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FINAL COUNTDOWN FOR USA ELECTION 2008

 
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 01:51 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Yes I agree. "Making up facts" is far worse than citing opinion. Too many media sources seem to do that by inference if not overtly. But citing opinion as 'fact' is just as bad.

Best to check and crosscheck all sources and you might come close to arriving at a balanced view of the truth. Even competent and honorable people writing opinion pieces cite the specific source of the facts they cite and they distinguish between opinion and facts.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  3  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 01:53 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:

Well, it was clearly marked as an opinion piece. And, did you mean a 'rabid' partisan?

Tahiri's problem is that he makes up facts and reports them as facts. There's a big difference between this and an opinion piece.

Cycloptichorn


It was?

Cycloptichorn wrote:


From today's US News and World Report -

Quote:
John McCain's Journey From Maverick to Liar


http://www.usnews.com/blogs/john-farrell/2008/9/15/john-mccains-journey-from-maverick-to-liar.html

Cycloptichorn


I don't see where that is "clearly marked as an opinion piece. "
Foxfyre
 
  2  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 01:55 pm
@McGentrix,
Yes it does say opinion just above the headline McG. That doesn't change the fact that he is a leftwing partisan hack, but it is listed as opinion. Not as the opinion of US News & World Report though and the writer is still obligated to support those things cited as fact if he wishes to be considered credible.
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 01:57 pm
@McGentrix,
McGentrix wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Well, it was clearly marked as an opinion piece. And, did you mean a 'rabid' partisan?

Tahiri's problem is that he makes up facts and reports them as facts. There's a big difference between this and an opinion piece.

Cycloptichorn


It was?

Cycloptichorn wrote:


From today's US News and World Report -

Quote:
John McCain's Journey From Maverick to Liar


http://www.usnews.com/blogs/john-farrell/2008/9/15/john-mccains-journey-from-maverick-to-liar.html

Cycloptichorn


I don't see where that is "clearly marked as an opinion piece. "


Yeah, do you see the blue things? That underline when you put your mouse over them? They are called 'links,' or 'hyperlinks' if you are old-fashioned.

When you click on them, it takes you to the source. When you are at the source, you will see a large word at the top, preceding the post that I pasted here, which looks like this:

OPINION

Do you really need things spelled out for you like this, McG? Honestly.

Cycloptichorn
Cycloptichorn
 
  2  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 01:59 pm
@Foxfyre,
Foxfyre wrote:

Yes it does say opinion just above the headline McG. That doesn't change the fact that he is a leftwing partisan hack, but it is listed as opinion. Not as the opinion of US News & World Report though and the writer is still obligated to support those things cited as fact if he wishes to be considered credible.


This is a valid point you bring up, but I wonder what he talked about that you would take issue with? It seems to be a pretty accurate portrayal of how McCain came to have his 'maverick' reputation.

Cycloptichorn
Foxfyre
 
  2  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 02:03 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
He got some of it right. But the implication he leaves is that McCain has throw all that away with dishonest campaign tactics with no effort to support that or admit that the Obama campaign and surrogates are doing as bad or worse. That seems to be the talking point of the Democrat faithful this week - McCain's malicious lies. Last week it was Jesus was a community organizer but Pontius Pilate was a governor. Next week it will be something else. The Democrats and their surrogates, including the leftwing media, are really REALLY good about spreading the talking points of the week. It gets really funny sometimes when you see it all put together in a montage.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 02:04 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
What 'maverick' reputation? He looks a pretty straightforward up-and-down-the-track sort of bloke to me.

You're giving mavericks a bad reputation Cyclo.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  0  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 02:07 pm
@Foxfyre,
Foxfyre wrote:

He got some of it right. But the implication he leaves is that McCain has throw all that away with dishonest campaign tactics with no effort to support that or admit that the Obama campaign and surrogates are doing as bad or worse. That seems to be the talking point of the Democrat faithful this week - McCain's malicious lies. Last week it was Jesus was a community organizer but Pontius Pilate was a governor. Next week it will be something else. The Democrats and their surrogates, including the leftwing media, are really REALLY good about spreading the talking points of the week. It gets really funny sometimes when you see it all put together in a montage.


It doesn't matter if the Dems are doing as bad or worse; McCain is responsible for his own behavior no matter what others do.

I think that McCain is being lambasted for two things - first, that he promised to run a clean campaign and has totally abandoned that promise. Second, that he has abandoned all the things which made him a 'maverick' in the first place; he had to do so in order to win the primaries.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  2  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 02:07 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:

Yeah, do you see the blue things? That underline when you put your mouse over them? They are called 'links,' or 'hyperlinks' if you are old-fashioned.

When you click on them, it takes you to the source. When you are at the source, you will see a large word at the top, preceding the post that I pasted here, which looks like this:

OPINION

Do you really need things spelled out for you like this, McG? Honestly.

Cycloptichorn


Oh, I see, When you post the source, copy and paste the entire article, I am supposed to click the link and see that it says opinion on it...

Do you even read the crap you write?
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 02:09 pm
@McGentrix,
McGentrix wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Yeah, do you see the blue things? That underline when you put your mouse over them? They are called 'links,' or 'hyperlinks' if you are old-fashioned.

When you click on them, it takes you to the source. When you are at the source, you will see a large word at the top, preceding the post that I pasted here, which looks like this:

OPINION

Do you really need things spelled out for you like this, McG? Honestly.

Cycloptichorn


Oh, I see, When you post the source, copy and paste the entire article, I am supposed to click the link and see that it says opinion on it...

Do you even read the crap you write?


Yes, I do. You are required to click through links, McG. Sorry if that is inconvenient for you. The piece is clearly marked 'opinion' at the source, and you are clearly wrong on this issue.

Cycloptichorn
McGentrix
 
  2  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 02:11 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Yeah, ok. I see the point zoomed over your head so no sense trying to lower it for you.
Ramafuchs
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 03:31 pm
@McGentrix,
Like a few here in this forum.
I always make a complete reseach in internet and pick up a jubject which co-incide with my critical views. before I post i read once again and expect a new member to correct /oppose/ acclaim the topic.
Unfortunately sir here are a few regulars who type one or two sentenses in high sounding words to uphold their political views.
I feel extremely sorry to vomit my above w views -not with anger but with agony.
I read all the threads( wether it is a cut and paste or a simple time-wasting retors,reviles.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 04:29 pm
@Ramafuchs,
I had thought something like that myself. I articulated it better mind you but I have a language advantage over Rama.
Ramafuchs
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 04:48 pm
@spendius,
I will be the last person in this forum to degrade any member's verocity in language and culture.
my job is this. to use freedom of speech without hurting/ insulting others.
BACK ToTHE SUBJECT OF THIS THREAD:
I think.
Obama will win with slender majority.(f the corporate controlled compassionate cultured curmudgeons have some christian TOLERANCE.)
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 04:58 pm
@Ramafuchs,
It was a compliment Rama. Sheesh!
Ramafuchs
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 05:05 pm
@spendius,
Thanks and regards.
I seek not compliments nor any encomiums but a friendly correction of my views.
Rama
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 05:08 pm
@Ramafuchs,
Bullshit. Whoever heard of anybody who didn't seek compliments or encomiums? Both preferably.
Ramafuchs
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 05:26 pm
@spendius,
Once again.
I beg your pardon.
I am here to learn form others who are civil polite and critical.

a person like me who has no regrets personally nor any ambitions in life bestow not much attention about the attack or admirations.
In indian democracy there are different choices to pick and choose like in Germany.
Both countries are not faluless/unblemished. But still better than USA's democracy.
I am not for any of the two approved candidates.
But I am quite sure that the whole world will relax a while( I mean a few months) if American voters give a befitting farewell to the BUSH and HIS CONSERVATIVE PARTY.
Make no mistake.
I am not embedded with any American congrlomerate nor i am against the innocent citizens of usa.
0 Replies
 
JamesMorrison
 
  4  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 08:17 pm
@Foxfyre,
Everybody knows my wishes regarding the outcome of the general election but something has happened in the markets and this weekend that leads me to believe that McCain, in the next few weeks, will only have a less than 50% chance of winning--and that might be a generous assessment. Lehman has tanked, BOA (Bank of America) just bought Merrell at fire sale prices, AIG is in deep do, do and the Dow is down over 500 points--this is major ****. The Dow will probably regain some in the future but this may be the beginning of recessionary tendencies we will see in the future. This weekend, on ABC's This Week Alan Greenspan, former Fed Chairman, said that a recession in the future was certain.

Further, Greenspan told how the global economy was in slow down mode and the U.S. would definitely be affected (The dollar's slide has been checked but the decrease in exports that this might imply will add to the U.S.'s economic woes). So Far the credit crunch has not affected U.S. companies too much simply because they were relatively flush with cash, but this cash will have been used up soon and to further fuel U.S. growth they will have to enter the credit markets which is exhibiting a dwindling supply--this means costlier credit which will inhibit investment in the economy which will slow down economic growth cut down on jobs and so on. Things could turn around somewhat but it doesn't look good for at least the next year and growth could well be flat for two to three more years. Greenspan did say the housing market could start to recover by sometime in 2009. Personally, I think the realty market will be down until the end of 2009, at best. But that estimate is deeply dependant upon our economy as is and without the new above facts taken under consideration.

Needless to say, if all this doom and gloom, or even more importantly its perception, comes to fruition before November the Public will be led to believe it is the fault of the republicans and that all citizens would be better served by an Obama presidency and a Dem Congress. The irony is that the opposite is true--at least the congress part. It is here that I must, sadly, disagree with Asherman on the faith he might have in the American people to make the correct decision for our country. Though I might be accused of elitism, I have not witnessed, in the past, a general American public understanding of either the credit crunch, the housing problem, fiscal policy, or monetary policy. Pity, because they follow simple economic principles of supply and demand (With some human greed involved but that, also, can be foreseen and countered). That's all these big words come down to. Even something like the Laffer curve (Government tax revenues increase, over the long run, when taxes are lowered) is easily understood. As well ,Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac as GSE's (Government Sponsored Enterprise) were public companies who reaped profits and distributed dividends and bonuses to Executives and Stockholders and then, when broke, had to been cleaned up with our taxpayer's dollars, that's the deal our government struck at their conception ( Not to mention empowering the likes of Barney Frank, but that's another story). To those who would throw up the Fed "Bailout" of Bear Stern's I would encourage them to ask Bear's stockholders how they fared before trying to argue that point.

Political voyeurism into American markets is, at best, too little too late, but usually inhibits or distorts market signals, prolongs crises, and generally makes things worse. The ethanol thing is another sad example of misallocation of both resources and taxpayer dollars. It seems that we demand that our political leaders "do something" so I guess we should be careful what we ask for.

I hope I am wrong about the economy but its not just me.

JM
Ramafuchs
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 15 Sep, 2008 08:22 pm
@JamesMorrison,
The death of American CAPITALISM is the birth of CIVILIZATION.
the days are numbered.
Tread slowly
Regret
Repent
Retrace.
Regards
Rama
0 Replies
 
 

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