Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Fri 25 Oct, 2013 06:52 pm
Atheism hurts nobody.

Non-belief hurts nobody.

I suspect there is a lot more of both out there than makes the newspapers, so to speak.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Fri 25 Oct, 2013 06:55 pm
@panzade,
Except it hijacks the thread after a very few posts.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  2  
Fri 25 Oct, 2013 06:57 pm
@edgarblythe,
edgarblythe wrote:
So now you want to tie up another fifty posts about this? There are certainly no winners from this situation.

Of course! Why wouldn't he? Spendi is a troll, and you're feeding him with each of your replies to him, including this one. If you want to contribute to people not wasting their time on fifty more junk posts, I suggest you ignore him --- in your A2K settings or with self-discipline, whatever works for you.
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Fri 25 Oct, 2013 07:25 pm
@Thomas,
I know it's wrong. In my defense, I don't do hundreds of posts to pursue the point.
hingehead
 
  2  
Fri 25 Oct, 2013 11:02 pm
@panzade,
I don't know about the USA, but at least 10 seems likely

This map is kind of interesting

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ec/Atheists_Agnostics_Zuckerman_en.svg
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  2  
Sat 26 Oct, 2013 01:35 am
@hingehead,
Quote:
Or that it's probably much more than 6% but many don't come out for many of the reasons that have been talked about on this thread.


There is an interesting new polling figure with is cropping up in North America. Pew Research in the United States and Ipsos-Reid in Canada both routinely (yearly i think, but i'd have to go check) run polls on religious affiliation. In the last few years, they would ask people who claim a religious affiliation if they believe in god. That must have struck the true believers as awfully odd--but the big surprise is that about 10% of self-professed Catholics and Protestants say that they don't believe there is a god. The National Post, Canada's Tory newspaper of record (and therefore hardly biased in favor of "humanism") reported even higher figures, around 37%. They didn't give their sources, though, so i'm not sure of the accuracy of that. Even 10% of those professing adherence to traditional Christian sects denying that they believe in god is pretty surprising.
Setanta
 
  2  
Sat 26 Oct, 2013 01:47 am
I went looking for a source for what i've posted above, and i will continue to do so, but along the way, at Religious-Tolerance-dot-org, i found this:

"A Canadian Angus-Reid poll taken in the mid-1990's studied people's religious beliefs. They found that about 14% of Canadians are Atheists. That would include about 4 million adults in the country. The pollsters found out, apparently to their embarrassment, that Atheists formed the largest single religious category of Canadians. So they split the group into two sub-classifications: real Atheists, and Atheists who attend religious services. By this trick, they made certain that a Christian classification became the largest category."

I'll keep digging.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Sat 26 Oct, 2013 01:50 am
Here's the page at Religious-Tolerance-dot-org on which i found that statement. There's much interesting material on the number of atheists and agnostics in the world.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  0  
Sat 26 Oct, 2013 04:08 am
@edgarblythe,
Quote:
I know it's wrong. In my defense, I don't do hundreds of posts to pursue the point.


In my opinion ed Henry Miller and James Joyce would have nothing but contempt for Thomas's statement. I do. Like Bob said--"You can't look at much can you man?"

I consider Ignore to be the equivalent of running home and blubbering into Mom's apron because one is not getting all one's own way.

I think Thomas's post is trolling. It had no point except you being instructed to define a troll as he does and make a mockery of all the replies you have made in the past to my posts.

I hope you have been enlightened now and wont be so foolish in future as Thomas is asserting that you have been all these years.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Sat 26 Oct, 2013 07:54 am
My last word: Not in this thread.
panzade
 
  2  
Sat 26 Oct, 2013 09:47 am
Interesting video that captures the indoctrination of children against scientific knowledge.
What do you think?

Rockhead
 
  1  
Sat 26 Oct, 2013 10:10 am
@panzade,
******* scary ****...
Thomas
 
  1  
Sat 26 Oct, 2013 10:11 am
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:
In the last few years, they would ask people who claim a religious affiliation if they believe in god. That must have struck the true believers as awfully odd--but the big surprise is that about 10% of self-professed Catholics and Protestants say that they don't believe there is a god.

That's a good start. Next, let's have the pollsters ask Christians if they believe in the virgin birth and the resurrection. Let's ask Catholics if they believe that wine literally turns into the blood of Jesus during the eucharist. And while the pollsters are at it, let's have the pollsters throw in a few trivia questions to test if they've read the book. Like this one for example: "The first book of the New Testament is _____". Options: "Matthew", "Genesis", "Acts of the Apostles", and "Psalms". When Ipsos-Nori asked this in Britain, 35% of self-professed Christians got it right. (Flipping a coin would have yielded 25%, though Ipsos tactfully doesn't say that.) It certainly seems as if self-identifying as Christian often happens for sentimental reasons or out of sheer ignorance.)

For those who are interested, Ipsos-Nori has a summary of their British survey here (PDF). I wish they did such a detailed study in the US some day.
Setanta
 
  1  
Sat 26 Oct, 2013 10:40 am
@Thomas,
Maybe you should send an e-mail with that link to Pew Research. Pew most consistently polls about religion in the US. The Graduate Center of the City University of New York conducted an American Religious Identification Servey in 2001. I don't know if they have any plans to do such a survey again.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Sat 26 Oct, 2013 10:48 am
@edgarblythe,
Quote:
My last word: Not in this thread.


I must admit ed that it is very rare, if not unique, for anybody to treat you with the amount of disrespect Thomas did. As if a bloke with your experience needs guidance from a silly moocow like him.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Sat 26 Oct, 2013 10:51 am
@Rockhead,
Yeah--the should shoot Ham for a start.
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Sat 26 Oct, 2013 02:00 pm
Ah, a movie I think I'd care to see, produced, co-written, and acted in by an atheist I've heard of not as an atheist but as just one more entertainer type I merely recognize the name of, Steve Coogan. Plus it covers some old territory for me and my female catholic age-cohorts, has a good director, and a hell of an actress in there too.

http://www.theguardian.com/film/2013/oct/26/steve-coogan-philomena-interview

Since I can see most Guardian videos, I'm going to crank up those in the article, after I post this. Probably won't understand the speakers for hearing and perhaps dialect or accent reasons; we'll see.
spendius
 
  1  
Sat 26 Oct, 2013 03:01 pm
@ossobuco,
What does an atheist make of this--

Quote:
No coward soul is mine,
No trembler in the world's storm-troubled sphere:
I see Heaven's glories shine,
And Faith shines equal, arming me from Fear.

O God within my breast,
Almighty, ever-present Deity!
Life, that in me has rest,
As I, undying Life, have power in Thee!.

Vain are the thousand creeds
That move men's hearts: unutterably vain;
Worthless as withered weeds,
Or idlest froth amid the boundless main,

To waken doubt in one
Holding so fast by Thy infinity,
So surely anchored on
The steadfast rock of Immortality.

With wide-embracing love
Thy Spirit animates eternal years,
Pervades and broods above,
Changes, sustains, dissolves, creates, and rears.

Though earth and moon were gone,
And suns and universes ceased to be,
And Thou wert left alone,
Every existence would exist in Thee.

There is not room for Death,
Nor atom that his might could render void:
Thou -Thou art Being and Breath,
And what Thou art may never be destroyed.


by Emily Bronte.

What is also of importance is what atheists think of the effect of such beautiful language on others irrespective of whether they see it as a load of bullshit.

Trollingly sloping on here to declare that others are trolls and boast of having them on Ignore, and advising others to do the same, and asserting that the thread is trashed, is hardly what the thread is supposed to be about if the first post is anything to go by.

There is something to have a constructive conversation about and to share ideas. Especially the second question.
0 Replies
 
Romeo Fabulini
 
  0  
Sat 26 Oct, 2013 07:34 pm
What's the purpose of this thread anyway, is it supposed to be a Christian-free zone where atheists can gather to sit holding hands comforting each other or what?..Wink

Incidentally I've been trying to figger out Star Trek creator Gene Roddenberry, he was - "raised as a Southern Baptist, he instead considered himself a humanist and agnostic. He saw religion as the cause of many wars and human suffering"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gene_Roddenberry


yet to his credit he never banned religion from Star Trek. Maybe he felt that although he didn't believe in it, it was too big to be ignored-

Religion in Star Trek
An alien 'god' demands Kirk worships him but Kirk replies-"Mankind has no need of gods, we find the One quite adequate" (OST: 'Who Mourns for Adonais")
The rebels on Magna Roma, a nearly perfect "Parallel Earth", seem to worship the "sun", which Uhura discovers is actually God's "Son" Jesus. (OST: "Bread and Circuses").
In the wedding chapel on the Enterprise we can see a sort of altar and some religious symbols, among them a cross (OST: "Balance of Terror").
The computer M-5 states: "Murder is contrary to the laws of man and God" (OST: "The Ultimate Computer").
Dr. Ozaba quotes from the Bible- "In His hands are the deep places of the Earth. Psalm 95, verse 4." (OST: "The Empath").
Dr. Phlox says he has been to a Tibetan monastery and that he has attended a mass at St. Peter's Square. This is a most definite statement that religion still plays a role in the 22nd century (ENT: "Cold Front").
Spock, traveling back in time to save his own life, presents himself to his parents as a cousin making a ritual journey "to honor our gods". (TAS: "Yesteryear").
Vulcans, like many other races, believe in a spiritual place from which they as a people were born. Their name for this place is Sha Ka Ree ("Star Trek V").
McCoy in Wrath of Khan refers to God twice, and Armageddon once-"Dear Lord. You think we're intelligent enough to..suppose..what if this thing were used where life already exists?"......."Logic? My God, the man's talking about logic; we're talking about universal Armageddon! You green-blooded inhuman..."


http://imageshack.us/a/img401/772/8mw.gif
farmerman
 
  1  
Sat 26 Oct, 2013 07:42 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
To ignore religion as a story line is kinda stupid. We all have varying levels of religious upbringings and have used that experience to carry into our later lives as various contrivances for artistic endeavors.

I hear that Carl Orff was a devout atheist yet his work featuring the chorus of evil monks is a popular work.
0 Replies
 
 

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