Softener resin escaping

I think this is a Fleck 5600 Econominder valve and it looks the same as the valve that's on the Meyer at my local hadware store. Is it a good valve and can it be repaired?

http://www.softenerparts.com/images/56m.jpg

Let battle commence! Laughing

0 Replies

Re: Fire Water

Zozzie wrote:

H2O_MAN wrote:
We do have some spirited H2O discussions.

Yes I SEE that!! It's hilarious, interesting and confusing though. How can so many "experts" be so opposed in their views and opinions? Errr maybe you shouldn't answer that. But I'm the kinda fella to take it all in and filter it through my own noggin and decide what's best for ME.

Who ya callin' an expert!.... that may be the problem. IMO, there are no experts here. There are 2-4 guys here with very varied experience with divergent opinions and more important, different agendas.

I am an independent dealer and have been answering questions like yours in usenet newsgroups (Google Groups now) and on web site forums like yours since Jan 1997. And I've been selling only online since the end of 2004 when I closed my local dealership that I opened in 1987. I sell to DIYers or wannabe DIYers that assemble, install and service the equipment or hire a plumber to install it. I do not sell into Canada.

You can ask the others for their background but one is a customer of mine that's very unhappy with me, and another has been an installer for Rainsoft and Ecowater for 20+/- years and has staked out able2know as his forum while selling as a local dealer in GA for a few years.

Zozzie wrote:

Yes I will be buying new (rather than trying to fix my 28yr old Meyers mechanical timer ol' blister) and of couse it will be with a modern valve. I was just looking in our Yellow pages and in the city we have -
Culligan (of course).
Aqua Fine.
Water Depot.
Ecowater.
Dr. H2O Inc.
- plus a few independant plumbers who advertize water softeners.

Any opinions on any of those names?

Any idea what valve the Meyers uses? Fleck? Clack? (I can feel WWIII starting again!).

Any opionions on self-installation? I installed my current one 28 years ago and do all my own plumbing.

Quote:
If you are able to R&R the system yourself check out North Star.

I'll check around to see if anyone sells it. Thanks! This is a great forum.

Let battle commence! I should PM Gary S and get him fired up.

Water Depot sells the Clack WS line of control valves.

Myers is/was a pump company and sells private labeled water treatment equipment. The company will be buying the component parts and assembling the softener and putting their Myers name on it.

I don't use a private label name. They could be using Autotrol, Clack, Erie or Fleck valves. Many companies that used Fleck for decades are now using Clack valves. I sell the softener naming the component parts using the manufacturers' names for each. None of the control valve manufacturers have their names on them and never have in 50+ years. It's designed to keep the consumer ignorant. AND, dependent on a local dealer as you're being advised to do by some here.

You should buy a new softener and install it yourself. As a Fleck guy for 17+ years until I learned about Clack's design etc., on all levels of comparison, Clack is the best control valve for a DIYer.

So ya think I get fired up huh... I'm not a very PC kinda guy and tend to poke back when poked but I don't get angry. Actually I laugh a lot while reading the 'competition's' remarks aimed at BSing posters and preventing me from making a sale and to prevent online sales by anyone but...

The North Star is an overpriced Ecowater made the same as a Sears Kenmore, GE at Home Depot, Whirlpool at Lowe's and mortonsalt,com, softener in a two separate tank version sold through plumbing supply houses. It uses the same low quality rotary disc valve the others do. Stay away from all of them if you want a softener that will last as the Fleck valve did on your Meyers.

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Re: Fire Water

Quote:

You can ask the others for their background but one is a customer of mine that's very unhappy with me,

Maybe you sold him a Clack? Laughing

:wink:

Ahhh sorry about that; I just couldn't resist.

Quote:

Let battle commence! I should PM Gary S and get him fired up.

I didn't have to did I? You found this all by yourself.

Quote:

Water Depot sells the Clack WS line of control valves.

Ok duly noted. I've gotta go past there this afternoon. I'll drop in.

Quote:

None of the control valve manufacturers have their names on them

Iwas at the store this a/m that sells the Meyers and me and the store fella looked and couldn't see a name on the valve. The pic of it is above.

Quote:

Clack is the best control valve for a DIYer.

That's me - a DIY'er.

Quote:

The North Star is......the same as a.......GE at Home Depot......It uses the same low quality rotary disc valve the others do. Stay away from all of them if you want a softener that will last as the Fleck valve did on your Meyers.

So what valve does NS & GE use?

So you're a Clack man but think that Fleck is ok too eh? Of course my old brass valve (was it a Fleck?) will be nothing like the new plastic jobbies.

I'm taking all this in (your opinion and H20's) and making copius notes. I don't want to get between you two but I'm now aware of Flacks and Clecks (or is it Flecks and Clicks?). I'm way more confused than I was yesterday but at least I'm lernin' !! Many thanks guys. I'm going out for an hour to look at Water Depot and Home Depot and get an xmas tree. You guys kick the $hit outta each other while I'm gone. Laughing

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Re: Fire Water

H2O_MAN wrote:

Wait for it . . .

Gary Slusser wrote:

Zozzie wrote:
H2O_MAN wrote:
We do have some spirited H2O discussions.

Yes I SEE that!! It's hilarious, interesting and confusing though. How can so many "experts" be so opposed in their views and opinions? Errr maybe you shouldn't answer that. But I'm the kinda fella to take it all in and filter it through my own noggin and decide what's best for ME.

Who ya callin' an expert!.... that may be the problem. IMO, there are no experts here. There are 2-4 guys here with very varied experience with divergent opinions and more important, different agendas.

I am an independent dealer and have been answering questions like yours in usenet newsgroups (Google Groups now) and on web site forums like yours since Jan 1997. And I've been selling only online since the end of 2004 when I closed my local dealership that I opened in 1987. I sell to DIYers or wannabe DIYers that assemble, install and service the equipment or hire a plumber to install it. I do not sell into Canada.

You can ask the others for their background but one is a customer of mine that's very unhappy with me,
and another has been an installer for Rainsoft and Ecowater for 20+/- years and has staked out able2know as his forum while selling as a local dealer in GA for a few years.

That didn't take long now did it Rolling Eyes

Except for the fact that I am an independent H2O specialist servicing Nort Georgia,
the information he continues to post concerning myself is incorrect, but I have
come to expect this particular individual to employ unethical tactics and practices.

Good luck with your quest Zozzie Cool

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Re: Fire Water

Quote:

That didn't take long now did it
Except for the fact that I am an independent H2O specialist servicing Nort Georgia,
the information he continues to post concerning myself is incorrect, but I have
come to expect this particular individual to employ unethical tactics and practices.
Good luck with your quest Zozzie

You two quite needlin' each other or I'll come down there and kick the ever lovin' resin outta ya both. Start yer own threads if ya wanna take pot-shots at each other. This my thread! Laughing

Now shake hands and make up. Sheesh, yer both just like kids.

I just got back from visiting the Water Depot and Home Depot and no-one there knew anything about their units so they're off my short list. I knew more than they did.

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Re: Fire Water

Zozzie wrote:

I just got back from visiting the Water Depot and Home Depot and no-one there knew anything about their units so they're off my short list. I knew more than they did.

Chances are real good that unless the seller also installs and services what he or she is selling ~ you will be more knowledgeable on the subject than they are.

Keep us updated.

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Re: Fire Water

Zozzie wrote:

Quote:
Clack is the best control valve for a DIYer.

That's me - a DIY'er.

The North Star is......the same as a.......GE at Home Depot......It uses the same low quality rotary disc valve the others do. Stay away from all of them if you want a softener that will last as the Fleck valve did on your Meyers.

Zozzie wrote:

So what valve does NS & GE use?

Under the cover the same valve is used on all of those brands; including the NS.

Zozzie wrote:

So you're a Clack man but think that Fleck is ok too eh? Of course my old brass valve (was it a Fleck?) will be nothing like the new plastic jobbies.

Yes, you probably have a Fleck 2500. A brass valve. The parts for a 2510 fit it and you use the same special Fleck tools to replace the seals and spacers. The only difference between the 2500 and 2510 is brass or Noryl (plastic), Noryl is best and with the 2510 you get the option of mechanical or SE timer. Mechanical is best.

The Clack WS-1 is better on all levels but especially to repair it and it has features the Fleck 2510 or the 5600 do not. Like soft water brining, Pre fill and variable reserve.

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Re: Fire Water

Gary Slusser wrote:

...........mechanical or SE timer. Mechanical is best..................The Clack WS-1 is better on all levels.

But isn't the WS-1 an electronic timer? Now I am confused.

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Re: Fire Water

Zozzie wrote:

Gary Slusser wrote:
...........mechanical or SE timer. Mechanical is best..................The Clack WS-1 is better on all levels.

But isn't the WS-1 an electronic timer? Now I am confused.

LOL!

It's only "best" if he is selling it.

One guy in Ohio has reported that he does not like the SE electronics.
I have hundreds of 2510 SE valves in service and they are problem free.
My clients prefer the Fleck SE timer over the Fleck mechanical timer.
Justalurker has proven that Clack has plain jane electronics - nothing special.
I don't think Clack has a mechanical timer ...

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Re: Fire Water
H2O_Man and Gary S, what's your opinion on these local softeners that I've found -

http://www.doctorh2o.ca/WaterSofteners.shtml

http://www.wrcpurifying.com/pdfs/softeners_concept.pdf

Can that valve be disassembled in 5 minutes as the .pdf claims?

http://www.softenerparts.com/images/56m.jpg

Ok go!

http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd298/Zozzie1/fighting1.gif

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Re: Fire Water
Zozzie,

The first softener link IS the new Fleck 7000 control valve that Fleck builds and sells which was designed by Fleck employed Fleck engineers.

Zozzie wrote:

http://www.wrcpurifying.com/pdfs/softeners_concept.pdf

Can that valve be disassembled in 5 minutes as the .pdf claims?

Is that "it'll need to be disassembled in 5 minutes"? Embarrassed

Ease of service should always be a pre-purchase consideration for a lot of products but it seems to me that bragging on three or four decades of proven field service is more impressive to a potential customer than bragging that what they're selling you can be disassembled and fixed in 5 minutes. Sort of sets the tone for the reliability and service life of the product, doesn't it eh? :wink:

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Re: Fire Water

Zozzie wrote:

Gary Slusser wrote:
...........mechanical or SE timer. Mechanical is best..................The Clack WS-1 is better on all levels.

But isn't the WS-1 an electronic timer? Now I am confused.

Context, ya gotta stay in context; I said "The only difference between the 2500 and 2510 is brass or Noryl (plastic), Noryl is best and with the 2510 you get the option of mechanical or SE timer. Mechanical is best".

Then in the next paragraph I said: "The Clack WS-1 is better on all levels but especially to repair it and it has features the Fleck 2510 or the 5600 do not. Like soft water brining, Pre fill and variable reserve.". That's comparing the Clack to both versions of the 2510, the mechanical or SE.

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Re: Fire Water

Zozzie wrote:

Gary S, what's your opinion on these local softeners that I've found -

http://www.doctorh2o.ca/WaterSofteners.shtml

That's a Fleck 7000. It is currently having problems and its production or some part of it has stopped. I don't know why. Of those I've sold, I stopped in the spring of 2005 only months after is was introduced, I had more problems than it was worth. Plus, the variable brining causes more frequent regenerations and higher water use than a valve without it.

Zozzie wrote:

http://www.wrcpurifying.com/pdfs/softeners_concept.pdf

Can that valve be disassembled in 5 minutes as the .pdf claims?

Yes it can if it takes you that long. It has the same seals spacers and piston design as all the Fleck valves. IT is a version of the Clack WS-1 line. You only need a pair of channel lock pliers, unlike the special tools the Fleck valves require that are model specific.

Zozzie wrote:

http://www.softenerparts.com/images/56m.jpg

That is a 5600. For a DIYer it is better than the 2510 because it's easier to repair but... neither is as easy as the Clack WS-1. And again, feature wise, the Clack WS-1 is better than either of the Fleck valves.

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Re: Fire Water

Gary Slusser wrote:

.......the Clack WS-1 is better than either of the Fleck valves.

What softeners use Clack Gary? Is it suggested that a person phones around various plumbers to ask "What softeners can you sell that use Clack valves?"

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Re: Fire Water

Gary Slusser wrote:

That is a 5600. For a DIYer it is better than the 2510 because it's easier to repair but... neither is as easy as the Clack WS-1. And again, feature wise, the Clack WS-1 is better than either of the Fleck valves.

Wrong.

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Re: Fire Water

H2O_MAN wrote:

Wrong.

This is both hilarious and very frustrating. I can't tell if you're more down on each other or each other's valves. Rolling Eyes

Or both equally.

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Re: Fire Water

Zozzie wrote:

Gary Slusser wrote:
.......the Clack WS-1 is better than either of the Fleck valves.

What softeners use Clack Gary? Is it suggested that a person phones around various plumbers to ask "What softeners can you sell that use Clack valves?"

In the US there are many national and regional companies, or brands. There are a number of plumbing supply house chains that sell them under various brand names. And then there are independent dealers and their softeners will not have a brand name. Do a search for "Clack WS-1" like that and look at some pictures; there is a 5 button in one line, 5 button in a line of 3 buttons over 2 buttons as you've seen already and a 3 button version. There are the 1", 1.25", the 2" and a 2.5" IIRC.

Most independent dealers buy the component parts and assemble the softeners they sell.

The majority of plumbers do not know much about any type of water treatment including softeners. So you look for water treatment dealers in your yellow pages under the Water heading. Or use the internet.

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The Clack valve is nothing special and it's available to any independent dealer.
It is designed to be installed and serviced by the seller.
I looked at the Clack earlier this year and found it to be light duty at best.

Fleck continues to be the better valve and EcoWater is the best complete system.

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Re: Softener resin escaping
I made my choice. I've ordered my unit. After filtering all your suggestions and contradictions through my noggin, phoning local plumbers (they're all out plumbing), talking to local franchisees (EcoWater etc) and surfing the 'net I found a water handling and treatment company (pumps, softeners, filters etc) that custom assemble softeners. They're 2 hours away.

I had a long talk with the knowledgable chap who used to be, for many years, a water conditioner service man and he impressed me with his NO BS information and knowledge. They're assembling my unit as we speak and it will be shipped via UPS today.

His opinion on Clack versus Fleck was even-steven. He himself was fairly partial to Fleck as he was most familiar with them but he has no issues with Clack. It was my choice. He sells Autotrol too.

The only in-town unit that I would have considered buying cash 'n carry would have been a mechanical timer Fleck (I think) unit. I called the maker (Meyers) 2x yesterday and left messages but no-one called me back. Scratch them. No service BEFORE they get my money doesn't look good for the future does it?

So what did I go with in the end? I don't want to start WW4 (we did Water Wars 3 above) but I went with a..............wait for it.............Clack.

Thanks for all your info guys. Much appreciated. This is a great site. I just wish 2-4 of you guys could find some common ground to agree on as your informative posts are conflicting and confusing for us WS Newbs.

Mike T. (aka Zozzie)

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Can you share some details? What was the price?

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Softener resin escaping

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