4 years later...

My ex said a couple of things that I remember well, that hit me like a baseball bat to the psyche. That was twelve years ago now.

We don't talk all the time, but do keep in touch, and share some of our day to day concerns. I know now that while those things he said were not mistakes, he meant them, that he meant them in the pressure at the time, but not as an overall lifetime viewpoint. Free of being trapped in the marriage, from his point, he shows in his conversation much the opposite views.

That doesn't mean that either of us want to get back together, but that the (rage) of the time has stopped clouding the scene.

Not that I suggest you 'just get along'. But I do suggest just not dwelling on it. You know you are a valuable person. Don't let his comment hit your self-esteem in such a destructive way. Learning to look at your own possible foibles is good. Being undermined by it, no, no.

I can't help but wondering if there is some truth in what he said. Is the basics of who I am holding me back from being fully happy?

Yes, there could be some truth, and understanding how you tick and how others react to it is useful, with or without therapy.

Fully happy? What's that? Sometimes I think it is a trait of the brain's memory of some ephemeral moments in time when daily concerns were damped down and one lived intensely in the doing, the scuba diving, the drawing, the music making, whatever.

I had an ex say something to me as well that has shaped almost every thing I do to this day.

I was angry at him and felt as though he was just constantly telling me how to live my life. I said " you are not my father"

He said " Someone has to be. You keep acting like a child. How else should I deal with you?"

My biggest fear at most times now, thanks to that comment, is that people will not take me seriously.They may see me as a young irresponsible person who's opinions don't matter because of my age. Even though I am over 30 years old, I still feel like a child because of his comment almost 9 years ago.

What he said did not lead to such a life tragedy as your husbands words did, but I can understand the feeling of wondering if it was true, and then frustration that you are allowing those words to continue to sting you years later.

I wish I had a suggestion to help you deal with that, but obviously I can not deal with my own

But I do understand.

I'm guessing that this is the issue, more than the fact that your husband made that statement, right?

It doesn't hurt to roll up your sleeves and really tackle trying to understand family dynamics and how they may have shaped you. A lot of times what may be or may have been painfully obvious to outsiders while you were growing up are "hidden" to the child who actually lived through them, so the adult child looking back cannot see things clearly.

Dysfunctional parents can be experts at hiding this from their kids, and they rarely own up to any of it. EVEN with the facts right in front of them.

I couldn't afford counseling, so I read probably 3,000 Web sites on dysfunctional families, alcoholics, drug addiction, personality disorders in the DSM IV, and several books from the library.

Armed with that, I "relived" my whole childhood from this new "educated" and "adult" perspective. I also imagined what my parents were doing when not in the home. I imagined what other adults thought of them. I became that "great cloud of witnesses."

There are secrets that can be revealed, that parents would never tell you themselves.

During the deconstruction, I was comforted by a little fact I had learned in Psychology 101.

Many decades ago, there were two monkeys used in a psych test. One was raised without any physical contact. He was fed through a metal feeder. The other was fed through a metal feeder covered with terry cloth, so this monkey had a little "comfort."

They then put the two monkeys in with a general population of monkeys. They both had a difficult time adjusting, but the one with the terry cloth did better. BUT as a footnote, after quite some time, the more "disturbed" monkey was able to intergrate WITH encouragement and guidance from the members of the general population.

Yes, it would have been easier if I could have researched one aspect of family dysfuntion and go down that particular path. BUT, since I hadn't a clue, I had to research them all.

This is what I found out.

My mother was an alcoholic, who lied and claimed she was a workaholic. My mom was never faithful to any of her four husbands. My mom hated her own parents (and all of her other relatives) OR hated herself in their presence so much, that she moved away from them when I was little. I had no aunts, uncles, grandparents, cousins, and until recently never knew my own father. I was effectively removed from anybody who may have acted as an advocate for me. I did have a lot of friends and a lot of my friends' parents acted as mentors for me. My mom hated every one of them. I came to believe that anyone who would be my friend or mentor must have some sort of personality problem that they would waste their time with someone like myself. My mom's personality matches that of the narcissist. My mom did hate her mother. I am much like my grandmother, at least from the very little I know about her. I like English literature and music. My grandmother was a concert pianist who taught piano. My mom didn't take to it, but I did. My mom is very jealous of my love for the piano. She is very competitive with me. She is very controlling much like the men who keep their girlfriends away from family and friends, so the girl has no one she can turn to for help and perspective. Once that is accomplished, the men strip the girl of her sel-esteem, her money, her time and energy; then she doesn't have the money, energy, self-esteem, or contacts to GET AWAY.

My step-father was an amazing man, but with a temper. He was obsessive-compulsive, much like Monk. He was a gambler.

My sister did a lot of drugs and used to tell my mother that I was up to something to throw the pressure off of herself, YET my mom could never catch me doing anything like that, so my mom just treated me every day as if I were doing something wrong. I was constantly yelled at and every problem in the house was somehow MY fault.

I was the scapegoat. This is the person everyone blames. It's the person least likely to be at fault and least likely to be able to defend themselves. It's usually the most straightfoward and honest and youngest (or newest member, if it's a committee environment) in the group.

After much research, I was able to determine, "Hey, these people were really very human with their own list of issues they were dealing with."

And much of their behavior toward me had nothing to do with me, and everything to do with who they were and what their issues, games, lies, and their own self deception was all about.

Big deal.

I'm reminded of a line in My Fair Lady.

"I should never have learned how to be a lady, except for Col. Pickering. Col. Pickering treats me like a lady and always will."

We "learn" who we are and what our pecking order is by HOW WE ARE TREATED.

But you can change that "learning" yourself, if you are willing to do the work.

After all that, the family crap in my head and pretty much how it affected who I am and who I am becoming just UNdramatically FIZZLED like a balloon SLOWLY releasing all its gas.

Frankly, I expected more.

There was a moment of, "Oh..."

And then it was gone.

Thank you for the lending ears and comments.

I am the youngest of 6. My dad is 100% Italian, if that matters ,with the temper that the heritage has a reputation for. My mother never graduated high school and was the 6th of 7 in a poor farming family.
----this would describe how my father treated my mother.
My father worked two jobs just to feed us all. My oldest brother was hyperactive, my oldest sister almost didn't survive a car accident at 17 years old and our family was highly disfunctional. There was no alcoholism or addiction of any type that I know of but my father was both physically and verbally abusive. He made us all feel as though we were useless and stupid.

I think its safe to say that we all lack a lot of self-esteem as adults. So in saying all of that, I'd describe myself as a deep thinker, a little timid in new social settings and overall a quiet person. I feel emotions very deeply. I was extremely committed to my husband and kids. I'm not the one who has the reputation of being the life of the party. Don't get me wrong, I'm not anti-social, I just take a little time to warm up.

So, does all this make me less desirable as an individual? That is how my ex makes me feel, and 4 years later I have still not encountered an available guy to spend time with. I have made some wonderful girlfriends but will men see through the superficial and give a chance to see who I really am?

I'm just feeling a little lost lately, I have always felt content with my adult life and now I'm not sure.

Marty, one of the fundamental mistakes is, that you think you need
a man in your life to be happy. As you said "4 years later I still haven't
found an available guy to spend time with". You seem to make this your
life goal: meet another guy, get married and have someone watching
over you again.

I think you subconsciously send out a message that you are looking for a
relationship, and most guys pick up on this.

Why not come to terms with the fact that you are right now without a significant other, and make the best of it. Live your life with your kids
and your friends and enjoy each other. Just live for yourself, and don't
assume that a guy will bring happiness. Another person should be
an added benefit to your life, but not the one who brings happiness.
You are the only one who is responsible for your own contentment in
life. If you are not comfortable with yourself and your life situation, no
one else will either.

If you get out there, radiate confidence and a contentment within yourself and a satisfied life, you will become very interesting to many people,
and you will attract the right kind of man who will be an asset to your life,
but he never should become a replacement for forlorn feelings.

You are so pretty, you have done so much already for yourself, you
just need to gain more confidence, and a shift in your way of thinking.
Everything will fall in place then, believe me!

Yes, Calamity is right on target!!!

Make a list of everything you ever enjoyed doing or thought you might like to do, and DO IT!

You will radiate with an unstoppable, contagious, vivacious, immensely attractive, confident, euphoric, inner glow!!!!

The man of your dreams is already there, already enjoying all the things you love and will discover that you love!!!

While you're sitting quietly at gatherings, waiting to be "found," the man of your dreams is having a ball already living the life you want.

So, what's on YOUR list???

Will you share???

omigod!

When you ex sees what kind of person you can become without him and his criticism, he will be (as Scarlett says) "Pea green with envy!"

Living well is the sweetest revenge!!!!

Quoting myself -

Fully happy? What's that? Sometimes I think it is a trait of the brain's memory of some ephemeral moments in time when daily concerns were damped down and one lived intensely in the doing, the scuba diving, the drawing, the music making, whatever.



I meant to add -

In time, I'm learning to catch on to the pleasure in the doing much more immediately - whether the doing is thinking or some physical experience, or both together... my own happiness.

I hear what you are all saying and it must be subconscious. I don't feel that my main focus is finding a replacement. I really enjoy the time I have with my kids and the time I have with my friends. I run and have coffee every weekend with a good friend of mine. Enjoy girls night out as well as time I spend alone reading or catching a movie.

I think I'm hung up on the fact that I feel my ex was telling me that I'm less of a person as he is because of my upbringing. The way I was raised is something I have no control over. But I feel that he was telling me that I'm undesirable because of something that I cannot change and never will.

I would like to meet a guy, it's not necessarily my number one priority for finding happiness. I just worry that men won't see past the quiet girl to get to know who I am. I don't see myself marrying again but I also would like to spend some of my time with a companion.

Very interesting, however, I don't feel that my ex has the feelings for me that would make him even capable of feeling envy.

Oh, I see.

The right man will.

There is someone for everyone, as they say.

It takes all kinds of people in the world.

There's a terrific man out there who wants a quiet girl and who will take time to get to know her and will cherish her.

I just wonder, how are you going to find him?

On the jogging trail?

Having coffee with friends?

At the movies?

Hanging out with your kids?

When you go shopping for something, well, you gots to shop.

That's what I'd like to know. As far as my list? After I got off my ass and stopped crying I joined a hiking group, started running, finished a half marathon, a triathlon, a few 5k's, hiked into the Grand Canyon, spent two weeks in Europe, took my son on a trip to the Galapagos, took a mountaineering first aid class and am currently signed up for a alpine scrambling class.

So I've been out enjoying my life as a single person.

Oh wow!

I am so impressed!

None of those guys responded to that?

I AM surprised.

Are you "advertising"?

I mean, if you are available, are you letting your potential "client" know?

Men do that all the time with women.

They'll find out what the woman wants or needs or hopes for, and then they'll figure out a way to be the one who makes that happen for them.

What can you bring to the table in a new relationship?

Find someone who wants that.

Offer to bring it.

This is why I'm wondering if who I am from a very basic level is why I'm: #1-divorced and #2-still dateless

Since you are quiet, maybe you are a good listener?

Some men really like to talk.

Maybe there's someone who would really like to hike or run, but who just needs a push or a mentor?

Maybe there's something you'd like to do, but you'd like a mentor?

OMG-I think I'm having a mid-life crisis!

Nope.

I don't think so.

You sound pretty darn amazing to me.

I think that now, you are just ready.

Just NOW, you are ready.

I mean, you gots to be ready, right?

And NOW you are.