New marriage - who is my husband

Really, don't just fade away. Talk to a uni/college counsellor, even if it is past deadlines. Get your situation on record.

I could have used counselling, or at least lists of alternatives, more than once.

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ossobuco wrote:

I think it's a biggo mistake to stop the masters. Maybe you can't do it now, or maybe you'll change areas of interest... but don't just walk. Let there be a way back in, administratively. See a counsellor...

Hi Osso - thank you muchly for your encouragement. The university has given me heaps of time off and extra time on top of that. They cannot cut me any more slack, sadly.

Also, I'm having *huge* issues with their committee who are asking me to provide clearances for interviews that are impossible to get. It's an uphill obstacle course. Life wasn't meant to be easy but man. It's too much on top of what's already going on...made more challenging by the fact that the university is in Oz.

I'll investigate their counselling option tho - that was a great idea, thank you. I'll see if they can advise me over the phone or something as to my options.

jazzie

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ehBeth wrote:

You've got to figure out who you are in a new relationship, in a new country, in a new vocational situation all at the same time...Who are you ...what do you want? What things, in a relationship, are deal-breakers? Do you have something invested in the marriage succeeding, even if you logically figure out that it doesn't fit you and your requirements?

Dear ehBeth -

A very insightful post - thanks for this as you've also hit one of many nails on the head...being 'who am I?' I used to have a very strong inner sense of self, but the thing I've learned since being here was that so much of who I was is/was caught up in my work. I loved it so much, that my job became me.

When my work was removed, I had nothing. It was unfair of me to expect my husband to fill that gap. Study didn't fill it. My other past times didn't fill it. But I've been so lost since landing here. I've had no purpose, no direction, no joy.

The only thing that could fill that gap was returning to work, doing what I loved - which I'm now recently allowed to do. It feels good to be jobhunting again.

Your last question is very relevant ... that is "Do you have something invested in the marriage succeeding, even if you logically figure out that it doesn't fit you and your requirements?"

Yes. I do. My happiness.

But here's a curly one.

My husb said tonight that he only wants me to be happy. He is sad that "nothing he has done" in my time here has made me happy. I told him it was not his job to make me happy - that is my responsibility. But he feels that if I'm happy - he is happy.

So he said that if I would be happier packing my bags and going back to Oz (with or without him), then I might be wise to consider that as an option. That's not what I want. He thinks that perhaps I would be happier either alone or with someone else .... I almost died at such a bizarre suggestion (do others think it bizarre or just me?). He said that all he wants is my happiness. I felt this was overly self-sacrificing on his part - or maybe it was his polite way of asking me to get the hell out of his life?!

So I asked him if he would reconsider marriage counselling. He's going to think about it & get back to me. I said if he really doesn't want to do it, that I'll understand because hey - I can't force him to do anything.

Marriage counselling. THAT is what would make me happy. The chance to work out our stuff with a 3rd party TOGETHER. Not packing my bags and running home. Am I wrong to insist on counselling?

Thanks for listening and reading Smile

jazzie

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Definitely not wrong to insist.

I very much identify with the job thing. I had a challenging, all-encompassing job I loved (director of an agency I'd started and which became quite successful) and then moved to a whole new city where I knew nobody when I was 6 months pregnant. I'd planned to be a stay-at-home mom, and knew that the transition was going to be difficult, and did all sorts of things to prepare. That included saving a sizable chunk of money so that I could feel like I still had "my" money to spend, lining up consulting jobs that I could do from home, finding some home-based part-time work, and getting involved in the local community by volunteering. I planned all of these things, and they worked, but it was still a HUGE adjustment.

This is to say, of COURSE what you describe would be difficult for you. I don't think it reflects badly on anyone that it's difficult, or reflects weakness or propensity to depression or anything. It's depressing. It needs to be actively dealt with.

At any rate, if all your husband wants is your happiness, going to counseling is the very least he can do.

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Jazzie--

Counseling will not solve all your problems, but counseling may well save your marriage.

Please remember that just as your husband is not responsible for your happiness, he is not responsible for your unhappiness.

He could make a bonfire of his porn stash at High Noon on Main Street, but this single sacrifice won't make a bit of difference in your relationship. He has to understand how the porn bothers you and you have to understand how the porn issue makes him feel.

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jazzieB123 wrote:

Dear Heph,

What can I say. Thank you so much for your honesty ... if only I could stop the tears from rolling down my cheeks. How you survived such a series of shocking experiences is testimony to your amazing inner strength and personal fortitude. I feel privileged that you shared your story with me and I am extremely relieved you managed to get away from such a mean spirited bully.

Did he follow you or did he just leave you alone after you moved back? I hope he leaves you alone for the rest of your life. You're one strong gal and you deserve a stellar relationship.

I'm also glad that you had a wonderful fling too ... it is a joy to spend time with someone who is kind & good b/c it puts faith back in human nature to a certain extent.

I hope you don't think me too nosey, but how come you had to apply for papers to move to FL? Are you not an American citizen? How curious!

Thanks for writing

- jazzie

I'm really not that strong, but I hope to be some day. I just came to a place at some point where I realized it was better to live. Even when life sucks it is better to be alive than to die. So I do what I have to, to keep living. That's all. Oh no. He didn't follow. He hasn't even attempted contact since I left. Which is fine. Oh no, the papers I am talking about are filing for divorce. You can't do that unless you've been a resident of a state for six months. It's all good though. I have a nice parting gift in store for him once have established residency here in FL. :wink:

jazzieB123 wrote:

Your last question is very relevant ... that is "Do you have something invested in the marriage succeeding, even if you logically figure out that it doesn't fit you and your requirements?"

Yes. I do. My happiness.

But here's a curly one.

My husb said tonight that he only wants me to be happy. He is sad that "nothing he has done" in my time here has made me happy. I told him it was not his job to make me happy - that is my responsibility. But he feels that if I'm happy - he is happy.

So he said that if I would be happier packing my bags and going back to Oz (with or without him), then I might be wise to consider that as an option. That's not what I want. He thinks that perhaps I would be happier either alone or with someone else .... I almost died at such a bizarre suggestion (do others think it bizarre or just me?). He said that all he wants is my happiness. I felt this was overly self-sacrificing on his part - or maybe it was his polite way of asking me to get the hell out of his life?!

Argh. I heard this kind of crap from my husband a lot. It's actually a control tactic jazzie. Let me explain. Him saying to you, "nothing I've done has made you happy.", # 1 makes you feel guilty. # 2 shifts the responsibility off of himself for the things he's doing and makes you seem as though you just cannot be pleased, when the fact of the matter is... he's not even trying. # 3 It puts all the responsibility on you to make him happy because as long as you are not able to be pleased he's not happy, which then makes it all YOUR fault he's not happy.

I have my doubts, based on what you've said, about his concern for your happiness. It just doesn't really seem as though he's willing to put anything into this relationship, but would rather you kill yourself trying to make him happy. Does that make sense?

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jazzie -- got on this site in order to seek some pearls of wisdom. turns out you are going through my nightmare. hang in there, hon. there's got to be a solution. for what it's worth, we got married 8 months ago, and i am where you are -- feel like the boat's overturned, and I am trying to right it. all he seems to be doing at this point, is treading water...cannot crack this puzzle. over and above almost every item that you mentioned (relocation, job change, country change, social network disruption), i even suffered a monstrous miscarriage...quite possibly one of the most overwhelming experiences of my life..and all this, through a marriage to someone who seems very different. distracted. preoccupied. what a nightmare! it's only been 8 months, too! i seriously considering going back home a few times every day..but then, like you -- what i really want is to give this a fair shot. not throw out a marriage only because my husband quite hasn't figured out how to pitch in to help saving it...ugh!

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Whatever you decide to do, don't give up your masters, though.
This is something you are doing for you and your future.[/color][/quote]

and, yes -- i totally agree with Bohne. do NOT give up your master's. that is the one thing that will most certainly pull you through. lose yourself in your work, and it will pay you back and be there for you -- unlike people. yes, i am bitter. but i cannot be otherwise given the anger and disappointment that i feel in my marriage. you say you were an overacheiver. then, that's where your essence lies. pour yourself back into your work. these days when i husband travels on business, i have opted to stay home and be myself. i recently joined a progressive dance studio, and a couple of theatre groups in an effort to recreate what i had when i had a full life back home. i am tryign to regain my sense of self and coming to the realization that if things do not work out between us, i have not lost myself into being his wife.
but it's HARD!!! so frgn hard!

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I completely agree with everything that Heph said about the "can't make you happy" thing being a way to put everything off onto you. I'd also add that the fact that his only suggestion was that maybe you should leave is not really concern for you, but just an easy out for him. That solution doesn't require any work on his part.

Hopefully he will listen if you tell him that giving up is not the right answer if he really cares about your happiness.

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Yeah, that's part of what I was getting at, too. He's making these grand gestures -- it's all his fault, if you want to go home it's fine really, yadda yadda -- but he can't be bothered with counseling? Hm.

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Noddy24 wrote:

He could make a bonfire of his porn stash at High Noon on Main Street, but this single sacrifice won't make a bit of difference in your relationship. He has to understand how the porn bothers you and you have to understand how the porn issue makes him feel.

Hi Noddy - good thoughts, thank you. I have explained to him 100 times how the porn issue makes me feel (betrayed b/c he hid it) - but his defence all along has been that he kept it "for us" - as I had expressed an interest in perhaps one day introducing it to our marriage. Perhaps. But I'd also said that I needed to be in control of when, where and how. He was fine with that. But he still hid his stash from me after letting me believe he'd chucked it out.

So. I have not asked him how the porn issue has made HIM feel because I've felt so gutted over it, I'd not considered asking for his feelings on it. Frankly, I didn't care about how he felt over it.

Do you mean, how did it make him feel that I had found it?

Or how did it make him feel when he watched it? I'm not sure how to interpret your question ... but when I do I will ask him.

Many thanks Smile

jazzie

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sozobe wrote:

Definitely not wrong to insist.

I very much identify with the job thing.

Hey sozobe - it's comforting that you and many others here can identify with how important the work sitch is. I attempted to look into volunteer work here, but many of the people I rang for vollie work couldn't even understand my accent over the phone. I would get upset, frustrated. I did not have the emotional mettle to continue repeating myself over & over. I mean, I'm an Aussie. It's not as tho I speak Japanese for crying out loud. Even the staff at Safeway can't understand me. So, I dealt with real people less and less.

I used to be a stickler for seeing things thru but the volunteer thing just wore me down. I do not have a broad accent, and I speak REALLY slowly & carefully so people can understand me, but 50% of the time, I'm either considered a novelty "hey, say kangaroo for me! are you related to Steve Irwin?" or a confusion "what? what did you say?".

I put my wagons in a circle and stayed home. Very chicken sh*t of me, but I couldnt deal with it.

jazzmeister

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Maybe find other Aussies, then?

Because that's the further parallel -- I'm deaf, and so communication is QUITE the issue. :-) But I volunteered with Deaf organizations (I'm fluent in sign language).

I found this, just for starters:

http://www.ozinamerica.org

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Here are the local chapters, from that site (since I'm not sure where you live):

http://www.ozinamerica.org/chapters.html

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Hey sozobe - thank you so much for this website! I joined an expat website when I first got here, and made quite a few online friends thru it - which was good. I met my aussie friend here in real life thru the expat site and we've become really good mates. It makes such a difference having such a close bond with her - but all the other aussies are over 2 hrs drive away in the big smoke. Sometimes I look them up and go visit & I always love it but nothing beats having them just around the corner tho but I have to be content with occasional visits. It's nice that I don't have to repeat myself tho!

I cannot imagine how different your life must be. Do you find that people can be inadvertently patronising when they try to communicate with you? You know - strangers who oversimplify words/actions? I don't mean with malice, obviously, but simply b/c they don't know how to react or how to communicate ... ? Do you also lip read? Wowie zowie. Smile

jazzie

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hephzibah wrote:

Him saying to you, "nothing I've done has made you happy.", # 1 makes you feel guilty. # 2 shifts the responsibility off of himself .... # 3 It puts all the responsibility on you to make him happy because as long as you are not able to be pleased he's not happy, which then makes it all YOUR fault he's not happy. /
Quote:

Hi heph, cypher and sozobe,

I thought a lot about what you (and others) said about this & I agree with you. So does my counsellor - who I saw today. She also said my husb perhaps phrased my "going back home to Oz" in the way that he did to make himself try to come out of this looking like the good guy...which is I think was what you were also alluding to. "I tried everything, NOTHING made her happy so I let her go to a place where she could find happiness ..." kind of thing. Meh. Such BS.

She said he needs to overcome his own fear or anxiety or whatever-it-is over marriage counselling & commit to it. Even if it's just one visit. For a guy who says he's open, caring & honest, I find his fear of the unknown understandable but such obstinance so selfish. We've both hurt each other a lot so I asked him to consider the counselling as starting over. We'll see what happens.

The counsellor & I also talked about strategies for my emotional health. She said ditching the masters was a healthy choice at this time. I know. I can hear the shouts of protest, but I'm a wreck. I can't cry any more over it. I have to dust myself off and move on - give it another go in a few years time. The timing is all wrong at the moment.

I really appreciate your advice and feedback on this and I have SO appreciated your help in terms of suggesting I stick with study but eating my own head would be an easier thing to do at this stage. God knows I tried but there's too much to catch up on. My inner health takes priority at the mo. If I can push study aside & re enrol in a couple of years time & start over, then I'll do that.

sigh.

Thank you, thank you again

jazzie

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heartofthesun wrote:

jazzie -- got on this site in order to seek some pearls of wisdom. turns out you are going through my nightmare.

Hey heart - oh my god. On top of everything else you've had to contend with, you've also had an awful miscarriage? This is terrible. How are you coping?? Who can you talk to about this if not your husband?? Is he being distracted b/c he can't deal with it and needs to put some distance between the 2 of you? Is he suddenly not the person you thought you married?? You poor luv.

Do you have any support networks? (have you made new friends from the dance studio or theatre classes?)

How long have you been in San Diego? And what country did you move from to be there? I have so many questions. Sorry to bombard you with these - I hope you don't mind.

I joined this forum a few days ago and the lovely people here have offered solid advice & honest thoughts. It's a good place for truthful feedback so please keep visiting. Tell us how you are going & where you are at.

I just realised, you've been married one month shorter than me. Blimey. Do you ever ask "how did everything so right go so wrong so quickly?". I do. And yeh, I think about going home every day, but like I've said b4, I didn't come all the way here just so I could turn around & go back home again ...

jazzie

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I've read many years ago that moving can be more traumatic than divorce! I now believe that, because when I was promoted, and moved to the windy city many lifetimes ago, I didn't know my wife was in depression, because I was so busy with work. I learned that many years later, after we had returned to California. We now live in Silicon Valley, and I've been ready to move to a "new" home elsewhere for over eight years, but my wife wants to stay here, so I'm letting her make the choice.

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cicerone imposter wrote:

I've been ready to move to a "new" home elsewhere for over eight years, but my wife wants to stay here, so I'm letting her make the choice.

Hi cicerone (what a great nick!),

I think this is wise of you to let her make the choice. Relocating and saying goodbye to an old life is associated with feelings of intense grief apparently.

Put it this way - if moving to a new house is good for you, good for her and good for your marriage ... then fine. 3 out of 3 is a grand outcome.

But if it is bad for your wife, then it will also be bad for your marriage. ie Two thirds bad, one third good.

How did your wife deal with her depression when you moved to your job? Do you have children?

-- jazzie

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Jazzie, I think you're doing the right thing to put aside your Master's for now. Sounds like it would be completely overwhelming at the moment, like a last straw kinda thing. I do hope you can work things out with your school though so that you can pick it up again where you leave off, once you're ready.

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New marriage - who is my husband

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