Well, that's what I've been told by people who think themselves schooled in psychology, anyway.
(At the risk of wandering far afield) I think its a reasonable statement that adolescents and young adults who are male are likely to express dysfunction in violent ways, and females in sexual ways.
Okay, I'm braced. Lemme have it.
sozobe wrote:Quote:Kobe Bryant and the woman who is accusing him of raping her find themselves at opposites now. But employees at the Lodge & Spa at Cordillera have told reporters that when Bryant checked in on the night of June 30, she and the basketball star talked and flirted.
She went to Bryant's room after he made an after-hours call for room service, authorities said.
Resort staff were called to Bryant's room after another hotel guest complained of noise.
Witnesses told investigators that the woman emerged from the room visibly shaken, according to Denver television station KUSA.
Local prosecutors say Bryant forced her into "submission" through physical force and committed "sexual penetration or intrusion."
The next day, the woman told the Eagle County Sheriff's Department that Bryant sexually assaulted her.
http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/cst-nws-kobeintro20.html
I think it's not about the aftermath, that he didn't call her the next morning or whatever and she got mad. I think that some bad stuff happened right then, and while I still allow for the possibility that he thought at the time that it was consensual, something happened that shook her.
will you allow that, because of how we're already predisposed, you might be more willing to believe one thing, than another?
There should be forensic evidence. The prosecutors have got to have more than just his word against hers. Rapes result in patterns of physical evidence that are consistent in most cases. If the evidence is not there, they shouldn't have filed charges.
as an aside, a resident of the area when asked his opinion stated "I'm not following this story, I'm a Shaq fan"
Right, Swimpy.
snood, I'm saying all over the place that I'm sympathetic to Kobe and hope he didn't do it. I don't believe anything at this point when it comes to whether it was rape. Maybe, maybe not.
Just what do you think my predisposition is?
BillW wrote:...His best bet, IMHO, is to accept a misdemeanor, seal the case and get out of media attention - ASAP!
A misdemeanor case won't necessarily be sealed unless there is an agreement on all sides - highly doubtful, as none of the parties are minors.
snood wrote:The relative inexperience and seeming lack of guile in both is what makes me think that the most likely scenario for what happened was that it was unplanned, impulsive mutual lust, followed by rejection by Kobe, and then the girl reacting by saying she was raped - to save face. I think that in the mind of a 19 year old, it would look better for her to have been raped by Kobe Bryant, than to have been used and discarded.
I'm sorry Snood, but as my ex used to say, "estas' inventando"
(you are inventing)
What evidence might possibly be presented in this case?
Is she hoping that he will say "Yeah, I guess sure, I raped her".
Which leads us to the question of why the case exists.
Every succesful person I know is attacked, viciously and daily without evidence,
so why not Kobe? Or why not her?
Forgive me if I haven't read much real evidence so far, but I'm glad to keep an open mind if you are. What specific facts are we actually judging here?
jespah, I'm saying that that will be the decision on all sides - money will pass hands to get it done
My guess--a guess with flair, but still only a guess--is that the Girl Woman in question (I doubt that she is emotionally mature and I'm fairly sure she's not emotionally balanced right now) reasoned this way:
I thought that Whatever-Would-Happen when I entered Kobe's room would be passionate, romantic, unforgettable and make me feel better about the woes of my life.
He was rough (there were bruises) and then dismissive.
Since it wasn't romantic--and I signed up for romance--then it must have been rape.
Furthermore, I've been told by my girlfriends, by my family and by my doctor that I need to be more assertive.
****
From Kobe's point of view a woman flirts, comes to his room and seems to be available. He assumes "she knows what she's doing". He's enthusiastic--perhaps testing his knee repairs. "Wham, Bam, Thank you, Ma'am"--after all, he loves his wife--and she's a groupie.
She agreed. If she said "No" at any point, she was giggling when she said "No"--or leaning closer when she said "No" or.... Her words and her body language didn't match.
Further he was used to willing groupies (either personally or through locker room, second hand experience), not flirtatious. flaky girls with emotional problems.
***
She was using him. He was using her. Now the dirty linen is spread out in the interests of justice and entertainment.
Misunderstandings like this one are why non-professional sex between strangers can get very complicated. These two silly people were strangers to each other.
Ideally this mess would not be in the public eye (but Kobe is paid to be in the public eye). This is not an ideal world.
I wonder how many more of the Girl Woman's closest friends are going to Tell All--or just Tell the Juicy Parts. The police department in the little Colorado town held off for two weeks before issuing the warrent. I'm assuming that the Girl Woman got a lot of conflicting advice in those two weeks--some sensible, some loving, some biased, some hogwash.
Anyone want to bet how long it is before the Boyfriend with Another Girl Woman opens his mouth to the media.
jespah, I just reread my reply to you and decided I need to start my previous response with these four words - "I agree with you"
On Noddy's scenario, I could understand that being one way whatever happened happened, it rings fairly true, but ...
it might not have been rough, just over, or,
she might have said no and meant it, this is possible.
I seem to remember hearing that No does constitute No.
Whether or not she was giggleing, and whether or not she came to his room with romance in her head.
I am sorry we all have to know all about this, but since we do, I am interested in how it unfolds.
Two people know what happened. A few more know what the evidence is. Everything else, including statements by "friend of a friend," is speculation. Sometimes no news is just no news, and you've got to wait for answers. (But don't tell that to MSNBC...)
Once this is over Kobe's wife will have his penis for sale on E-Bay within a week.
If Kobe is found not guilty of rape, I wonder if he will be elevated to super duper hero status like Magic Johnson was. The big bucks might just keep on rollin' in!
If he keeps putting balls in the hoop - especially in the fourth quater and last minute plus, especially winning campionships, the big buck will roll on................
Noddy,
I loved your guess with "a flair". It's an angle I hadn't considered.
Whoopsie! Friends say she's unstable--and had an overdose recently.
Does this matter? Should it?
http://www.msnbc.com/local/knbc/a1705582.asp?vts=72220031142
Like most rape cases (the exceptions being gang rape and the very rare pervert who sexually assults the victim with an audience) the legal proceedings come down to "he said" vs. "she said".
Both the D.A. and the Defense Attorney are going to be presenting the jury with "plausible" scenarios. Ms X's overdose--whether deliberate or accidental--is a godsend for the Kobe's Attorney.
Instead of attacking Ms. X's morals, he can direct the jury to examine her motives. The overdose can be used to established a turmoil of mind, a state in which Ms. X was incapable of thinking clearly or acting logically.
Kobe's reputation as a good family man--with one very conspicious lapse--will be brought into play. Not only is he not a rapist, he would never rape a mentally confused girl/woman.
The D.A. will insist that the drug overdose indicates a mind in turmoil, a predisposition to hopelessness which prevented Ms. X from crying out for help as loudly as she might have."
Jury empanelment will be interesting. The defense will hope for sports fans. The D.A. will want maternal women and good family men.
Of course these two broad categories are not mutally exclusive.
The jury may well be sequestered for the duration of the trial. I'm betting that every one of the jurors and the alternates will be taking hot, soapy baths at least once a day.
Course, the overdose and hearsay about the alleged victim's emotional state may be deemed inadmissible by the judge...
