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A Vice Presidental candidate thread.

 
 
slkshock7
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 10:41 am
@Cycloptichorn,
Cyclo wrote:
You do realize that women are much more likely to be pro-choice in America, don't you?


Not "pro-choice" in the Obama vernacular...i.e. any time, any reason, with Govt support...

Wikipedia wrote:

By gender, party, and region
A January 2003 CBS News/New York Times poll examined whether Americans thought abortion should be legal or not, and found variations in opinion which depended upon gender, party affiliation, and the region of the country. [11] The margin of error is +/- 4% for questions answered of the entire sample ("overall" figures) and may be higher for questions asked of subgroups (all other figures).[11]

Group "Generally available" "Available, but with stricter limits than now" "Not permitted"
Overall 39% 38% 22%
Women 37% 37% 24%
Men 40% 40% 20%



Sorry for the crude cut and paste....
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  3  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 10:50 am
One thing I've been reading about is that McCain and Palin don't really know each other. You could see that -- she kept kinda backing away at the end, then realized he was trying to give her a kiss on the cheek. Awkward.

Overall seemed fine. About what I'd expect, not worse or better.

I wonder how the baby will fit in? A female vice president, not unthinkable. A female vice president with a baby/ small child? That seems to have a few different levels to it.
okie
 
  2  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 10:53 am
@sozobe,
Regardless of how good this turns out, Palen appears to be a great story, and many little great stories within the story. The best things going for McCain and Palen, is they are genuine, they are sincere, they are real, no faking, they are what they are. They never prepared their whole lives to be president, they are true Americans.
sozobe
 
  3  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 10:58 am
@okie,
She does have a nice story.

But could she be president, if circumstances demand it?

What does she think about Iraq?

What does she think about China?

What does she think about North Korea?

What does she think about Afghanistan?

Aren't the Republicans the ones who keep saying a good story is not enough?

Pretty amazing that "On the Issues" (not a site I work for, but similar and one I check often) has NOTHING on foreign policy from her.
okie
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 11:06 am
@sozobe,
What does Obama think about all of those things? Does a law degree somehow give you knowledge so far above the rest of us? Does Obama know how many states there are in the union?
spendius
 
  2  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 11:07 am
@sozobe,
She seems a fast learner soz. It looks a winning ticket to me.

I think I'll let my 6 to 1 bet on Mr McCain ride.
sozobe
 
  2  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 11:09 am
@okie,
Obama's on record with all of those things.

Compare these two pages, if you will:

http://www.issues2000.org/Sarah_Palin.htm

http://www.issues2000.org/barack_obama.htm

edit: one more, for good measure:

http://www.issues2000.org/joe_biden.htm
okie
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 11:11 am
@spendius,
Hillary must be chewing nails today!
hahahahahahaha.

Going to Yale womens classes while Palen was out there actually doing something. Now the two roads meet. I love it.
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 11:13 am
@sozobe,
sozobe wrote:

Obama's on record with all of those things.

Compare these two pages, if you will:

http://www.issues2000.org/Sarah_Palin.htm

http://www.issues2000.org/barack_obama.htm

edit: one more, for good measure:

http://www.issues2000.org/joe_biden.htm




Everytime I look at Obama's page, these things stand out.

FactCheck: Yes, Obama endorsed Illinois handgun ban. (Apr 2008)
Respect 2nd Amendment, but local gun bans ok. (Feb 2008)
Ban semi-automatics, and more possession restrictions. (Jul 1998)



Ban, Ban, Ban, Ban, Ban = can't stand it.
0 Replies
 
slkshock7
 
  2  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 11:14 am
@Cycloptichorn,
Not real up on sarcasm today are you?

Anyway...
cyclo wrote:
Popularity isn't a substitute for knowing what you are talking about on issues.


Under this argument, McCain should wipe-up Obama during their debates.
Cycloptichorn
 
  2  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 11:17 am
@slkshock7,
Sure, except for the fact that McCain knows very, very little about most Domestic issues, and is an aggressive blow-hard on foreign ones. He's literally been stumped on the trail when asked about things like AIDS and women's issues.

McCain gives pat and simplified answers; he's going to look like an idiot next to Obama, and I think you know that.

Cycloptichorn
spendius
 
  4  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 11:20 am
@okie,
Was there a convention held somewhere recently okie?
McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 11:42 am
@Cycloptichorn,
That's what they said about Bush v. Gore... We all saw how that went.
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 11:57 am
@spendius,
spendius wrote:

Was there a convention held somewhere recently okie?


Yep. Score one for McCain.
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  3  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 12:03 pm
@okie,
okie wrote:

Regardless of how good this turns out, Palen appears to be a great story, and many little great stories within the story. The best things going for McCain and Palen, is they are genuine, they are sincere, they are real, no faking, they are what they are. They never prepared their whole lives to be president, they are true Americans.
Shocked OMG. Off the charts hypocrisy. What do you know about her? How many times have you asked that about Obama this year... and here you know even less... but you're okay with that. Unbelievable hypocrisy. This proves you make up your mind; then find reasons to support it… rather than actually thinking.
firefly
 
  5  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 12:30 pm
@spendius,
Women will not vote for Palin, just because she is a women. Gender alone is not the overriding factor. People who supported Hillary Clinton did so because of her positions on issues, not just her gender. Hillary even reminded them of that at the convention when she said, "This wasn't just about me"--it was about what she stood for. Palin and Clinton represent quite different positions on issues--including abortion--and Clinton's supporters are not likely to embrace Palin.
In fact, I would not be at all surprised if Hillary were to emerge as the main person to attack Palin, and to actively discourage women from voting for her simply on the basis of gender, because it is more important to have the right person for the job than to shatter that final glass ceiling with the wrong woman--and a woman who may not support those issues vital to most women. Women like Hillary Clinton and Geraldine Ferraro can more easily point this out, than the male Democratic candidates could.

McCain will not benefit substantially from Palin's gender. But she may increase his support with conservatives, and she should help him with the Christian right. Her "religious credentials" appear stronger than anything else she brings to the ticket in terms of her background or experience.

We know this about her when she was a student...

Quote:
Palin, who was also the head of the school Fellowship of Christian Athletes, would lead the team in prayer before games.


We know she supports the teaching of creationism

Quote:
While running for Governor of Alaska, Palin supported the teaching of creationism alongside evolution in schools,


We know she does not favor gay marriage

Quote:
Alaska was one of the first U.S. states to pass a constitutional ban on gay marriage, in 1998, along with Hawaii. Palin has stated that she supported the 1998 constitutional amendment.


She is against abortion

Quote:
Palin is strongly opposed to abortion and supports capital punishment


McCain wants, and needs, the support of the religious right, and, I think, that's Palin's main benefit on the ticket. If she happens to bring in a handful of women's votes that will be a bonus, but Hillary's supporters, who shared Hillary's positions on issues, will not embrace Palin in any significant numbers.

Palin may be a big fish in her very little pond, but she's not really ready for prime time yet--not when she still calls herself a "hockey mom"--and boasts of being involved with her PTA and serving as mayor of a town with less than 6,000 people. She has not even completed her first term as governor of Alaska. That McCain considers this significant "executive experience" makes me question his mental competence.

sozobe
 
  2  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 12:36 pm
@firefly,
firefly wrote:
In fact, I would not be at all surprised if Hillary were to emerge as the main person to attack Palin, and to actively discourage women from voting for her, because it is more important to have the right person for the job than to shatter that final glass ceiling with the wrong woman, and a woman who may not support those issues vital to most women.


Nicely stated. I hope that's what Hillary does.
OCCOM BILL
 
  2  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 12:50 pm
@sozobe,
sozobe wrote:

firefly wrote:
In fact, I would not be at all surprised if Hillary were to emerge as the main person to attack Palin, and to actively discourage women from voting for her, because it is more important to have the right person for the job than to shatter that final glass ceiling with the wrong woman, and a woman who may not support those issues vital to most women.


Nicely stated. I hope that's what Hillary does.
That is precisely what I would expect her to do. I would think a great number of Hill-people will find the naked pandering an insult... (the assumption that gender was their main reason for supporting Hillary, and that it's all that's required for their support). I would love to hear Lola weigh in here, since she was clearly a strong "our turn" advocate. I just don't see how they'll consider Palin one of them.

Ultimately; I think history will suggest that McCain has purchased a heavier dose of misogyny than he has sympathetic women with this choice.
BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 01:03 pm
@OCCOM BILL,
We are in agreement. John McCain has always used women to further his personal interests. Once again. McCain has put his political goals before the good of the U.S.

BBB
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Aug, 2008 01:28 pm
She's a bit of a cracker you must admit. A rose in a garden of thorns. I bet she can cook a bit too.

I never vote but I might reconsider with a candidate like that.

They have thousands of experts to advise them so all the other stuff is already taken care of. There's an election to win. On the campaign trail you might as well ask them to kiss your baby as their policy in Georgia.

I 0nce looked into Ted Heath's eyes from about 3 feet at the end of a campaign and I swear he never saw me. You could tell it wasn't the highlight of his life.

I try to look at us how they must see us.



 

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