36
   

McCain is blowing his election chances.

 
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 07:52 am
@McGentrix,
I always have to laugh when someone claims all the rich were "self made." Some of them were. Some of them inherited it. Paris Hilton certainly didn't work to become rich. Of course all those "Hollywood liberals" did work to become rich.

The Forbes list of US billionaires has about half of the top 20 inheriting their wealth: the Waltons, there are 4 on the list, the Koch brothers, 2, the Mars family, 2, Abigal Johnson.

What I find most interesting about the list is the attitudes of those on that list and what the self made billionaires say about taxes vs those that inherited. Gates, Buffet, Allen's viewpoints are pretty well known. The Kochs and Waltons views on taxes are almost diametrically opposed to that of Gates and Buffet.
McGentrix
 
  2  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 08:42 am
@parados,
And what of the business men and women who aren't the billionaires on the Forbes list? They are only millionaires and they far out number the few on your list. I know it's easy to point at Paris Hilton and shwo what a ditz she is and how she inherited her megabucks, but so what? Did her father work hard to give her that money? What about his father? I doubt you grasp the point.

Despite what you may believe, the great majority of wealth in America is created by hard work, not from whose loins you are yanked.
okie
 
  2  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 08:44 am
Sarah Palin, the vp pick! Always knew McCain is a maverick. All kinds of analysis over this will result, and it is a risky one, but first things that comes to mind is taking the women vote away from Obama, and pushing the Dems to appear more like the backward party.

I hope it works. I know very little about the woman, but hear good things. Inexperience is in my mind a downside as a vp for the old guy, McCain, but she is a governor with executive experience. I also wanted to see somebody picked like Romney that has done alot of the heavy lifting for McCain ever since he dropped out, and I thought he deserved it. However, the nominee has the right to pick whomever he wants, and I can see the advantages of this pick.
sozobe
 
  3  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 08:51 am
@okie,
Have been talking about it on the VP thread.

I think it's interesting for sure. But I think the pro-life aspect is big. I don't think she's going to get many Hillary supporters for that reason. (Pro-life administration making supreme court picks.)

Plus there is the scandal which I'm not seeing much about but I'm not sure why. Evidently Palin had a former brother-in-law fired, and fired people who would fire him. It's under investigation now. That smacks of both the attorney general scandal and more generally the Keating Five thing. Dangerous.

Plus, as you say, the youth and inexperience angle. Dunno.

Young guy with sage advice from VP (George W Bush/ Cheney) seems to work better than old guy with young upstart in the wings (George H.W. Bush/ Quayle).
okie
 
  2  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 09:02 am
@sozobe,
It isn't a safe pick I don't think. She will either help or hinder I think, possibly big time one way or the other. I am not particularly happy about it, as I thought it made sense to pick a more experienced vp, somebody that had actively run for the job, after all McCain will likely not be able to run again I don't think, if he wins now.

This could tell us something about McCain, which we probably already know, but I don't think he is comfortable with people around him that have previously opposed him. I hate to say that, but that is my impression.

Then I come back to the fact that usually after the focus is off the vp picks, people predominantly go back to voting for the candidate and tend to forget the vp, and once in office, the vps sometimes are nothing more than ceremonial positions. In McCain's case however, we needed something more than that.

There better not be any serious scandals. If there aren't, it may turn out okay.

These are my thoughts completely out of the blue, I have heard no analysis thus far.
Foxfyre
 
  2  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 09:10 am
@okie,
The pick is typical of McCain's maverick image. Do the unexpected. Break with tradition. Don't go with tried and true. Be willing to be different and all that. Palin is truly not a Washington insider, will be the only woman, and the only non-senator on the ticket. She will be the only one who has had ANY executive experience.

I have to believe McCain was savvy enough to check out the one scandal plagueing Palin and has determined it will not be a problem. Palin has one of the highest approval ratings as governor in the country. She is obviously likable, invites trust and confidence, and makes a good appearance. Cheney has forever changed the Veep as only a ceremonial position, and after four years in the trenches, Palin will no longer be 'too inexperienced'.

I hope it is a good choice too. I would have felt better had it been Meg Whitman, but McCain hasn't made too many dumb mistakes lately. He very well not have made one here.
okie
 
  2  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 09:18 am
@Foxfyre,
Good analysis, and this really injects even more nuances into this race. More cross currents to consider in terms of voter trends, etc. We should have all known it would be a darkhorse, but I kept thinking his staff might keep him on the straight and narrow. After all, playing the conservative hand was working. I'm not saying she isn't conservative, but it injects the element of the risky and less known with inexperience. As it was, McCain had the advantage of people gravitating back to the tried and true end of the spectrum to end up voting for him. This takes some of that away from him.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 09:21 am
@okie,
First European comments point to her strong conservatism - and political inexperience ... besides that it has been a surprise, of course.
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  3  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 09:43 am
@sozobe,
sozobe wrote:
I don't think she's going to get many Hillary supporters for that reason. (Pro-life administration making supreme court picks.)

Hopefully. Kinda obvious/cynical attempt to draw disappointed Hillary supporters by choosing a woman.
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 09:49 am
@DrewDad,
Yeah. Sullivan says the pick is "totally about electioneering ... and fundamentally unserious about governing."
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 10:23 am
It's really funny how McCain charges Obama of doing something to win votes rather than for the country. McCain is so senile, he can't see his own contradictions. ROFL
okie
 
  3  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 10:32 am
@cicerone imposter,
Did you just watch his introduction of Palen, ci, wow, no comparison to Obama, the man inspired. And he introduced her as the next vp, not president. Who is senile, ci?
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 10:34 am
@okie,
Palen Question
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  2  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 10:38 am
@okie,
Oh, I'm the one who is smiling today, Okie.

http://scienceblogs.com/afarensis/2006/10/27/intelligent_design_and_the_ala/

Good luck with that one.

Cycloptichorn
okie
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 11:03 am
@Cycloptichorn,
All shes saying is do not eliminate the fact that people may believe God created the whole thing. She is not saying teach that as a fact, just another alternative to what we don't know. We don't know, cyclops. What are you afraid of, anything that doesn't agree with you? Besides, the two could be combined. Both could have happened.
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 11:24 am
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:

Oh, I'm the one who is smiling today, Okie.

http://scienceblogs.com/afarensis/2006/10/27/intelligent_design_and_the_ala/

Good luck with that one.

Cycloptichorn


Ooooooohhhhhhh, ok, this pisses me off. I have no problem with someone being against abortion (I'm not, but I think there is an argument to be made there)....but creationism = hell no.
0 Replies
 
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 11:42 am
@DrewDad,
precisely
0 Replies
 
fbaezer
 
  5  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 11:45 am
Hats off to McCain. He made a very good strategical choice for the election (not for a good Vicepresident, that's another matter).
Let's see: Palin appeals to the religious right (not only pro-life, also a creationist!), to the American sense of frontier, to the NRA, to oil-related big business interests... and she's a nice looking woman who has one son with Down's Sindrome and another who's just going to Irak, just like Biden's. She embraces a lot of constituencies.
Cute & scary at the same time!

It will be interesting to see if the dems can really unmask her.
Brand WTF
 
  2  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 01:10 pm
@fbaezer,
The rightwingers are definitely jazzed about this pick...but if they were planning on getting disgruntled Hillary voters... they're not IMO.

Got Obama off the front page for 10 minutes though...got to give them points for that.

0 Replies
 
BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  0  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 01:15 pm
@fbaezer,
John McCain has always used women to further his personal interests. Once again. McCain has put his political goals before the good of the U.S.

BBB
 

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