New marriage - who is my husband

Hi,
I read your other post too. Good to hear that you are seeing a counselor. How does your husband feel about your going without him? Does his employer offer assistance for individual and family matters? My employer happens to have an employee assistance program and offers legal advice as well as counselling. I got 6 free sessions. This might be worth looking into especially if he is using the excuse of affordability.

Hi Marty - many thanx for your reply. I've been seeing a seperate counsellor since May 06 on & off to try to deal with living in a new country, getting married, immigration etc. At first my husband thought it was beneficial. But now, he thinks it's dragging on...but you kno, I did not expect to be diagnosed with depression & that's taken us both by surprise. He makes me feel the depression is my fault & that our problems stem out of it. This, in my view, is not only unfair but also untrue.

My husband has med insurance thru work but I'm too afraid to ask him if his employer has assisted programs like the one you mentioned. My husband would say "no way". He could not bear to lose face like this with his boss...who would make him confess as to what kind of program he'd be signing up for.

Even if the money fell from the sky, he would still refuse counselling. He has already predicted what the counsellor (a man with 3 degrees and in his final yr of a psych doctorate) would say. Yes. It appears I married a telepathic genius who can predict the unknown.

As Noddy said, I can't force him to go to counselling. He's scared - or something. I don't know. But we are not succeeding trying to resolve these issues by ourselves. We just walk in circles around each other in silence. I'm at a loss as to what to do.

I think you really did not know your husband before you got married to him.
I don't think you really get to know people in a long distance relationship.
Maybe you had certain views and expectations and these are not being fulfilled now.

I don't think you have really mentioned anything positive about your marriage, yet.
There must be something for which you think it is worth fighting.
After all, you could just tell him to get lost, and get on with your life without him.
But you are making a big effort to keep the relationship going and improving on it!

Maybe it will help, to concentrate on all the good things for a while.

And remember that it was your choice (I understand) to move to the States, so you cannot make your husband responsible for your being homesick!

And one more question:
Do you have work, friends, hobbies at the moment, that are independent from your husband?

Jazzie--

Glad to see you on your own thread. I'll be back.

Hi Jazzie,

Wow, what a leap into the unknown! Even with the best possible relationship, the kinds of adjustments you've had to make are really difficult. I second Bohne's questions about job, friends, independent life. Also, how many options are available to you if you went back to Australia? Like, would your old employer be likely to hire you back? Etc.

I do think that, unfortunately, what you describe is a recipe for disaster even if the people involved are actually perfectly suited to each other. If they aren't, everything is just magnified.

My guess about your husband's refusal to go to counseling is that he thinks he'll be told he's wrong and he doesn't want to hear that. Maybe because he is wrong, maybe because he has a lot of ingrained guilt about it that the logical part of his brain loudly contests, who knows.

There are definitely many issues there, the hiding debts etc. too. Are you independent from him, financially?

Dear Sozobe and Bohne,

Thank you so much for your kind words. Ive only scraped the surface in terms of the leap but I moved here b/c I thought we were fundamentally right for each other. We both felt we held the same core beliefs & could work the nuts & bolts out later. But later has arrived & we are unable to resolve anything.

Friends? They're scattered around the world. I have only one here. She's an Aussie too. I don't have much in common with American women & where we live, the cultural divide is vast. I've tried hard to make friends but I'm from a big vibrant city, full of energy and people. Where I live now is not like this. I don't fit. My husband has said he will move with me "if he has to" - but he made it sound as tho he'll move only if I force him to. I don't want to do that. He's lived here all his life.

Hobbies? Painting. Writing. I'm in the final year of my Masters but I can't focus so I"m going to chuck it. I just dont care anymore as it is causing me stress & increasing the pressure. This breaks my heart but if I don't ditch the study & try to fix this relationship instead, I'll go mad. We both will.

Financial independence & work? Not yet. I have not been allowed to work for months due to immigration. I got my green card a month ago but there is no freelance work in my field where we live. I will have to do contract work in other parts of the state which will mean being away from home for a few months at a time.

I set up my own bank account but this upset my husband a great deal. He felt I was "being seperate" (?!). I've had a bank account since I was 7 years old. It was no big deal to me. So unimportant that I didn't even think to discuss it with him before I set it up. I just did it on a whim. It was an error in hindsight not to talk to him about it. I have less than $20 in my account LOL but it doesn't matter. I asked him if he wanted me to close it down. He said no.

Going back to Oz is not really an option at this point. I came here to marry the man I loved and I dearly want it to work. We had a plan which didn't involve me giving up & going home. I moved everything here & have no job, no assets, no apartment in Oz. I mean, Oz will always be there. I won't be around forever and if I don't do something to mend this relationship, it won't be around forever either.

It hurts that my husband thinks all our problems are my fault. Granted, I'm no angel but he can't accept that he is not perfect either. I did not realise he was so self-righteous, judgemental and critical of other people's vulnerabilities & fears.

I think he views himself as a larger than life all-seeing, all-knowing character & to a certain extent, he is that and more. He can be a wonderful man, but I told him long ago that I don't need to be rescued. I'm not a damsel in need of a dragon-slaying chivalrous knight.

He told me he wanted us to be equal. But then hid things from me. He told me how important communication was - but then didn't tell me things. I told him I had boundaries and explained them. He crossed them, despite my protestations.

His words don't match his actions and this is difficult to reconcile. I did not know marriage would be this hard.

Thank you so much everyone for your thoughts and feedback. I am heartened to know that there are people out there willing to listen to my rants! I am grateful for your company and I like this forum a lot. It has some really interesting topics up for discussion on it.

- jazzie

Jazzie,

Hey. I'm sorry to hear about what you are going through. The more I read of what you are saying about your husband, the more your situation rang true to me. You see, I did pretty much the same thing as you except a whole heck of a lot quicker, and I got pretty much the same result as you did. Meaning someone who wasn't what he said he was. I guess what concerns me most about what I'm reading here is this comment: "I won't be around forever and if I don't do something to mend this relationship, it won't be around forever either."

Relationships are a two way street. One person cannot carry the whole load and should not be asked to carry the whole load, or take responsibility for mending of it when there are problems. It takes two to tango. He has a responsibility in this as well. He also should step up to the plate to help fix the problems that are occurring right now. It's not ALL your fault, therefore it is not ALL your responsibility to make it right. If he's not willing to, he doesn't love you as much as he is telling you he does. He loves himself more and is more concerned with protecting himself and making himself look alright, than facing the truth and dealing with the problems with you.

Please know I'm not saying any of this to hurt your feelings. I would just hate to see you spend months or years trying desperately to fix something that your "husband" doesn't even seem to be acknowledging is wrong. Except that YOU are depressed. Heaven forbid he acknowledge HE might actually be part of the reason why you are depressed. Basically what I'm trying to say here Jazzie, is you can't fix this alone. You can't fix this with just you going to counselling. Your husband has to come to the place to realize and admit that he might actually be part of the problem here. Until he does you are fighting a losing battle because relationships are a two way street.

Edit:

Geez... I got to thinking about what I wrote here and I want to add one more thing. I'm not saying run for the hills or blame him for everything. I just want to tell you that the greatest lesson I learned through all of what I went through was when to say enough is enough and walk away. Only you can figure out where you need to draw the line on this because you know your limits and what you want. Please just keep in mind that this isn't all your fault. You are not the only problem in this marriage, and if you get to the point where enough is enough, don't be afraid to walk away. I did, and I'll tell you something. I am much happier now than I was for even a moment in the four months I was with that guy. Take care of yourself and know that we are here to listen if you need to talk.

Hi Hephizbah,

Thanks for your eloquent thoughts - and in no way were my feelings hurt or even slightly dented btw - but thanks for thinking of them! I appreciate your candour.

How did you wake up to your situation and what preceded it? Also, how did you solve it?

I've left men before b/c they were pretenders & I wonder if this is a pattern. Perhaps I just expect too much and I am too gullible in the beginning? But I don't think so. I just want what I want and there shouldn't be any reason why I can't get it. I'm not a high maintenance princess afterall! Altho, I am relentlessly unforgiving & this has worked against me many times before.

While I know it takes 2 to tango, I don't know what else to do except to fix my 50% of the relationship and ask my husband to put in his own 50%. If he doesn't do that, then I suppose I have my answer as to his level of commitment.

On that, I do not know what my 50% should comprise of. Nor do I know what his 50% should be. Do you know what I mean? This is why I wanted counselling so we could work out together who is supposed to do what. Neither of us have been married b4 & it's confusing.

Perhaps we could just wipe the slate clean and start again. But how do we do that when I do not believe his answers? I do not want to ask him questions about where certain things are in case he fobs me off - even tho I know where he has put those things (ie: out of my sight). Am I ambushing him? Or am I just looking for the truth? I don't know. If I DONT ask him, would I just be avoiding the issue altogether and therefore be lying to myself?

Oh, I don't know. It hurts my head.

Thank you so much again for listening. I'm very grateful to be able to write here. It makes me feel not so lonely in this situation.

- jazzie

Hi Heph,

Dang! I just read your edit - sorry, I didn't see it earlier & you basically answered my questions in it!

Congratulations on leaving that bad relationship. It is a really empowering thing to do - I left my previous fiancee after he had moved countries to be with me. I learned by accident that he was addicted to hardcore online porn. The most humiliating & degrading stuff I'd ever seen. Nothing illegal just horrible, horrible stuff. It occured to me that he wanted to be with me in order to legitimise his secret life b/c I suspected nothing, had a great job, good family connections, etc. He was a user and a fake.

So you can see why porn is a hot button for me. My husband knew this history months before we were even romantically involved.

This is why hiding his stash has hit me like a bolt from the sky. I trusted him and I see his behaviour as betrayal of that trust. I feel gutted.

Can trust be restored in something like this? I mean, I'm not making a moutain out of a molehill - I just want the guy I believed he was. An open, honest, SHARING kind of guy...

sigh.

Thank you again

- all jazzed out

Jazzie, I'm mostly just popping in to tell you welcome to a2k-- I'm glad it's helping you at least a little to know you can post here and people are pulling for you. Keep talking as much as you want to, there are so many good-hearted people here who will be happy to give you a friendly cyber ear to confide in!

I have to say, your situation sounds so worrisome, because of you being in a new country without a support system. I'm glad that you mention that you've ended relationships before and you're not afraid to send a guy packing when you realize he's not good for you-- you're not going to put up with just anything he gives you, which was my concern.

It does sound like you're kind of at an impasse unless/until he's willing to start discussing his role in the problems. I hope that can be worked out.

I'm sending you good thoughts!

Jazzie--

Your husband doesn't want a wife with her own bank account, but perhaps he's also scared by being his wife's only personal resource in a world that is strange and unfamiliar to her.

In my first marriage I moved 14 times in 12 years. I know just how hard it is to start building personal contacts when you have no job, no way of meeting compatible people.

You seem to feel that right now you are too demoralized to expend energy in making personal contacts. I've been there--but unless you invest energy your inner resources will dwindle.

If face-to-face exploring and socializing is too taxing for now, you could become involved in an Internet community. You must find something to think about and to occupy your time besides your loneliness and your shaky marriage.

Well interestingly enough I woke up to my situation by talking to people here at A2K. I came here looking for advice because I was pretty darn miserable at the time and several people jumped in, said some things I needed to hear, eventually it sunk in, and I asked him to move out. It was all pretty foggy to me at the time though. Such a confusing mess.

The guy I married played the part of a "God fearing" man who wanted everything I wanted out of life, exactly. I'm not kidding either. He had dotted all his "i's" and crossed all his "t's" and didn't miss a beat. THE day we got married he changed. He no longer wanted to have sex with me. When we did I practically had to beg for it, then he'd get pissed because I wasn't doing things right and I was extremely uncomfortable with some of the stuff he wanted me to do. I was extremely uncomfortable in general because he almost always hurt me or made me bleed when we did have sex and he seemed to like that, or just not care. He didn't talk all sweet and charming anymore.

He started telling me that what I wanted wasn't important because as the "husband" he knew what was best for our "family", even though everything he wanted was the exact opposite of what I wanted, only he forgot to mention that BEFORE we got married. Even though I told him 100 times, don't marry me if you don't want the same things as me, because I'm not giving up my dreams for you, and I don't want the american dream. He began drinking really heavy and when he was drunk he was one of two ways: a happy drunk who talked about how great he was, or a mad drunk waiting to pick a fight with me about something.

As it turns out, a month after we got married he told me he had slept with his brothers ex, and she was pregnant and there was a possibility it was his since they had both slept with her within a two week period. Of course we couldn't tell his brother though because he'd be mad and so would his wife. Much later after I asked him to move out I did the math in my head and figured out that had happened while we were engaged, and I seriously wonder actually if she was the reason he never wanted to sleep with me. He worked first shift, I worked second.

As things progressed he became very verbally and emotionally abusive to me. He even started getting rather sadistic near the end there. Intentionally pushing my buttons until I would blow then getting this wicked smile on his face. At first when he would berate me, I would actually sit there and listen to him for two hours. Tell me what a horrible wife I was, a horrible christian, and so forth. Then I just started going strait to bed when I came home if he was drunk. Then he started following me into the bedroom. He would push until one of two things happened: I cried or I got mad. He always apologized the next day.

Eventually though I started fighting back. A2K helped with that too actually. I took some of the debating skills I was learning here and would spin his arse in circles when we were talking. He'd get so pissed because he couldn't out talk me anymore. I asked him to move out when we had a fight that he got me so angry that I actually hit something. Also the next day he did not apologize as usual, but reinerated everything he had said the night before. I had actually asked him to go to counseling with me several times within the four months we were together.

He refused every time. He said I was the problem in our relationship and I needed to get help not him. Then he tried to use counseling as a bargaining chip when he had moved out and wanted to move back in. He said he'd go IF I'd let him move back in. I told him to stick it up his rear. Honestly though I secretly hoped he would change his mind about me, about us, about our marriage. I secretly hoped he would decide our relationship was worth fighting for. I thought it was, but I had realized I couldn't fight alone. He never did so I moved back to FL with my family. I understand how you feel though because if I had thought for a second he would change his mind and fight for "us" I would have stayed and fought.

That's it in a nutshell. I'm still a little sad. I really thought I loved him and he loved me. I wouldn't have married him otherwise. I think the situation actually helped me to grow up a little though. To drop some of those naive fantasies I had about life, relationships, marriage, and so forth. I still miss the man I thought I was marrying though. I sincerely do. I completely understand how you feel about that. We're still married. He won't file for divorce because he's not even willing to put out half the cost. So in one more month I will have established my residency here in FL and will be getting the papers ready. But I've got to tell you something else here.

Just recently I had a fling and it was the most liberating experience of my life. I was sexually abused several times through out my childhood, late teens and early 20's, and then had a kick where I just sold out and became the "wham bam thank you ma'am" queen for a while. Of course I was completely wasted for every one night stand I ever had. Then I went almost 13 yrs without sex and walked into that marriage. You can imagine my disappointment, I'm sure. But this guy was so kind and gentle with me. So patient and willing to help me, not wanting to hurt me. I think, quite honestly it was the most wonderful experience I've ever had, and it's given me hope and the courage to step outside some of the boundaries I had set for myself.

It does get better you know? I know it's tough right now, and I hope for you that if you want for it to work out with him, he will choose that too. I understand the heart break of losing someone you loved and thought was quite different than they are and I hope that's not how it turns out. But know that if it does, you deserve better than that. You deserve someone who will love you back and return the affection you give them. You deserve to be treated with dignity and respect. Believe that, and don't let this guy walk all over you ok?

Dear Heph,

What can I say. Thank you so much for your honesty ... if only I could stop the tears from rolling down my cheeks. How you survived such a series of shocking experiences is testimony to your amazing inner strength and personal fortitude. I feel privileged that you shared your story with me and I am extremely relieved you managed to get away from such a mean spirited bully.

Did he follow you or did he just leave you alone after you moved back? I hope he leaves you alone for the rest of your life. You're one strong gal and you deserve a stellar relationship.

I'm also glad that you had a wonderful fling too ... it is a joy to spend time with someone who is kind & good b/c it puts faith back in human nature to a certain extent.

I hope you don't think me too nosey, but how come you had to apply for papers to move to FL? Are you not an American citizen? How curious!

Thanks for writing

- jazzie

Hey Noddy,

Thanx for this ... it's something I've thought about a lot & I know that our financial sitch is a big responsiblity for my husb. We have other income but it varies month to month and I am keen to get working so that I can also contribute financially. Without his financial assistance, I probably would not be here.

You're right about my energy being depleted. I feel utterly spent with worry over this. Hence the meds. I've been a head-case for 10 months so I made enquiries today about working in another city in the hope that this might give my husb and I a break from each other? (personally, I don't think we need a break, but if I don't get busy my head will explode)

I miss working terribly, I miss the cut & thrust of it so much that some days I lay in bed and cry until 3pm. Walking away from my studies only makes my sense of failure greater. I've gone from being an A Grade overacheiver in my previous life to coming to the US and not even being able to put petrol in my car. Things here are so foreign that it makes me feel like a pre-schooler. Yet, I lived in England & Canada previously, so why this is so hard is a mystery.

I've become anti-social and dont care to talk to anyone except my family & friends back home. My husband is an only child with v few friends here so we have no social life. His family love me but I dont care to even return their phone calls which is an awful way to behave, but I don't want to see anyone.

Yeh, the moving around thing is hard. I moved 11 times btwn 2001 & 2005 ... cities, states and countries, and man - Im worn out! I wanted so many things to work out when I arrived here but I fell in a big hole instead. I did not think it would be so uh "challenging" being a square peg in a round hole. Nothing is familiar.

My husband was my rock. He is the person I came here for (and for us). And with everything that is going on, he is sadly the person I do not feel I can rely on in a crisis - and particularly not the one to help get me thru this stuff. Y? B/c his behaviour is part of the prob.

I am grateful for your thoughts, Noddy Thanx muchly.

-- jazzie

Hey cypher - many thanx for your warm welcome . This is such a supportive network with friendly people who can offer really constructive feedback. Wow. I wish I'd found a2k earlier!

Oh yes, I've left men previously & am usually the one who initiates the break-up. In my youth, I used to tolerate all kinds of crap but as I've gotten older (now in my 40s) I know what I want and I choose to spend my time with friends who love me, and whom I love back. The bullies and oxygen theives will always be on the periphery, but I am a lot smarter at spotting them and leaving them for dead.

After 4 marriage proposals over the years, I finally accepted one from someone I felt truly equal to...that is, my current husb. Thank you so much for your hopes for our future - I hope we can get past this stand-off.

Can I make an awful confession?

I'm dreading Thanksgiving. And Christmas. And New Year.

Pretending to be happy when I'm miserable is not my forte.

-- jazzie

[quote]I did not know marriage would be this hard. [/quote]

I sincerely believe this is not what it is supposed to be like.

I have been married for 2 1/2 years now. With my husband and me it's the opposite, though, he's American, but living with me in Germany.
We might have to move to the STates for two to three years due to his job, but even though I was reluctant to agree to this at first, now I just know that we can do anything, as long as we are together.

Even after getting married and having a baby earlier this year, each of us stayed very much an independent person.
We never have had a joint bank account, we don't do calculations (I pay half and you pay half) everything always just seems to work out.

We don't agree on everything, especially his political opinions I cannot comprehend!
What I find very very important is that he accepts me the way I am, and he respects me, just like I accept and respect him.

And this is exactly what seems to be missing in your relationship.

You said you were discussing boundaries and then your husband simply crossed them. THIS IS NOT ACCEPTABLE BEHAVIOUR in my books.
You say he never admits he was wrong in anything, how can you get anywhere with a person like that.

I see where you are going with wanting to fight, but maybe it's time for you to accept that you were wrong in marrying him.
He seems to make your life miserable and nothing but miserable.
You say he can be a wonderful person, but I have not seen any of this in your descriptions.

Whatever you decide to do, don't give up your masters, though.
This is something you are doing for you and your future.
And when fighting for your marriage becomes an all-time-consuming task, think about where you end up after you have given up everything and your husband still won't budge an inch!

Ranting and raving is OK for some time, but then there will have to be a time of action.
For this I wish you all the best!

Dear Bohne,

Many thanx for your response and yes, you're quite right. I can rant, rave & vent ... but eventually I will have to DO something. It is lovely to hear your relationship is so healthy with your husband. I love that whole acceptance and respect thing, it's the way it's meant to be.

Thank you also for encouraging me to try to complete my Masters, but I have to be honest. I think it would come at the cost of my marriage. And if I had to make a choice between the two, I'd choose saving the marriage over getting my degree. In spite of what's gone on, I still feel there is enough love in our marriage to get it back on track. And hopefully, keep it there.

I need to feel I'm contributing to this relationship financially so getting a job is also a bigger priority than my study. I need to work to get my self esteem & independence back. Any job I get will be in a different city to the one I live in.

Study-wise, being chained to my desk, staring blankly at the screen for a year has only pushed me deeper into depression. I've wept and wrestled with it. I'm sick of doing that.

Work and study are mutually exclusive. In my field, I have to be on call 24/7 so study would suffer, I wouldn't get any sleep - so then work would suffer. It's one or the other.

The way I see it, my 3 priorities are:

1. marriage. 2. work. 3. study.

I feel capable of achieving two out of three of the above.

Working on No. 2 will help me to fix No. 1 in consulstation with my husb. This leaves No. 3 (study) as the sacrifical lamb. I am very far behind in my studies and I'll need a great deal of help to get thru the thesis which I have neglected for over a year. I looked for a tutor here, but couldn't afford the fees. It has been a lonely learning experience, heightened by intense isolation and a struggle which I am almost ready to give up on in order to simplify my life.

I need to get back to basics. Back to person I once was. I need my life back. Ditching study might help acheive that.

Throwing in study is not ideal. I would prefer to keep on with it but I feel the personal cost is too high & the thesis needs too much work. I wanted to change the world with it - I had such high hopes & think I just bit off more than I could chew. So many unexpected, unplanned things happened that it derailed my whole life and I need to get things back on track.

Does anyone think I'm bonkers for wanting to ditch it? Does my reasoning sound "sound", self-sacrificing, selfish or just plain stupid?? All responses considered!! I am too close to the damn forest to see the trees and am trying to stand back to get some perspective.

Thank you yet again for reading this

-- jazzie

Hi Jazzie - welcome to A2K.

~~~~~

I think one of the things you might pick up from Hephzibah's recent experiences is that she's learned a lot about who she is - right at her core.

Your thread could also be titled - New Marriage, Who Am I?

You've got to figure out who you are in a new relationship, in a new country, in a new vocational situation (leaving/losing work/studies at the same time is a huge vocational change) all at the same time.

Who are you and what do you want? What things, in a relationship, are deal-breakers? Do you have something invested in the marriage succeeding, even if you logically figure out that it doesn't fit you and your requirements?

Hard slog.

Good luck! Keep coming back with questions - there are some wonderful people around here, with lots of different perspectives.

From my end of things, I won't say older and wiser, but just older, I am not confident about your marriage (and I didn't let go easily either) and cringe to see you toss your masters. Please don't just dump it but go through whatever rigamarole is necessary at the admistrative offices to drop out if you feel you must at this time.

I think it's a biggo mistake to stop the masters. Maybe you can't do it now, or maybe you'll change areas of interest... but don't just walk. Let there be a way back in, administratively. See a counsellor...