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President Bush's speech to the Nation

 
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Sep, 2003 09:56 am
Thanks, guys.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Sep, 2003 09:58 am
The conservatives are now hijacking the California political system with a recall - all accomplished with less than a few million bucks. Wouldn't it be funny if John Doe won?
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Tartarin
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Sep, 2003 10:05 am
The really funny thing (ha ha) will be if the recall doesn't go through and CA will have spent all these bucks and all this time and all this folderol on naught at a time when both money and time are badly needed for other matters.

If that should happen -- or indeed, if Bustamante wins -- I hope there are some murderous things written and said about the guys and the party which set this in motion.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Sep, 2003 10:10 am
Tartar, It's a close call between the yes and no on the recall. I think it's gonna stay that way until October 7. Senator Diane Feinstein has a plug on t.v. now about voting "no" on the recall.
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blueveinedthrobber
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Sep, 2003 10:24 am
with the appearance of italgato can NY Zanger, Stock and Slaw and the rest of the cast be far behind?
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Tartarin
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Sep, 2003 11:03 am
I'm moving into a puptent.
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hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Sep, 2003 11:52 am
Tartarin wrote:
I'm moving into a puptent.

Speaking of which, how is the puppy? Smile
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joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Sep, 2003 12:32 pm
Italgato wrote:
First of all, Joe from Chicago points out that my comment that. except for the sciences, most of the subjects at the University of Chicago lean very far to the left, is incorrect since Economics at Chicago leans to the right. Joe from Chicago evidently is not aware that Economics is referred to as "The dismal SCIENCE>"

I've read Heilbronner and Robbins and even Ricardo: I'm well aware that economics is described as the "dismal science." It's also a social science. Are you saying that all the social sciences (e.g. political science, anthropology, sociology, etc.) at Univ. of Chicago are equally free from liberal bias?

Italgato wrote:
Now, as to my point concerning Posner. Joe from Chicago asks what's the point of my introduction? The point is that if you know of Posner, you know that he is one of the foremost commentators on the law today.

Well, he certainly is a prolific commentator, I'll give you that. But he is not uniquely influential in American jurisprudence.

Italgato wrote:
I am sorry to hear that he might have been ignorned at the U. OF M. Law School. I don't think he was. I believe that Joe from Chicago may have fallen asleep when Posner was mentioned.

Quite possible. I recall having some 8:00 classes.

Italgato wrote:
Samdford Levinson, for the University of Texas Law School has said-regarding one of Posner's chief works- "Overcoming Law" that "Posner can be compared only to people like Holmes, William O. Douglas. Jerome Frank and William Story." I hope that Joe from Chicago knows who those last four individuals are.

I've read works by each of those individuals. I've even read stuff by Sandy Levinson. Have you?

Italgato wrote:
I also am certain that the U. Of M. Law School did mention Judge Posner since he was appointed as the chief mediator in November 1999 in the Microsoft Antitrust case.

That was over a decade after I graduated. I stopped attending classes once I got my degree.

Italgato wrote:
Again, I hope Joe from Chicago did not miss that lecture.

Sadly, I must have.

Italgato wrote:
Finally, Joe from Chicago missed my point in listing the U. of Michigan as seventh among USA law schools. He says it is a fine law school. Granted. My point was that it was seventh and there are at least six that are better.

That goes without saying, if you buy into the notion that the rankings actually mean anything. I don't, but then I'm not all hung up on how high my law school ranked in comparison to others. I got an excellent education, I got a good job, that's pretty much all that counts.

Italgato wrote:
It is clear to me that Joe from Chicago, missed, among other things, the fact that my listing of U. Of Michican as the seventh best law school in the country as not only a boost to the school but also a SUBTLE knock insofar as it was ranked Seventh instead of first. second, third or fourth.

What? You were actually showing contempt for my alma mater??? Oh, what cruel disappointment, what bitter irony! My secret shame is exposed: I may have gone to a law school ranked better than hundreds of others, but I did not go to Harvard or Yale.

Really, gato, this childish game of "my school can beat up your school" is a confession that you have no genuine arguments left. You've asked people here about their educational background, ethnic heritage, jobs -- all with the intention of using that information to construct these silly, puerile little insults. Meanwhile, you divulge only the barest details of your own background, no doubt to insulate yourself from attacks in kind.

Well, I won't engage in that kind of spitball tossing. I have no interest in your educational background, your ethnic heritage, or your profession, gato. Stick to the issues and leave the petty taunts for your family and friends.

Italgato wrote:
Perhaps I should flesh out my messages more thoroughly. Subtlety does not seem to make the point.

Gato, you give yourself far too much credit. Subtlety has nothing to do with it: you fail to make the point.
0 Replies
 
BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Sep, 2003 03:37 pm
Italgato
Italgato, I started the following topic just for you.

---BumbleBeeBoogie

http://www.able2know.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=11974&highlight=&sid=29d8294ae33f90f377ac1d3839595c5e
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Sep, 2003 03:43 pm
joe, There's much truth in the fact that it doesn't matter which college one graduates from, but how much that education was worth to that individual. College performance and real world accomplishments are two different things - IMHO.
0 Replies
 
joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Sep, 2003 11:05 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
joe, There's much truth in the fact that it doesn't matter which college one graduates from, but how much that education was worth to that individual. College performance and real world accomplishments are two different things - IMHO.

I concur.
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petunia555555
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Sep, 2003 10:10 am
I read through the political and religious threads, I find them somewhat interesting, but I have never contributed. They do not seem to stay on topic. I'm not as educated as most of you. I read and listen to the news, have formed opinions, but have been willing to listen to other people's ideas and opinions and have over years, I think, evolved and changed a lot of my ideas..that is part of growing and growing up, I think. I have never contributed to these threads because of the attacks that seem to almost ALWAYS occur. I do not understand how disagreement always becomes so personal! Maybe I'm wrong or overly sensitive, but I do not think so. We talk about and encourage diversity and debate, but I do not think we really believe in it.

Now, my paltry thoughts on George W. Bush, et. al. We should not have gotten into this war in Iraq in the first place. He has been badly advised and encouraged by those old cronies...but, we are in this mess and I do believe we have to finish it. We cannot leave those people to fend for themselves and end up with Saddam returning or having something or someone even worse! Yes, our children are suffering in our schools and being "left behind."

The individual states are being ordered to implement tests and rigid rules in the schools with no financial back-up from the Federal government and every state is floundering to carry them out and we are all suffering with lost jobs, cut-backs of textbooks, teachers and the arts. Social Security is suffering, Medicare is suffering, our older people are SUFFERING and the poor are SUFFERING. One way to help Social Security would be to take all of the millionaires of the rolls, it was not created to help them...but I digress.

Mr. Bush will get is $87 billion, how much of that will Halliburton get? More than the people in Iraq and Afghanistan will receive. We have left the Afghans behind because they really have nothing to offer us, just rocks and dirt and misery. Their schools do not even have pencils and paper for the students to write with. What are we doing there?
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BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Sep, 2003 10:22 am
petunia555555
petunia555555, welcome to Able2Know. You are a breath of fresh air on this site. Your comments reveal deep and thoughtful wisdom. Not only that, they are right on target.

As for getting off topic, yes that happens all the time, but some nosey and impudent A2Ker will step in and remind the misbehavers of the errors of their ways. A2Kers are, for the most part, very civil discussers even when disagreeing. Those that aren't usually don't stay long because they are looking for a fight, not an intelligent search for the wisdom you already have.

I hope you will visit A2K often and post a lot.

---BumbleBeeBoogie Very Happy
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petunia555555
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Sep, 2003 10:25 am
BBB: Thank you for your response. I am here a lot, read a lot. It takes a while to screw up my courage, sometimes I just cannot keep my mouth shut. I will continue to read and posting when I feel I have something to contribute so BEWARE! Twisted Evil Laughing
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Sep, 2003 11:25 am
petunia, Since we don't have information on how that $87 billion will be used, I must draw some conclusions on our own. This is how I see it: the military is more or less paid for - their salaries and whatever benefits they get, but the unknowables are the contracts with the civilian companies that provide the logistics such as food and other services. These contracts are given to the subsidiaries of Halliburton, and I also presume that most of the $87 billion will go to them.
0 Replies
 
petunia555555
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Sep, 2003 11:32 am
Cicerone...I fear you are right, and what have they done so far? I have heard and read about a mother who has started a campaign for people to send air conditioners to the soldiers in Iraq because the "support" companies have not supplied them. We are asking a lot of our soldiers and they need to be taken care of and kept safe...this should be a priority.

Why isn't anyone on Capitol Hill concerned about the fact that Halliburton has been given all of these no-bid contracts...a company that used to be run by our now invisible vice-president?

I think so much of the rage I feel about these things is the feeling of impotence...is there nothing we can do, nothing we can say? Apparently not, for if you state you disagree, you are considered unpatriotic or "cursed" as a liberal, as if that is the worse thing I've ever been called.
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InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Sep, 2003 11:46 am
Exactly, there is a huge conflict of interest involved here with Halliburtion and Cheney, and no one is pursuing the issue.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Sep, 2003 11:46 am
Here's a interesting link on the privatization of logistics for our military. http://www.casi.org.uk/discuss/2003/msg03891.html
0 Replies
 
petunia555555
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Sep, 2003 11:57 am
Cicerone, thank you for that article. When I read and hear these stories I just Rolling Eyes and feel very sad and angry. Angry at Mr. Bush and Rumsfeld, at all of them, really. Why is Rumsfeld so resistant to sending more troops if that is what is needed? Is it because he will have to back pedal, eat crow and say he was wrong? Good grief, is his pride more important than making sure the people and soldiers in Iraq are protected?

I know that we still have some soldiers in Afghanistan, but why is that country brushed aside as unimportant when tribal leaders are again taking over their little areas and creating chaos everywhere?

Where will we go next?
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Sep, 2003 12:00 pm
Conscription is next for our country.
0 Replies
 
 

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