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ISRAEL - IRAN - SYRIA - HAMAS - HEZBOLLAH - WWWIII?

 
 
Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 09:48 pm
@JTT,
JTT wrote:

Quote:
I would like to see Israel offer Mexicans temporary worker visas, and eliminate Palestineans as farm workers anyway.


Read as:

Stealing their land, holding them as prisoners, none of this is working. I'm in favor of the complete extermination of Palestinians, indeed all Arabs who stand in the way of a greater Israel. Genocide genocide genocide!!


No need to twist what I say in a civil manner.
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 09:54 pm
@Foofie,
Surely you meant uncivil manner Foofie. JTT and I have had a couple of civil exchanges lately, but his twisting of your words I think was not intended to be civil. Smile
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 10:22 pm
@Foxfyre,
He could have said either, Foxy, depending on his intent.

I was perfectly civil. After all the Israelis have done to the Palestinians, now Foofie wants to try to starve them.
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 10:28 pm
@JTT,
But there is also proof that Saddam was backed by liberal US govts.
Whats your point?
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 10:34 pm
@Foxfyre,
You fail to mention that the US supplies the Israelis with over 3 billion a year, is it all in military hardware?, regardless, with that they are able to buy the latest in military hardware. Even with that, all those US smart bombs, what a crock!, they still hit, as the facts show, neutral parties. This is a war crime!

You should not be lecturing anyone on respect for life, Foxy. Do you have any idea on the numbers of Iraqi dead? do you? All based on lies and the false trumpeting of boogeyman scenarios.

Quote:
Your source failed to mention that Israel has no choice but to hit civilian areas because that's where Hamas hides and uses their weapons and ammunition.


This is absolute stupidity [said in a civil fashion]! Hamas is the elected government of those people. Do you expect that they would hide in the open desert? Please, stop just repeating right wing nonsense and think for a moment.

Give Hamas the same weaponry that the Israelis have and the physical territory and the bomb shelters and you'd see a whole different picture.
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 10:36 pm
@JTT,
Quote:
Hamas is the elected government of those people. Do you expect that they would hide in the open desert?


Then if thats the case, what Hamas is doing is an act of war, and Israel has every right to retaliate with every means at their disposal, short of nukes.

If
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 10:38 pm
@Foxfyre,
Quote:
Hamas is a bully aided by a bigger bully, Iran


Who is this asshole to talk of bullies? What utter nonsense! These two entities are threatened by even bigger, more powerful bullies, Israel and the United States.

Really, do you even think before you speak?
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 10:40 pm
@JTT,
They are incapable of seeing the facts in front of them; they suffer from myopia. Maybe it's blindness.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 10:42 pm
@mysteryman,
Quote:
But there is also proof that Saddam was backed by liberal US govts.
Whats your point?


If you can't figure out what the point of that is, MM, ...
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 10:48 pm
@mysteryman,
Quote:
what Hamas is doing is an act of war, and Israel has every right to retaliate with every means at their disposal, short of nukes.


Quote:
Fact Check: Israel never ended its occupation of Gaza. Following the September 2005 dismantling of its illegal colony/settlements, Israel maintained nearly total control of Gaza's borders, airspace, territorial waters (preventing most fishing), electricity, life-lines and economy, turning it into a sealed prison resembling the Warsaw Ghetto, according to UN Special Rapporteur, Richard Falk.

Palestinians living in Gaza have not only the right but the obligation to resist Israel's continuing illegal occupation. Indeed, the very existence of Gaza is a historical reminder of those hundreds of thousands of Palestinians who lost their homes to Israel. Gaza is a Palestinian refugee camp"all of it. More than 80% of its inhabitants were victims of Zionist terrorism that pushed them off their land"many from Askalaan (Ashkelon), their heritage from that now Jewish town nearly erased.

http://www.counterpunch.org/lamb01072009.html



So using nukes would be what, MM?
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 11:48 pm
@JTT,
JTT, You're wasting your energy and effort to try to convince these in-humans about the mistreatment of Palestinians by Israelis. Rational people only need look at all the innocent children and women killed by the Israelis to know that their occupation of Israel is one of the cruelest in this world today. The Israelis have destroyed most of their infrastructure and most means of maintaining any form of economy is a prison environment.
0 Replies
 
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 12:41 am
foxfyre wrote:
The anti-Israel bigots--and I do call them bigots since they can't seem to discuss this without showing their contempt/hatred for Israel--along with everything else they acuse Israel of, condemn Israel for not opening its borders and allowing all Palestinians to move in who want to do so and for not giving the new Palestinians full rights to citizenship and all benefits that go with it.


Bigotry has nothing to do with wanting Israel, who stands behind a self-serving interpretation of UN resolution 181 to rationalize its existence, to abide by UN resolution 194 (parts of which it also self-servingly interprets to perpetuate its ethnocentric existence at the expense of the Palestinians). Yours is a case of projecting your own onto others.

Quote:
I can see that should Israel do that, Israel will cease to exist because it will no longer have a majority vote to ensure that all the citizens of Israel will be treated equally and fully protected. The Palestinians have already indicated in very clear terms that they have zero intention of ensuring that all the citizens of Israel will be treated equally and fully protected.


Where have "the Palestinians indicated" this, or did you pull this out of the same place you've excreted your other assertions about what Israel would or wouldn't do regarding the Palestinians?

As it stands now, the majority vote in Israel perpetuates the discrimination of the Palestinian Israelis, and the oppression of the Palestinians in the Occupied and Controlled Territories.
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 01:26 am
@InfraBlue,
No the majority vote in Israel does not involve discrimination against the Palestinians but rather ensures the survival of Israel. Take that away from Israel and there will be no Israel.

Quote:
From the inception of Hezbollah to the present, the elimination of the State of Israel has been one of Hezbollah's primary goals. Some translations of Hezbollah's 1985 Arabic-language manifesto state that "our struggle will end only when this entity [Israel] is obliterated".[12] However neither the original publication of the manifesto, nor those found on Hezbollah's website, include the statement.[12] In an interview with the Washington Post, Nasrallah said "I am against any reconciliation with Israel. I do not even recognize the presence of a state that is called 'Israel.'"[102] Throughout its history, Hezbollah has made statements and actions against the United States, in part because of the United States' support for Israel but mostly because of the ongoing conflict between the Velayat-e Faqih Regime and America.[103]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hezbollah


Quote:
Hamas's charter calls for an end to Israel, but Hamas did not mention that aspect of its charter in its electoral manifesto during the 2006 election campaign.[44] On 25 January 2006, after winning the Palestinian elections, Hamas leader Mahmoud al-Zahar gave an interview to Al-Manar TV denouncing foreign demands that Hamas recognize Israel's right to exist.[62] After the establishment of Hamas government, Dr Al-Zahar stated his "dreams of hanging a huge map of the world on the wall at my Gaza home which does not show Israel on it...I hope that our dream to have our independent state on all historic Palestine (including Israel). This dream will become real one day. I'm certain of this because there is no place for the state of Israel on this land". He also "didn't rule out the possibility of having Jews, Muslims and Christians living under the sovereignty of an Islamic state, adding that the Palestinians never hated the Jews and that only the Israeli occupation was their enemy".[63] In November 2008 Ismail Haniyah said that Hamas was willing to accept a Palestinian state within the 1949 armistice lines, and offered Israel "a long-term hudna, or truce, if Israel recognized the Palestinians' national rights."[64]

Hamas's charter calls for the eventual creation of an Islamic Republic in their historic homeland of Palestine, in place of Israel.[65] Hamas sees this view as an Islamic religious duty and prophesy that comes directly from Hadith.[66] In 1999, late Hamas co-founder Sheikh Ahmed Yassin mentioned the year 2027 as the possible date for the "disappearance" of Israel.[67] The group has not issued a clear statement about how it would deal with the current population of Israel, should it succeed in overthrowing Israeli and secular Palestinian government. Abdel Aziz al-Rantissi, one of its co-founders, stated that the movement's goal is "to remove Israel from the map".[68]
Hamas uses both political activities and violence to pursue its goal of establishing an Islamic Palestinian state in place of Israel and the secular Palestinian Authority.[69] Israeli military operations during the al-Aqsa Intifada in 2002 put pressure on Hamas in the West Bank following several bombings in Israel. Hamas has also engaged in peaceful political activities, including running candidates in West Bank Chamber of commerce elections.
During the election campaign the organization stated in its election manifesto that it was prepared to use "armed resistance to end the occupation".[70]

The slogan of Hamas is "God is its target, the Prophet is its model, the Qur'an its constitution. Hamas states that its objective is to support the oppressed and wronged and "to bring about justice and defeat injustice, in word and deed." Hamas has stated that "the land of Palestine is an Islamic Waqf (trust) consecrated for future Muslim generations until Judgement Day." The 1988 Hamas Covenant states that "so-called peaceful solutions and international conferences" are "in contradiction to the principles of the Islamic Resistance Movement", stating "there is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad".[71]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas


Quote:
During the period that has been referred to as the "Total Liberation Phase" (1969-1974), the PLO culturally and politically found its place in the ranks of other socialist anti-colonial liberation movements.8 As Barry Rubin has pointed out, the organization wanted to wage a "people's war," following the example of Marxist-Leninist guerillas in China, Cuba, and Vietnam. He described the goals of this people's war and how the PLO understood its strategic goal at that time. The following statement is remarkably consistent with Feisal Husseini's views, expressed above:
The PLO's target in Israel, however, was not merely a government but the people themselves. Thus, since the PLO was at war with a society - not an army or simply the post-1967 occupation - every aspect and member of Israeli society was a legitimate target. The PLO's aim "is not to impose our will on the enemy," explained the PLO magazine Filastin al-Thawra in 1968, "but to destroy him in order to take his place...not to subjugate the enemy but to destroy him."9
http://www.jcpa.org/jl/vp503.htm




cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 12:55 pm
@Foxfyre,
Foxie doesn't understand the phenomenon of fear.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 12:58 pm
So long as they are not bombing or shelling or blowing themselves up trying to kill Israelis, the Palestinians have absolutely nothing to fear regarding Israel. Israel, however, as testified by what the Palestinian leadership promises, has a great deal to fear from Palestinians.
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 01:17 pm
@Foxfyre,

Foxfire wrote:
the Palestinians have absolutely nothing to fear regarding Israel.


The Palestinians have nothing LEFT to fear from Israel, you mean, since Irael has taken their land, their villages, orchards and water, their settled society, and their future.

Nothing to fear, indeed. Sickeningly disingenuous, and unworthy.
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 01:59 pm
AGAIN, THIS IS THE TRUTH

In 1947, Britain asked the UN to recommend a solution to its Palestine problem.

In 1947, the UN recommended a two state solution: one for the Palestinian Arabs and one for the Palestinian Jews..

In 1948, Britain abandoned Palestine.

In 1948, Israel declared its independence.

Subsequently in 1948 and thereafter Palestinian Arabs and their supporters attempted to steal Israel.

In the process of stopping the Palestinian Arabs and their supporters from stealing Israel in 1948, Israel stole some Palestinian land.

In the process of stopping the Palestinian Arabs and their supporters from stealing Israel after 1948, Israel stole some more Palestinian land, some of which they returned.
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 03:18 pm
@ican711nm,
AND THIS TOO IS TRUE
All the Palestinian Arabs have to agree on to is the following:
IF
the Israelis agree to return to the Palestinian Arabs all Palestinian land originally recommended by the UN to be governed by the Palestinian Arabs, THEN
1. the Palestinian Arabs will cease and desist trying to steal Israel;
2. the Palestinian Arabs will convict and incarcerate any and all Palestinian Arabs not living in Israel that are proven to have perpetrated crimes against Israelis, including murder, attempted murder, and other physical harm to the Israelis or to their property.

If the Palestinian Arabs were to agree on that, then the Israelis would have little choice other than to also agree, because America would no longer help the Israelis if the Israelis failed to agree.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 03:40 pm
@McTag,
McT, It only reveals how entrenched Foxie is of her support of the Israelis; she's blind to the realities and facts that have been posted on these threads. Her last post is the evidence: "...the Palestinians have absolutely nothing to fear regarding Israel." This after barbed wired fences, cement fences, control points, illegal land confiscation, and the destruction of most of the infrastructure of Gaza. Yeah, "nothing to fear." You're trying to have a discussion with a terrorist.
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 04:10 pm
@ican711nm,
Not so nuts today, this is a sensible statement of a blueprint for progress.

Although one unlikely to find favour in Tel Aviv.
 

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