that is how I put it. So what is the third option?

Arg, you keep asking that question, and I keep responding to it. But I get the feeling that you are paying very little attention to, or expending very little effort trying to understand, my responses.

I deliberately said only "that's not all you said" in the hope that you might go back and see what else you might have said that I might be addressing. Do you want to take the time to go back start at the beginning again?

1 Reply

@layman,

Quote:

Quote:
Arg, you keep asking that question, and I keep responding to it. But I get the feeling that you are paying very little attention to, or expending very little effort trying to understand, my responses.

I deliberately said only "that's not all you said" in the hope that you might go back and see what else you might have said that I might be addressing. Do you want to take the time to go back start at the beginning again?

What I want you to do is stop drawing incorrect conclusions from what I actually do say, because it looks as if you are putting words in my mouth. Whether intended or not it makes it seem as if you are disingenuous.

I was ask to make my case so I started with a what I believe is a logical premise, Either it exist or it doesn't. Second we weigh evidence. then I hopefully I can come to some belief.

I never said you either believe or must not believe in any way or shape or manner. To equate the logical premise either something is or isn't isn't the same as saying you believe or you don't believe are your only choices. That is inaccurate and something I never said.

If you disagree with what I actually say fine, attack that. But to credit things that I did not say and attack that is somewhat...I don't know...

1 Reply

@argome321,

OK, let's start slow.

The proposition there is no god either true or false, you say, right?

Or, if you prefer, the proposition there is a (some) god(s) either true or false, you say, right?

0 Replies

@layman,

I'm going to make a guess and most likely I am probably wrong. But I'm going to be honest.

I think you are operating from some preconceived notion, from some bias, of what you think atheist are or what you believe them to be. I think you are waiting for me to admit some thing you believe all atheist believe that is contrary to an atheist world view some atheist hypocrisy, so you can jump out and say I aha I gotha. See I knew I was right about you atheists.

The problem with that is that you fail to see or hear the individual and fail to see what the individual is saying.

Like I said, that is just my opinion and it is probably incorrect, but that is what I see.

1 Reply

@argome321,

Ok fine.

I asked one simple question.

Do you care to answer it.

The question was about what I thought you said.

I don't want to talk about more than one thing at a time.

Otherwise things are more likely to get mixed up, or misconstrued.

You say you think I am deliberately mis-stating what you say.

I'm not, and don't want to.

Do you care to respond to the one simple question?

1 Reply

@layman,

Quote:

I asked one simple question.

Do you care to answer it.

The question was about what I thought you said.

I don't want to talk about more than one thing at a time.

Otherwise things are more likely to get mixed up, or misconstrued.

You say you think I am deliberately mis-stating what you say.

I'm not, and don't want to.

Do you care to respond to the one simple question?

Either something exist or it doesn't exist? That's my answer.
Plan and simple. If there is another option I would like to know what it is?

2 Replies

@argome321,

Quote:

Plan and simple. If there is another option I would like to know what it is?

I'm just trying to understand what you are saying, that's all. Earlier you had started out with what is true and what is false.

You have now shifted to what exists, and what doesn't exist.

That's OK.

Quote:

Either something exist or it doesn't exist. That my answer

Ok, I think I understand that, and I agree.

Now, where do you go from here? How do we get to knowledge and/or belief, the things we started off talking about, from here?

1 Reply

@layman,

Quote:

I asked one simple question.

Do you care to answer it.

The question was about what I thought you said.

I don't want to talk about more than one thing at a time.

Otherwise things are more likely to get mixed up, or misconstrued.

You say you think I am deliberately mis-stating what you say.

I'm not, and don't want to.

Do you care to respond to the one simple question?

I never used the terms true or false.. but lets move on.

Second, I said we need to examine the evidence: to weigh the evidence.
Though equating it to a court case is quite not as equal to a scientific method, if no evidence is found or available most likely the case would be thrown out of court...I admit not the perfect analogy.

I say this only because I see no empirical evidence. I say this because most or all of the so called rational arguments for the existence of god(s) made appear to be irrational. I haven't found one to be logical. If you have I would love to know what it is.

I'm a skeptic so faith doesn't work for me. So forgoing any empirical evidence, forgoing any rational argument...for me the proportion of probability goes against a belief for the existence of god. But I can never know that a god doesn't exist so I give it very little credence, but some credence never the less.

1 Reply

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