Let's discuss the minimum wage

Have you ever heard of Winter Soldier, cyclops? If you had been in Vietnam, you would have known what Kerry was from the very beginning. You will never ever convince me otherwise with any spin you can find. There is not one shred of chance ever that your spin can change reality. Kerry was a fraud and if you are too blind to see it, I feel sorry for you.

You probably know this, cyclops, but I don't have to read books about Vietnam, I was there, in the jungles for 12 months, not 4. If I wanted to, I could write a book too so you could read it and find out more about what happened. I would also like to have testified before Congress instead of Kerry so that maybe a little bit of truth could have been given to the American people.

You are talking about the Swift Boat people being paid for telling their stories about what they remembered about what happened, which is not a smear, cylcops, paid for what, expenses they incurred? My patience runs thin for people like yourself that smear the Swift Boaters. They spent more time in Vietnam than Kerry did, and they didn't go home early because of phony purple hearts, they served their country and they have just as much right to speak out as the dud, John Kerry. Wake up to reality and quit swallowing your Democrat spin machine propaganda.

As long as they aren't the winter soldier type, fine, dys.

Good grief, cyclops, the Winter Soldier event has been proven to be much of it fraudulant. Don't you think we have wandered far off the path of the minimum wage. Even if we re-visited Winter Soldier, I doubt anything would be resolved, as you would hold onto your myths.

To sum it up quickly, there were atrocities in Vietnam, AS THERE HAS BEEN IN EVERY WAR, but nowhere near on the scale perpetrated onto the American people by Kerry and his message to Congress. I spent a year there and never saw any, and of all the fellow vets I know, I have never heard them say they saw any. It is my opinion he perpetrated a fraud, possibly unknowingly which makes him naive, or possibly knowingly which made him a fraud from the start. But he has since learned the truth I think, so he must be a fraud because he has never fully acknowledged it, at least to my knowledge. The Swift Boaters exposed much of his other stories of Vietnam as also fraudulant, and I believe them because their stories are more consistent with what I percieve to have been likely from personal experience.

There has been a large Democrat smear effort expended to spin the Swift Boaters to have conducted a smear campaign, but this basically boils down to who you want to believe. I believe the Swiftees, not because I want to but because their stories are more consistent with my own personal experience and I had already decided that Kerry was a fraud based on his entire record going back to Winter Soldier and his message to Congress.

You will believe what you want, I hope you feel good. I am extremely content with what I believe about this, and there is absolutely no question in my mind. Can we get back to the minimum wage?

Dear Okie, you may be shocked to learn that there are more people on a2k who served in Vietnam than yourself and have many different opinions than yourself. You are not the center of the universe of opinion.

dyslexia wrote:

Dear Okie, you may be shocked to learn that there are more people on a2k who served in Vietnam than yourself and have many different opinions than yourself. You are not the center of the universe of opinion.

What do you know about the Vietnam war? Weren't you part of those non-existent troops Uncle Sam had illegally stationed in Laos? Totally different country, dude!

I'd prefer to believe the many different accounts I've read who have no reason whatsoever to lie; as opposed to those who definitely do have a reason, say, they were paid to do so or they don't want people to know what they saw or did. You don't commit atrocities, or watch or know someone doing it, and then go home and brag about it, jeez.
Cycloptichorn

I have no clue about your friends, cyclops, whether they tell you the truth or not. You will have to be the judge. I would counter with the additional information that I have known at least 2 people from Vietnam well enough to know this was not their experience, and a few more more distantly that have not spoken of any such things to my knowledge. I have however heard stories from these people about the communists killing members of their family, but I don't suppose you would care about that?

My problems with Kerry are far more than personal. He indicted the entire country, and I would think every citizen would care, or should care if you care about the country, maybe you don't? If you looked at the links I provided, you would know it.

Name a war that was free of unfortunate circumstances, cyclops. Because you drive a car and advocate driving cars, do you feel personally responsible for all the deaths because of auto mishaps and criminal deaths due to people using a car?

If you wish to blame anyone for Vietnam, I suggest you look at LBJ for starters. But people in Vietnam now, many love the U.S., from what I have heard.

okie wrote:

Name a war that was free of unfortunate circumstances, cyclops. Because you drive a car and advocate driving cars, do you feel personally responsible for all the deaths because of auto mishaps and criminal deaths due to people using a car?

If you wish to blame anyone for Vietnam, I suggest you look at LBJ for starters. But people in Vietnam now, many love the U.S., from what I have heard.

I do blame LBJ. And others. I blame myself for the Iraq war, in part; I didn't do enough to stop it. I could have done more.

You will note that I neither drive a car, nor do I advocate others driving cars. I advocate bicycling and public transit.

Many people in Vietnam do love the US; that doesn't mean we didn't do some brutal **** over there, stuff that people wanted hushed up. Because it is embarrassing to the US to be seen as something other than pristine.

Cycloptichorn