Atheism

I'm saying that "atheism" isn't a collective reasoning. There are individual atheists, most of whom live productive, ethical lives (just like theists) without a theistic anvil hanging over their heads. Some are spiritual beings who separate god from spirit. They define for themselves their views on god(s) and on they react to those who attempt to push their theism back onto the atheist.

Saying that atheism represents a specific teaching or tenet makes it religious.

What are the positive things about being human?

Once you've figured that out, switch atheism in for human.

It's really quite simple.

I think there's a lot of baggage associated with certain religion-speak that causes a certain negative visceral reaction among some atheists. I know atheists who use god-speak, but it's not the God of Abraham that they're speaking of when they use that word. Some atheists I know bristle at the thought of spirituality - not the feelings that I think of as spiritual, just the connotation that that word invokes.

I think you need to realize the emotional damage done sometimes in the name of religion causes folks who reject, or turn away from, religion to reject the very words that comes along with the dogma of what they left behind. Not all atheists have turned away from a religion, certainly. But those who have have a different perspective than a lifelong atheist.

One episode in particular comes to mind about how different people react to different words that are sometimes associated with theism. I was in a gathering of UUs, many of them humanists, some theists, some militant atheists, most of whom who had come from a previous faith tradition.

We started talking about "humility", which to me is a virtue that means lack of arrogance. Well! That's not what it means to those who were raised to get on their knees and humble themselves before God!!! The different reactions to that one word were striking. I'll never forget one very soft-spoken woman who had been raised Catholic trembling with emotion as she spat out that she would never!!! strive to be humble. There were obviously some very hurtful memories that that word evoked and she had rejected the word along with the practices that came with it.

Well Beth--I don't think it is simple.

A scientist describing an object, and atheists are objects by their own rigorous logic, needs to provide a description so that somebody who has never seen an atheist before will be able to recognise one. As would a zoologist describing an ostrich or a reptile indigenous to his native land to someone in Pyongyang, say. Plenty of people hate Christians and describing them as superstitious, idiotic dumbasses off their wits in deluded fantasyland is of no help to any of them as the characteristics to look out for in order to identify an atheist.

And with atheists in our countries dressing and acting like Christians and calling Christians superstitious, idiotic dumbasses off their wits in deluded fantasyland, the task is not easy. It's easy on here of course but I don't think atheists go around all day doing that.

Even within our midst it might be useful to be able to identify atheists before they show their hand. When putting out a tender to have a new patio and conservatory feature attached to one's house for example. I daresay, though I'm loathe to speak for atheists, they might themselves tend to favour the Christian builder with other things fairly equal.

We are not finding out what it's like to be an atheist which it has been insisted is the purpose of the thread. If all they do is hate and deride Christians then they are all the same. Surely within atheism there are different schools leaving aside the groundbase. I was almost persuaded myself by the Marquis de Sade but I saw through his corrosive irony in time.

He was human. Much too much really.

What does a Christian dress like?

Dior?

They need to. The reality is all there is for them. To allow any spirituality is out of the question. The whole case falls apart.

Of course it's a pose. It's impossible not to be spiritual in some way without becoming a bit mechanical. The design of an NFL player's hard-hat is spiritual.

The whole restaurant and women's beauty industry is based on spiritual feelings. The whole idea of image. All art.

Darwin lost his already meagre taste for music. He couldn't be "sent" is what I suppose that means. He would have seen George Raft tangoing Rita Hayworth in a sleazy nightclub just as he would have seen two birds hopping around each other in a clearing. And why not?

George, sometimes you are so funny I can't stand it. (That's a compliment)

You are hurling nose boogers here, spendius, and capping them with a tent of calling people poseurs.

A post or two back, you said something like atheists hate religion.
I was angry at religion for a while, and have described distress, shuddering, at going into the church of Guadalupe in Mexico back in the early seventies. I've lots of good reasons for that, as my family was very pulled, rather dove into, the whole Fatima thing.

However, I settled down within a few years and now like a lot of churches as architecture and as community spaces, sometimes enclosing, sometimes awe inspiring. Awe for what you may ask? It differs for different people. I have my own concepts of, er, radiance. I don't call that spiritual. I once posted that I'm the least spiritual person on a2k and someone argued with me. Views vary. I'm materialistic in a way that doesn't fit most definitions of that.

I think religion is often a force for good in the world and have posted thus many times, perhaps on this thread too, or maybe not, as that was not - as you have been told - what this thread is about.
We all know religion can be involved in some horrendously bad actions.
I can see the good bits.

I know you write well, but your words simplify and reduce in behest of your squishy arguments.

the words get bigger as the argument becomes thinner...

Right. The march up the stairs to the podium.

As well I may. They are just a pile of stones after all.

You may distance yourself from spirituality by calling it radiance if you wish but I would see radiance as a higher form of spiritualty. Having it bad I mean. Radiant eyes are up a gear from spiritual ones in my experience.

Radiance is shorter than spiritual Rockie.

Having spendi on ignore makes it seem like he's the possum, hiding beneath the porch. I might notice a little rustling from time to time, but I don't have to respond.

Agreed, you just occasionally get a whiff of stale urine.