I believe that the U.S. should grow some balls!

I'm an American.

Quote:

Your connection of Nazi Germany is absurd.

Why is it absurd? I don't mean that you are a Nazi, I mean to say that if all that matters is what country you are in, then good people will owe their allegiance to evil nations. Obviously you don't think that is the case, so please tell me why people owe allegiance to a country.

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Foley wrote:

I'm an American.

Quote:
Your connection of Nazi Germany is absurd.

Why is it absurd? I don't mean that you are a Nazi, I mean to say that if all that matters is what country you are in, then good people will owe their allegiance to evil nations. Obviously you don't think that is the case, so please tell me why people owe allegiance to a country.

Who said all that matters is what country your in. Sudanians owe no allegiance to Sudan.
But to be fortunate enough to live in a country like America, that was built by the blood of Immigrants after being freed by America, France and others, that had allegiance and fought for the liberties you enjoy but don't appreciate.
I doubt that you were born in America. If you were, you sicken me. Do you know the pledge of allegence? Ungrateful people like you should live in third world countries for a few years.

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I was born in Pennsylvania. I still live in Pennsylvania. If I had blonde hair, I'd practically be an Aryan. And I appreciate America. What I don't appreciate is when leaders try to pretend that they are the absolute will of the country and that people who disagree with their wars hate freedom. The America I stand by is one of freedom and justice. If I don't want to kill other people, my free nation shouldn't tell me that I have to or else I'm a coward and will be imprisoned. A truly free country would never do that- not in a thousand years.

EDIT- I know the anthem, America the Beautiful, and the pledge- which I don't say. My allegiance is to the people of the nation, not to the idea, which is so easily hijacked into tyranny.

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Foley wrote:

I was born in Pennsylvania. I still live in Pennsylvania. If I had blonde hair, I'd practically be an Aryan. And I appreciate America. What I don't appreciate is when leaders try to pretend that they are the absolute will of the country and that people who disagree with their wars hate freedom. The America I stand by is one of freedom and justice. If I don't want to kill other people, my free nation shouldn't tell me that I have to or else I'm a coward and will be imprisoned. A truly free country would never do that- not in a thousand years.

EDIT- I know the anthem, America the Beautiful, and the pledge- which I don't say. My allegiance is to the people of the nation, not to the idea, which is so easily hijacked into tyranny.

I agree that bush is the closest to a Fascist that a president can be. I hate bush when he was running in 2000. Anyone could or should have seen that he is just a real dumb ass. He has little mans attitude. I can't understand that there are still people who believe in him or ever did.

Now, if you object to the "Idea" of allegiance to our Country, then the majority of our Nation really could care less about your allegiance to them.
So you appreciate America! Isn't that swell. What exactly do you appreciate about The United States? A free ride?

Do you have Allegiance to the Aryan Nation, which you oddly bring up.

How do you feel about the WWII Veterans who gave freedom to so many people? Vietnam Veterans who suffer to this Day, and the Iraqi Veterans who are getting their legs blown off. Freedom is not free, just ask a Vet in a wheelchair.
In your life time, what have you done to help provide this freedom and justice that you enjoy by the deaths of so many heroes?

When was the last time my country has told you to kill people ot go to jail.

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snookered wrote:

Do you have Allegiance to the Aryan Nation, which you oddly bring up.

I brought it up only to show you that just because I am white male all American, it doesn't mean I agree with you.

snookered wrote:

Now, if you object to the "Idea" of allegiance to our Country, then the majority of our Nation really could care less about your allegiance to them.
So you appreciate America! Isn't that swell. What exactly do you appreciate about The United States? A free ride?

If by allegiance to the country you mean the people of the nation, then I do have allegiance to the country. What I'm saying is, whether the president is a moron or not, I'm not going to swear my allegiance to his (or congress's) decisions blindly. If there was a war that I truly thought was for the people (like WWII), then I would fight.

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Foley wrote:

snookered wrote:
Do you have Allegiance to the Aryan Nation, which you oddly bring up.

I brought it up only to show you that just because I am white male all American, it doesn't mean I agree with you.

snookered wrote:
Now, if you object to the "Idea" of allegiance to our Country, then the majority of our Nation really could care less about your allegiance to them.
So you appreciate America! Isn't that swell. What exactly do you appreciate about The United States? A free ride?

If by allegiance to the country you mean the people of the nation, then I do have allegiance to the country. What I'm saying is, whether the president is a moron or not, I'm not going to swear my allegiance to his (or congress's) decisions blindly. If there was a war that I truly thought was for the people (like WWII), then I would fight.

So your the "decider" and not Bush.
Look I will bash Bush, as is a right of this Great Nation. But as soon as another country or leader does I will back Bush as leader of my country. This is Allegiance.
Now, answer my question, What do you appreciate about The United States?

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snookered wrote:

Foley wrote:
snookered wrote:
Do you have Allegiance to the Aryan Nation, which you oddly bring up.

I brought it up only to show you that just because I am white male all American, it doesn't mean I agree with you.

snookered wrote:
Now, if you object to the "Idea" of allegiance to our Country, then the majority of our Nation really could care less about your allegiance to them.
So you appreciate America! Isn't that swell. What exactly do you appreciate about The United States? A free ride?

If by allegiance to the country you mean the people of the nation, then I do have allegiance to the country. What I'm saying is, whether the president is a moron or not, I'm not going to swear my allegiance to his (or congress's) decisions blindly. If there was a war that I truly thought was for the people (like WWII), then I would fight.

So your the "decider" and not Bush.
Look I will bash Bush, as is a right of this Great Nation. But as soon as another country or leader does I will back Bush as leader of my country. This is Allegiance.
Now, answer my question, What do you appreciate about The United States?

Your no way near ALL AMERICAN. With all the economic immigrants, there probably isn't an all american majority. If your were drafted to the Military, what would you do?
Your pretty much safe, there will never be another war LIKE WWII.

You never answered my question-What do you appreciate about The United States, Mr All American.

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snookered wrote:

But to be fortunate enough to live in a country like America, that was built by the blood of Immigrants after being freed by America, France and others, that had allegiance and fought for the liberties you enjoy but don't appreciate.

You feel "fortunate enough to live in a country like America" given America's horrific slavery of untold millions of blacks, the mass murdering of many millions Native Americans, and the stealing of their lands and destruction of their way of life.

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Chumly wrote:

snookered wrote:
But to be fortunate enough to live in a country like America, that was built by the blood of Immigrants after being freed by America, France and others, that had allegiance and fought for the liberties you enjoy but don't appreciate.
You feel "fortunate enough to live in a country like America" given America's horrific slavery of untold millions of blacks, the mass murdering of many millions Native Americans, and the stealing of their lands and destruction of their way of life.

Now that's funny. You let your true feelings come out. How long have you been harbouring these feelings about the United States, until they spewed out like you have diarrhea.
You've watched to many cowboy and indian movies. Black Africans sold the slaves. We gave the Indians nice reservations to play on. Ironically, all the Tribes of Indians have a net income likely more than that of Canada.
Many millions of Native Americans...really? You sure?

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Whether black Africans did or did not sell slaves is wholly irrelevant to the fact that the Europeans kept untold millions of blacks in horrific slavery.

What makes you think the Europeans had any lands whatsoever to presumably give "the Indians nice reservations to play on". The fact of the matter was the lands were already occupied by Native Americans and were not the the Europeans to give.

Your claim that "all the Tribes of Indians have a net income likely more than that of Canada" is utter gibberish and again wholly irrelevant.

Yes I am quite sure that many millions of Native Americans were slaughtered by the Europeans, many millions of Native Americans had their lands taken by the Europeans, and many millions of Native Americans had their ways of life destroyed by the Europeans.

This sadly is the legacy you claim you defend.

It's really "brave and free" to own slaves and facilitate genocide!

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Chumly wrote:

Whether black Africans did or did not sell slaves is wholly irrelevant to the fact that the Europeans kept untold millions of blacks in horrific slavery.

What makes you think the Europeans had any lands whatsoever to presumably give "the Indians nice reservations to play on". The fact of the matter was the lands were already occupied by Native Americans and were not the the Europeans to give.

Your claim that "all the Tribes of Indians have a net income likely more than that of Canada" is utter gibberish and again wholly irrelevant.

Yes I am quite sure that many millions of Native Americans were slaughtered by the Europeans, many millions of Native Americans had their lands taken by the Europeans, and many millions of Native Americans had their ways of life destroyed by the Europeans.

This sadly is the legacy you claim you defend.

It's really "brave and free" to own slaves and facilitate genocide!

Here I thought that you were pretty intelligent. Laughing

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"Europeans" meaning Americanized Europeans. How about you make a list of the posters you consider intelligent and those you don't. It might not be surprising at all for me to be pleased in finding my moniker on your list of presumably unintelligent posters.

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Chumly wrote:

"Europeans" meaning Americanized Europeans. How about you make a list of the posters you consider intelligent and those you don't. It might not be surprising at all for me to be pleased in finding my moniker on your list of presumably unintelligent posters.

I get on that right away...you wait ok?

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Re: I believe that the U.S. should grow some balls!

snookered wrote:

We pay countries trillions of dollars to buy their frienship, then get slapped in the face. What do we do? Oh jeeze, I'm sorry, take our grain.
Illegal Immigration is out of control . But some want to continue to give them free medical services and free money. Politicans are so entangled with the Hispanic population for votes that hispanics control our country. THEY DON'T EVEN NEED OR MADE TO LEARN ENGLISH. Occassionally, the Border Patrol will stage a raid to make us think they are doing something.
I believe if we go to war, we should go to win. I'm a Vietnam combat vet. The soldiers went to win but the leadership didn't. But there sure was a lot of money to be made. Look at cheney and Haliburten in Iraq. Sure, Cheney resigned as a Board member, but I would like to see his mail box on any given time. That would be National Security! Bush came to us as a leader and uniter , but turned out to be THE DECIDER.
What's wrong with the United States? We don't have the balls in the leadership, and haven't for many years.

The United States is a proud nation who sees themselves as indestructible. Untouchable. Though we've been proven wrong more than once. I am no longer a "christian", however... I do still believe this phrase...

Pride comes before a fall.

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Re: I believe that the U.S. should grow some balls!

Treya wrote:

snookered wrote:
We pay countries trillions of dollars to buy their frienship, then get slapped in the face. What do we do? Oh jeeze, I'm sorry, take our grain.
Illegal Immigration is out of control . But some want to continue to give them free medical services and free money. Politicans are so entangled with the Hispanic population for votes that hispanics control our country. THEY DON'T EVEN NEED OR MADE TO LEARN ENGLISH. Occassionally, the Border Patrol will stage a raid to make us think they are doing something.
I believe if we go to war, we should go to win. I'm a Vietnam combat vet. The soldiers went to win but the leadership didn't. But there sure was a lot of money to be made. Look at cheney and Haliburten in Iraq. Sure, Cheney resigned as a Board member, but I would like to see his mail box on any given time. That would be National Security! Bush came to us as a leader and uniter , but turned out to be THE DECIDER.
What's wrong with the United States? We don't have the balls in the leadership, and haven't for many years.

The United States is a proud nation who sees themselves as indestructible. Untouchable. Though we've been proven wrong more than once. I am no longer a "christian", however... I do still believe this phrase...

Pride comes before a fall.

The last time we were proven wrong is Vietnam. Now in Iraq we are being more than proven wrong. We've got a president who is a bully, and has done more damage to more than our Pride. He has made us more hated than ever. He has embarrassed the U.S.
I first noticed that we weren't a proud nation anymore was 9 years ago. I was a Purchasing agent for a S. Florida City. During a conference, I brought up, "The buy American Act." I thought that I was in Cuba. I got booed by ungrateful immigrants.
We had Haitians marching in the streets wanting more from Social Security.
The first Cuban Freedom Flights in 1964, produced a productive first class Cuban immigrant.
Since then, immigration has destroyed our culture and Pride. When immigrants that are unabiding citizens and not American Citizens, who don't assimilate into our community, they tend to bring the society down to meet their standards.
So unchecked immigration is ruined the United States.

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Actually sweetheart, the last time we were proven wrong was 9/11. They came here remember. However, I won't play some part for you like I actually have the slightest clue what you are talking about here. I haven't even heard about most of the things you've mentioned. I just know that my view is that not just the government, but Americans as well tend to be pretty proud folks. I'm not saying it's wrong to be patriotic and support your country. However, when someone comes and blows up two huge business buildings in broad daylight, killing thousands of people, and a year or so later most everyone seems to go back to living just as things were before that happened... well... we're a little too self confident.

I'm sorry if that's wrong, and a completely uninformed decision on my part, but that's how I honestly feel. I'm not paranoid, but really, what's going to stop someone from doing that tomorrow? Next week? Next year? While our military is all tied up fighting in another country right now? We aren't as great as we think we are. Yes we are the richest nation. Yes, we'll rebuild and go on. Yes, we'll sacrifice our men and women to continue protecting this country. But d*** it we aren't indestructible. We aren't untouchable. We've been touched. We just choose to forget.

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Treya wrote:

Actually sweetheart, the last time we were proven wrong was 9/11. They came here remember. However, I won't play some part for you like I actually have the slightest clue what you are talking about here. I haven't even heard about most of the things you've mentioned. I just know that my view is that not just the government, but Americans as well tend to be pretty proud folks. I'm not saying it's wrong to be patriotic and support your country. However, when someone comes and blows up two huge business buildings in broad daylight, killing thousands of people, and a year or so later most everyone seems to go back to living just as things were before that happened... well... we're a little too self confident.

I'm sorry if that's wrong, and a completely uninformed decision on my part, but that's how I honestly feel. I'm not paranoid, but really, what's going to stop someone from doing that tomorrow? Next week? Next year? While our military is all tied up fighting in another country right now? We aren't as great as we think we are. Yes we are the richest nation. Yes, we'll rebuild and go on. Yes, we'll sacrifice our men and women to continue protecting this country. But d*** it we aren't indestructible. We aren't untouchable. We've been touched. We just choose to forget.

Well sweetie pie, how were we proven wrong for 9/11? We were supposed to know that their were religious zealots on planes that were going to fly them into buildings? I bet even you were surprised.
You could say that we were wrong for thinking there were WMD's in Iraq, but actually it was a Presidential LIE. By the way, there hasn't been another terrorists attack since.

Americans are pretty proud? We have nothing to be proud about. I'm embarrased. We have deminished our military might to barely a wimper. We have lost any respect that there was for the United States. The world hardly see's us as a Superpower anymore.

We were wrong for attacking Iraq, they had nothing to do with the Terrorists actions. We should have fully concentrated on Afganistan where the Terrorists were.
Maybe your to young to understand what I'm talking about. I'll be glad to help you understand. It not rocket science.
I'm serious, please tell me what you don't understand. I spent 56 years in Miami, served in Vietnam and have had several business. Which only means that I have a good understanding of National events and common sense.

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Hey there snookered. Sorry if my last comment sounded like I was mocking you or something. I didn't mean sweetheart in a condescending way at all. It's just a term I use sometimes when I'm talking to people. So I'm sorry if it sounded that way. I'm not going to get into this whole issue right now. I'm not ready, I'm sorry. You've made some good points, but I will have to get back to you some other time if the opportunity presents itself. I just wanted you to know I wasn't trying to be rude or whatever when I called you sweetheart.

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Treya wrote:

Hey there snookered. Sorry if my last comment sounded like I was mocking you or something. I didn't mean sweetheart in a condescending way at all. It's just a term I use sometimes when I'm talking to people. So I'm sorry if it sounded that way. I'm not going to get into this whole issue right now. I'm not ready, I'm sorry. You've made some good points, but I will have to get back to you some other time if the opportunity presents itself. I just wanted you to know I wasn't trying to be rude or whatever when I called you sweetheart.

Thank you Treya. That was very nice of you. People are trying to beat me up in here, so I really appreciate your kind words.

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You're welcome. Smile

They're not trying to beat you up though sweetheart. They're just trying to find out what you're made of. :wink:

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I believe that the U.S. should grow some balls!

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