A Vice Presidental candidate thread.

@firefly,

I think the US government would function normally (sic) whoever sits in the Oval Office. It would be scary to think otherwise.

It is something of a non sequitur to base an argument on the idea that the President becomes a dictator. The protracted discussions over a potential bail-out proves where real power resides. Mr Bush looks almost powerless. He is presumably going to sign whatever Congress agrees just as Mrs Palin would.

I have long suspected that those trying to foist Darwin onto 50 million kids and their families are unaware of the precarious state of a Union between political entitities of a disparate nature. What could Mrs Palin do domestically which could not achieve a consensus in Congress?

2 Replies

@spendius,

I posted that at Fri 27 Sep, 2008 10.48 am BST.

Is " Reply report Fri 26 Sep, 2008 09:48 pm" correct?

0 Replies

@spendius,

The government goes on functioning regardless of who sits in the Oval Office, but that does not mean it functions well.

The fact we need a $700 billion bail-out is directly related to the economic policies of Bush. He is a staunch proponent of deregulation. It was a lack of regulation that allowed banks and other lenders to engage in the irresponsible practices that led to the current problem with the economy and the largest bank failure in U.S. history.
And Bush has an MBA from Harvard--so he has some understanding of economic factors. Palin seems clueless regarding national economic issues, and McCain didn't even realize how serious the current problem was. I'm not sure I'd want to see how they might mangle the economy.

Quote:

Mr Bush looks almost powerless

That's because he has shown no leadership during this crisis. He waited a week before even addressing the country about the disintegrating state of the economy. The speech he made was designed to generate fears rather than instill confidence in the government's ability to deal with the crisis. He explained the problem, but did not really explain his bail-out package or try to gain public support for it. He could have chosen to address Congress, particularly in light of the seriousness of the situation, but he didn't do that either. He just hasn't been acting like a leader.

The president does not just sign whatever he is given. The president can veto legislation that he does not like--even the threat of a veto can affect the passage of legislation.
In the case of the current economic situation, the proposal they have been negotiating in Congress came directly from Bush--it's his proposal. The more they have examined it, the more questions they have about it, and the more problems they have found with it. A good part of the resistance to the proposal is from members of Bush's own party in the House. Bush is bucking his own party at a time of crisis--not a great state of affairs.

Quote:

What could Mrs Palin do domestically which could not achieve a consensus in Congress?

Are you kidding? Laughing

Just about everything.

Palin is not intellectually qualified to handle the job she is running for. It's not just her lack of experience. She shows no ability to be able to grasp complex issues. Her thinking is muddled, confused, simplistic, and concrete. These failings are apparently less glaring in her role as governor of Alaska, but there is no way she could handle the far more demanding job of being VP or president.
The people of Alaska may now be having doubts about her too since she's gotten all of this exposure.

2 Replies

@firefly,

It's interesting how people are still clueless about Palin. People who do not admit they are way in over their heads are the most dangerous. A yokel like Palin who "believes" she's ready for veep, and maybe president, shows how ignorant she is about national and international issues - including many voters who believe she's ready.

1 Reply

@firefly,

Quote:

He just hasn't been acting like a leader.

Doesn't that make my point. That he hasn't been acting like a leader because he isn't a leader in respect of this matter. Congress is.

Quote:

Quote:
What could Mrs Palin do domestically which could not achieve a consensus in Congress?

Are you kidding?

Just about everything.

Palin is not intellectually qualified to handle the job she is running for. It's not just her lack of experience. She shows no ability to be able to grasp complex issues. Her thinking is muddled, confused, simplistic, and concrete. These failings are apparently less glaring in her role as governor of Alaska, but there is no way she could handle the far more demanding job of being VP or president.
The people of Alaska may now be having doubts about her too since she's gotten all of this exposure.

Do you really think that answers my question firefly? What everything? Do you mean anything that goes against a consensus? I don't think "Are you kidding" and "Just about everything" are a sufficient springboard for another anti-Palin rant.

What about Dan Qualye and everybody said Mr Ford's head was a bit fuddled from football games.

1 Reply

@spendius,

It is not that easy to get a consensus in Congress, for anything. Bush, at the moment, is having problems getting the backing he wants from his own party to get his economic proposal passed.

Palin couldn't convince many people on any subject, unless someone else writes the script for her and supplies the ideas--her basic communication skills are poor, her thinking is shallow. She makes Dan Qualye look gifted.

I say again

Quote:

Palin is not intellectually qualified to handle the job she is running for. It's not just her lack of experience. She shows no ability to be able to grasp complex issues. Her thinking is muddled, confused, simplistic, and concrete. These failings are apparently less glaring in her role as governor of Alaska, but there is no way she could handle the far more demanding job of being VP or president.

This isn't a rant, it's a very considered opinion.

1 Reply

@firefly,

From what I have seen firefly there are millions of people who are not qualified to handle the job they do never mind trying to get.

It is a principle of bureaucratic structures that people get promoted to a job they cannot manage. I think that is one of Parkinson's theories.

1 Reply

@spendius,

It's The Peter Principle, Spendi.

0 Replies

@firefly,

firefly wrote: "Palin, must be the first major party candidate to be kept under such tight wraps, suggesting that she does have something to hide--even if it's only her ignorance of issues and lack of depth. But the Republicans clearly don't want this woman to open her mouth without a script. Shouldn't that tell you something?"

Reading opinion pieces and blogs, it appears that some are starting to feel sorry for Sarah Palin as she serves as the queen of ignorance and the pawn in McCain's ambitious endeavor to become prsident .

Example: "Poor Sarah"
http://warner.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/09/25/poor-sarah/?em

Palin has been compared to "Elle Woods" and "Forest Gump."

Should our hearts bleed for her?

0 Replies

@firefly,

Quote:

For those who think Sarah Palin is in that league, there is no problem. But her unscripted public appearances would lead most honest observers to think otherwise. When asked again this week about her puerile linkage of foreign policy proficiency and Alaska’s proximity to Russia, this time by Katie Couric of CBS News, here is what Ms. Palin said she meant:

“That Alaska has a very narrow maritime border between a foreign country, Russia, and on our other side, the land " boundary that we have with " Canada.”

She went on, but lost her way midsentence: “It’s funny that a comment like that was kind of made to " cari " I don’t know, you know? Reporters ...”

Ms. Couric said, “Mocked?”

“Yeah, mocked,” said Ms. Palin. “I guess that’s the word. Yeah.”

It is not just painful, but frightening to watch someone who could become the vice president of the United States stumbling around like this in an interview.

Yes, it was painful. I can forgive someone if they are just nervous in the interview and if they do better in subsequent interviews, but if this was a true reflection of her understanding of things, then she isn't even remotely qualified to be the VP.

2 Replies

President of Pakistan calls Sarah Palin 'gorgeous'

Quote:

Mr Zardari, who was widowed but nine months ago, called her "gorgeous" and made it clear he was happy to carry on gripping for some time.

See also vido clip:

0 Replies

@rosborne979,

A case of "it's way over her head" errors and omissions. What's more frightening is that she thinks she's ready as well as many conservatives. They also chose Bush; what more need be said?

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

What's more frightening is that she thinks she's ready...

This is perhaps the worst indictment of all. Because if Sarah really did understand the issues she wouldn't let the McCain campaign treat her like an embarrassment to them (which they are). If I was chosen for VP and my party treated me that way I would tell them where they could shove it. Sarah should do the same.

1 Reply

Here's a transcript of the video clip posted above:

(Jeanne Moos, CNN, New York, VOICE):

Welcome to the photo op follies.

<whisper: "step all the way over . . .">

Where handlers whisper urgent orders to the press pool. The pool gets to stay for a whopping 30 seconds or so getting pictures and then gets shown the door.

Sarah Palin . . .

<Palin shaking hands and saying, "So nice to meet you.">

raced around

to half a dozen of these

in two days

<Craig Ferguson: "it's gettin' like she's speed datin' the world leaders . . . you know . . . hello, I'm the president of Pakistan, I like nuclear weapons, long walks on the beach, and you! (Laughter)>

Comedian Craig Ferguson was prophetic. Pakistan's leader did act like it was almost a date...

<Clip of Palin shaking hands with Zardari.>

telling Palin how gorgeous she is . . .

gushing over her popularity. . .

and when a photog asked for another handshake, threatening a hug. . .

But the press and the governor aren't so lovey dovey with complaints that Palin is dodging questions which brings us to the most frequently heard phrase at a photo op. . .

<"thank you very much--back out the same way--thank you">

It's not gratitude--it's ATTITUDE. . .

<thank you>

commonly used to drown out pesky questions. . .

<Reporter: "...what did you learn from your meetings?" Handlers: "Thank you pool, thank you so much pool, we're going to head out...>

<Handler cuts off question to governor: "thank you guys, please thank you (as he shows the press the door) . . . okay guys, everyone keeps moving." >

<Jeanne Moos: "In a world of photo ops, thank you doesn't always mean thank you. It means, 'shut up and get out.'>

<Again, handler cuts off question to governor: "thank you guys, thank you very much...>

The press gets thanked all the way out the door.

<shows reporters getting repeatedly thanked out the door>

And when they finally did get a question answered, it wasn't much to be thankful for.

<Reporter: "Governor, how's your day going so far?" Palin: "It's going grrreat. These meetings are very informative and helpful.">

One thing the media can't say is that their job is thankless...

<Chorus of handlers saying thanks as they show press out the door; Palin waves good-bye and says, "thanks guys.">

At photo ops, the definition of "thanks" is:

<Sarah Palin: "Thanks but no thanks."

Jeanne Moos, CNN, New York

0 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

Maybe we don't need intellectuals and lawyers to run the country. They've tried, and look where we are now?

1 Reply

@rosborne979,

Quote:

then she isn't even remotely qualified to be the VP.

In what way are you qualified ros to pass judgment on that? Have you got a crystal ball?

0 Replies

@rosborne979,

Quote:

If I was chosen for VP and my party treated me that way I would tell them where they could shove it. Sarah should do the same.

Somebody should tell ros that there's no chance of that. He's off on an "If I was King of Siam" fantasy.

He's also not very gallant.

1 Reply

@spendius,

spendi, Who are you emulating with your ideas on ID, politics, and science?

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

Too long a list c.i. The ones who are always saying something useful and who say it interestingly and without qualification. They never mention fossils outside of creating a nut-job character to take the piss out of.

It's always the living flesh using that term materialistically.

0 Replies

@okie,

Quote:

Maybe we don't need intellectuals and lawyers to run the country. They've tried, and look where we are now?

Who are you talking about?

1 Reply

A Vice Presidental candidate thread.

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know