THE WAR IN GAZA

So apparently, we agree more then we disagree.

According to the Hamas charter, they want Israel totally destroyed...
http://www.mideastweb.org/hamas.htm

I've been thinking New Mexico...or South Dakota. In either place, things could be built to simulate holy areas of the old land.


And what would you do with the people living there?
There are 1,903,289 people living in New Mexico, along with several historic sites.
Would you allow those sites to remain owned by the US, or would you turn them over also?
There are 770,883 people living in South Dakota, so you would have to decide what to do with them.

Your plan is not feasible at all.

PART YOU DIDN'T COVER: But if the Jews want a peaceful existence...then they gotta get the state of Israel out of the Middle East...where it should not have been installed in the first place.

Quote:

Are you saying that the Jews in Israel today should be made to suffer for decisions made by people in the 1940's?

Many of the people living in Israel today werent even alive when Israel was created.
Why should they have to move from the only home they know, just to please a group that doesnt like them?

I'm sorry, but Israel should be allowed to exist right where it is

...and the Arab nations are going to have to learn to live with them in peace.

Hamas's charter calls for an end to Israel, but Hamas did not mention that aspect of its charter in its electoral manifesto during the 2006 election campaign.[44] On 25 January 2006, after winning the Palestinian elections, Hamas leader Mahmoud al-Zahar gave an interview to Al-Manar TV denouncing foreign demands that Hamas recognize Israel's right to exist.[62] After the establishment of Hamas government, Dr Al-Zahar stated his "dreams of hanging a huge map of the world on the wall at my Gaza home which does not show Israel on it...I hope that our dream to have our independent state on all historic Palestine (including Israel). This dream will become real one day. I'm certain of this because there is no place for the state of Israel on this land". He also "didn't rule out the possibility of having Jews, Muslims and Christians living under the sovereignty of an Islamic state, adding that the Palestinians never hated the Jews and that only the Israeli occupation was their enemy".[63] In November 2008 Ismail Haniyah said that Hamas was willing to accept a Palestinian state within the 1949 armistice lines, and offered Israel "a long-term hudna, or truce, if Israel recognized the Palestinians' national rights."[64]

Hamas's charter calls for the eventual creation of an Islamic Republic in their historic homeland of Palestine, in place of Israel.[65] Hamas sees this view as an Islamic religious duty and prophesy that comes directly from Hadith.[66] In 1999, late Hamas co-founder Sheikh Ahmed Yassin mentioned the year 2027 as the possible date for the "disappearance" of Israel.[67] The group has not issued a clear statement about how it would deal with the current population of Israel, should it succeed in overthrowing Israeli and secular Palestinian government. Abdel Aziz al-Rantissi, one of its co-founders, stated that the movement's goal is "to remove Israel from the map".[68]
Hamas uses both political activities and violence to pursue its goal of establishing an Islamic Palestinian state in place of Israel and the secular Palestinian Authority.[69] Israeli military operations during the al-Aqsa Intifada in 2002 put pressure on Hamas in the West Bank following several bombings in Israel. Hamas has also engaged in peaceful political activities, including running candidates in West Bank Chamber of commerce elections.
During the election campaign the organization stated in its election manifesto that it was prepared to use "armed resistance to end the occupation".[70]

The slogan of Hamas is "God is its target, the Prophet is its model, the Qur'an its constitution. Hamas states that its objective is to support the oppressed and wronged and "to bring about justice and defeat injustice, in word and deed." Hamas has stated that "the land of Palestine is an Islamic Waqf (trust) consecrated for future Muslim generations until Judgement Day." The 1988 Hamas Covenant states that "so-called peaceful solutions and international conferences" are "in contradiction to the principles of the Islamic Resistance Movement", stating "there is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad".[71]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas

That after weeks of denying that white phosporus was used at all

"Aggressor" is a slippery term, Fox. To the Palestinians the Israelis are the aggressors, they took the Palestinians' lands in war. It wasn't Egyptian or Jordanian land they took, it was Palestinian, which is a reason Jordan and Egypt are not as directly concerned.

While I can appreciate what you’re saying Frank, I think I am less pessimistic than you.

Even among the rigid religious orthodoxy and intolerant politics of the Middle East, we have seen Egypt and Jordan prefer peace to perpetual war and there is no longer threat to Israel from either and no hositlities between those countries and Israel.

I believe that other Arab peoples are also capable of coming to believe in a better way than perpetual war. That will be delayed, however, so long as sympathy lies with the aggressors and the UN and others give organizations like Hamas as much legitimacy as Israel who much more emulates intended UN ideals:

Posted on the Israel, Hezbollah, Hamas thread (along with similar clips on the original PLO and Hezbollah) here: http://able2know.org/topic/79142-355#post-3549431
Quote:
Hamas's charter calls for an end to Israel, but Hamas did not mention that aspect of its charter in its electoral manifesto during the 2006 election campaign.[44] On 25 January 2006, after winning the Palestinian elections, Hamas leader Mahmoud al-Zahar gave an interview to Al-Manar TV denouncing foreign demands that Hamas recognize Israel's right to exist.[62] After the establishment of Hamas government, Dr Al-Zahar stated his "dreams of hanging a huge map of the world on the wall at my Gaza home which does not show Israel on it...I hope that our dream to have our independent state on all historic Palestine (including Israel).

Promise was that I
Should Israel from Philistian yoke deliver;
Ask for this great deliverer now, and find him
Eyeless in Gaza at the mill with slaves

The Jews have had a fantastic amount of goodwill as a result of events in Germany and this recent trouble has squandered a great deal of it. That goodwill effectively neutralised anti-semitism. A lot of what might be seen as legitimate criticism of Jewish activity has been muted for fear of being branded a Nazi.

I did say that history is bunk. Replaying the past goes nowhere. Which group hasn't been persecuted some time or other? How about the aboriginal Americans? What about optimising their existence?

There's no anti-semitism here that I can see. I don't see your post as a serious answer to the proposition I raised.

You explained nothing Foofie. Except maybe that you cast yourself into Watson mode by your sarcastic comment.

Gentiles are fickle philo-Semites... Did you know Foofie was the favorite hunting spaniel of one of your kings?...You are talking from the position of someone that spells "favor," "favour," meaning you have a perspective that is not that of Jews. Perhaps, a few British Jews,...You British are funny sometimes, and you do not even know it.