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When Does Life Begin?

 
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 01:47 pm
Bartikus: So then how do you feel about a one- child government policy?


Why should I care? Didn't affect me in the past, nor will it affect me in the future. Not my concern or care.

Do you care? If so, why?
0 Replies
 
Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 01:48 pm
I'm sorry, what have I denied? I have in no way denied what happens to the unborn in a pregancy or and abortion.

I'm just pointnig out what you said.
Bartikus wrote:
I agree that it's no one's business what a woman does with her body.

HER body.


Your statement is the one in denial. It denies by ommission that anything happens to the mother's body.

Told you not to go here.
K
O
0 Replies
 
Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 01:51 pm
spendius wrote:
How about if all the women decide to have 10 babies each because they like babies so much.

How is that prevented without hypnotism or locking them up? It isn't all that long since the Soviets werre handing out medals and the title of Mother of the Soviet Union bestowed upon her at a public ceremony with everybody clapping and beaming. That's the sort of hypnotism Ms Greer was talking about and the sort of hypnotism I'm talking about.

It what way is the advertising of luxury consumer goods different from a shiny object being swung before the eyes accompanied by a soothing voice?

If she wants to have 20 babies, I might find it foolish, irrespobncible, careless, or any number of other emotions, but it's still her choice.

T
K
O
0 Replies
 
Bartikus
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 02:05 pm
spendius wrote:
That is putting it kindly.


It is at the very least.....denial!
0 Replies
 
Bartikus
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 02:12 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
Bartikus: So then how do you feel about a one- child government policy?


Why should I care? Didn't affect me in the past, nor will it affect me in the future. Not my concern or care.

Do you care? If so, why?


Because you said you cared!?

cicerone imposter wrote:
I only care that the woman decides what she wishes to do; in other words, she has "free choice" without the likes of you interfering in her choice - good or bad. Her body, her choice. Simple.


So you don't care about her "free choice" now? It's not your concern or care now right?

Pro choice or pro abort is CI?
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 02:18 pm
Bartikus wrote:
cicerone imposter wrote:
Bartikus: So then how do you feel about a one- child government policy?


Why should I care? Didn't affect me in the past, nor will it affect me in the future. Not my concern or care.

Do you care? If so, why?


Because you said you cared!?

cicerone imposter wrote:
I only care that the woman decides what she wishes to do; in other words, she has "free choice" without the likes of you interfering in her choice - good or bad. Her body, her choice. Simple.


So you don't care about her "free choice" now? It's not your concern or care now right?

Pro choice or pro abort is CI?


Bartikus, You're about as stupid as one can get. What any government does is beyond my control. Any citizen living in those countries decide for themselves how they will live by their government mandates. They're the ones that chooses their actions, not me. That's called "reality" in my neck of the woods. You can get as ridiculous and stupid as you wish, but if you want to continue any discussion, at least live in the "real" world.
0 Replies
 
Bartikus
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 02:25 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
Bartikus wrote:
cicerone imposter wrote:
Bartikus: So then how do you feel about a one- child government policy?


Why should I care? Didn't affect me in the past, nor will it affect me in the future. Not my concern or care.

Do you care? If so, why?


Because you said you cared!?

cicerone imposter wrote:
I only care that the woman decides what she wishes to do; in other words, she has "free choice" without the likes of you interfering in her choice - good or bad. Her body, her choice. Simple.


So you don't care about her "free choice" now? It's not your concern or care now right?

Pro choice or pro abort is CI?


Bartikus, You're about as stupid as one can get. What any government does is beyond my control. Any citizen living in those countries decide for themselves how they will live by their government mandates. They're the ones that chooses their actions, not me. That's called "reality" in my neck of the woods. You can get as ridiculous and stupid as you wish, but if you want to continue any discussion, at least live in the "real" world.


I posted your statements and you call me stupid?

lol

That says it all.

Here they are again:

Bartikus: So then how do you feel about a one- child government policy?

cicerone imposter wrote:
Why should I care? Didn't affect me in the past, nor will it affect me in the future. Not my concern or care.

Do you care? If so, why?

cicerone imposter wrote:
I only care that the woman decides what she wishes to do; in other words, she has "free choice" without the likes of you interfering in her choice - good or bad. Her body, her choice. Simple.


Ridiculous and stupid you say? lol

I agree
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 02:38 pm
Bartikus wrote:
cicerone imposter wrote:
Bartikus wrote:
cicerone imposter wrote:
Bartikus: So then how do you feel about a one- child government policy?


Why should I care? Didn't affect me in the past, nor will it affect me in the future. Not my concern or care.

Do you care? If so, why?


Because you said you cared!?

cicerone imposter wrote:
I only care that the woman decides what she wishes to do; in other words, she has "free choice" without the likes of you interfering in her choice - good or bad. Her body, her choice. Simple.


So you don't care about her "free choice" now? It's not your concern or care now right?

Pro choice or pro abort is CI?


Bartikus, You're about as stupid as one can get. What any government does is beyond my control. Any citizen living in those countries decide for themselves how they will live by their government mandates. They're the ones that chooses their actions, not me. That's called "reality" in my neck of the woods. You can get as ridiculous and stupid as you wish, but if you want to continue any discussion, at least live in the "real" world.


I posted your statements and you call me stupid?

lol

That says it all.

Here they are again:

Bartikus: So then how do you feel about a one- child government policy?

cicerone imposter wrote:
Why should I care? Didn't affect me in the past, nor will it affect me in the future. Not my concern or care.

Do you care? If so, why?

cicerone imposter wrote:
I only care that the woman decides what she wishes to do; in other words, she has "free choice" without the likes of you interfering in her choice - good or bad. Her body, her choice. Simple.


Stupid you say? lol

I agree



You laugh at yourself, because you're so stupid you don't understand what it is you're laughing about.

A government mandate to have one child has absolutely nothing to do with my advocacy for the woman to have free choice.

You not only lack in logical thinking, but also don't understand the reality of this world.
0 Replies
 
Bartikus
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 02:43 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
Bartikus wrote:
cicerone imposter wrote:
Bartikus wrote:
cicerone imposter wrote:
Bartikus: So then how do you feel about a one- child government policy?


Why should I care? Didn't affect me in the past, nor will it affect me in the future. Not my concern or care.

Do you care? If so, why?


Because you said you cared!?

cicerone imposter wrote:
I only care that the woman decides what she wishes to do; in other words, she has "free choice" without the likes of you interfering in her choice - good or bad. Her body, her choice. Simple.


So you don't care about her "free choice" now? It's not your concern or care now right?

Pro choice or pro abort is CI?


Bartikus, You're about as stupid as one can get. What any government does is beyond my control. Any citizen living in those countries decide for themselves how they will live by their government mandates. They're the ones that chooses their actions, not me. That's called "reality" in my neck of the woods. You can get as ridiculous and stupid as you wish, but if you want to continue any discussion, at least live in the "real" world.


I posted your statements and you call me stupid?

lol

That says it all.

Here they are again:

Bartikus: So then how do you feel about a one- child government policy?

cicerone imposter wrote:
Why should I care? Didn't affect me in the past, nor will it affect me in the future. Not my concern or care.

Do you care? If so, why?

cicerone imposter wrote:
I only care that the woman decides what she wishes to do; in other words, she has "free choice" without the likes of you interfering in her choice - good or bad. Her body, her choice. Simple.


Stupid you say? lol

I agree



You laugh at yourself, because you're so stupid you don't understand what it is you're laughing about.

A government mandate to have one child has absolutely nothing to do with my advocacy for the woman to have free choice.

You not only lack in logical thinking, but also don't understand the reality of this world.


Do you think a government mandate to allow only one child opposes a woman's right to choose (free choice) for herself?

Would'nt a forced abortion be an infringement on a woman's right to choose? I thought you were against government intrusion in such matters?

Is it only the "likes of me" interfering with her decision you contest?
0 Replies
 
Bartikus
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 03:48 pm
Diest TKO wrote:
I'm sorry, what have I denied? I have in no way denied what happens to the unborn in a pregancy or and abortion.

I'm just pointnig out what you said.
Bartikus wrote:
I agree that it's no one's business what a woman does with her body.

HER body.


Your statement is the one in denial. It denies by ommission that anything happens to the mother's body.

Told you not to go here.
K
O


I agreed something happens to a woman's body when she becomes pregnant. Something happens that brings this about as well.

What happens to the unborn when aborted Diest. You omitted your answer.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 04:24 pm
Bartikus: Do you think a government mandate to allow only one child opposes a woman's right to choose (free choice) for herself?

Would'nt a forced abortion be an infringement on a woman's right to choose? I thought you were against government intrusion in such matters?

Is it only the "likes of me" interfering with her decision you contest?


You are completely confused; there is no relation between my advocacy for a woman's right to choose vs any government mandate that controls the number of children. They are two separate issues, and I don't control either one!
0 Replies
 
Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 04:34 pm
Bartikus wrote:
Diest TKO wrote:
I'm sorry, what have I denied? I have in no way denied what happens to the unborn in a pregancy or and abortion.

I'm just pointnig out what you said.
Bartikus wrote:
I agree that it's no one's business what a woman does with her body.

HER body.


Your statement is the one in denial. It denies by ommission that anything happens to the mother's body.

Told you not to go here.
K
O


I agreed something happens to a woman's body when she becomes pregnant. Something happens that brings this about as well.

What happens to the unborn when aborted Diest. You omitted your answer.

I omitted nothing. I was also asked nothing until the above post.

The unborn is destroyed and thus stopped from having any further cellular development.

Thank you for admitting that a woman's body goes through changes during pregnancy.

T
K
O
0 Replies
 
Bartikus
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 05:34 pm
.....and the changes endured by a woman who becomes pregnant is peanuts compared to utter dismemberment and destruction of the body as with abortion.
0 Replies
 
Bartikus
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 05:36 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
Bartikus: Do you think a government mandate to allow only one child opposes a woman's right to choose (free choice) for herself?

Would'nt a forced abortion be an infringement on a woman's right to choose? I thought you were against government intrusion in such matters?

Is it only the "likes of me" interfering with her decision you contest?


You are completely confused; there is no relation between my advocacy for a woman's right to choose vs any government mandate that controls the number of children. They are two separate issues, and I don't control either one!


So then, would you oppose a government mandate outlawing abortion?

No relation between a woman's right to choose and any government mandate requiring abortion?

It's funny.....I thought there was? Thanks for the correction.

If government made abortion illegal....what relation would that have to your advocacy for a woman's right to choose?

It's difficult for me to understand your position. I'm sure it's a reflection of my stupidity so please try to give me some leeway.

Thank you.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 05:50 pm
So then, would you oppose a government mandate outlawing abortion?

CLUE: I don't have anything to do about our laws, or the laws of other countries.

No relation between a woman's right to choose and any government mandate requiring abortion?

See above answer.

It's funny.....I thought there was? Thanks for the correction.

You're still confused.

If government made abortion illegal....what relation would that have to your advocacy for a woman's right to choose?

My advocacy for a woman to choose doesn't change no matter what laws any government establishes.

It's difficult for me to understand your position. I'm sure it's a reflection of my stupidity so please try to give me some leeway.

Yes, I agree, you are stupid.

Thank you.

You're welcome.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 06:52 pm
TKO wrote-

Quote:
You brought up hypnotizing and when you were called on it you then referred to it as if you had not been the one who suggested it.


When?

I brought up hypnotizing. Twice, When was I called on it. When did I refer to it as if I had not suggested it. I had every intention of suggesting it. Why would I do what you said? Nobody else suggested it as far as I know. I can't imagine what you are talking about.

I know what-

"Bow down to her on Sunday
Salute her when her birthday comes
Bow down to her on Sunday
Salute her when her birthday comes
For Halloween buy her a trumpet
And for Christmas buy her a drum.

She wears an Egyptian ring
It sparkles before she speaks
She wears an Egyptian ring
It sparkles before she speaks
She's a hypnotist collector
You are a walking antique."

means.

Do you?

Not a chance.You just like piss-balling about with other people's lives.

Quote:
I don't need anyone else's argument, and I'm not here to defend anyone's beliefs but my own. I think this is pretty funny when contrasted against your belief that when women are given free choice they just ruin their lives. You are a biggot of the first order.


You have no other way of proceeding than to derive your position from someone else. It's inescapable if you live in a culture. You might choose who's arguments to fit your purposes, such as self justification, but you get them from somewhere. Some turn you took way back. How can you have your own beliefs. You wouldn't even have language without someone else.

How does facing up to reality constitute being a bigot? Have you never seen women organising a bring-and-buy sale at the vicarage?

Quote:
You have yet to do anything that you have said above. Adn yes you are running. To not run would be to admit that your suggestion of hynotism was poor and would ultimately violate a woman.


I admit no such thing. I'm not running. That's an idea in your own head. A convenient one I know but still it's one that resides inside your own conk and nowhere else. I brought in hypnotism brazenly. It wasn't a typo.

What have I said above that I haven't done. There's loads of things I haven't done. An infinite number actually minus the things I have done. Which is still infinite I gather. If you subtract any number you can think up from infinity the answer is infinity. That's sums not maths.

Quote:
We aren't talking about every woman?


I'm certainly relieved about that. Some of the women I have read about who had real choice were a bit of a handful. Take Poppea Sabina for instance. Are you talking about women who have no choice pretending they have choice or women who have untrammeled choice?

Quote:
Do you know what the word "all" means?


I certainly do. I have my doubts that you do though.

Quote:
A choice for "some" eh? So you then are retracting your statement that homosexuality is a fertility strike, I assume. If it's only a choice for some then it can't be considered a strike for those who are homosexuals by choice. Nice use of the word "some." Especcially following such a definitive and broad statement that homosexuality is a fertility strike.


Did I mention T.S. Eliot and the Marqise de Sade earlier in that regard. I try not to repeat myself. I don't wish to bore my readers with repetition.

Quote:
You're getting despirate now and it's even more pathetic. Women should have all of the above. As for your idea that the world would then turn on christianity and go to a communist dictatorship, I'd like to see you prove it. First, Christian women would be able to choose not to have sex, they would be able to choose to dress as christians do, and they could continue to choose to give birth anytime they are pregnant. Christianity would continue. Second, anarchy and communism would hardly be a product. Taking away power from one gender however could create disorder, you claim is unsupported, and a poor attempt to ingender fear in the minds of conservative christians.


If this is "despirate" it isn't all that bad. I was talking about women who want to have sex all up and down the block whenever they feel like it. What do Christian women have to do with that. You don't want to hear what Christian women think about where you are coming from.

Do you?

The ones who come in the pub on gig nights look as if they can hardly wait to doff-off. They love displaying their charms. You can see their eyes all gleaming when men are fighting over them. They are sound Darwinians you see.

Quote:
It hasn't happened, ever. You examples are not of when ALL women had a fertility strike. They are just a diversion to the fact that you acknowledge how poor your own argument is.


It has happened. You won't have heard of it because it died out. Selected out they say. Obviously. When it got serious it was stopped by sound management assuming you don't care for cave dwelling and associated conveniences.

What on earth is a "diversion to the fact" supposed to mean in relation to me acknowledging how poor my argument is which I don't for a moment.

Quote:
I don't support the idea of the draft.


How very nice.

When did I mention these circumstances? They were drafted to see Hitler off. I've known plenty of them. They had little choice. And they were risking being blown to bits. I daresay a few of them might have swapped for being pregnant.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 07:08 pm
Larry "Ratso" Sloman didn't say that Dylan brought the tribe the news of the hour just because it sounded good.
0 Replies
 
Bartikus
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 08:38 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:

My advocacy for a woman to choose doesn't change no matter what laws any government establishes.


So you advocate a woman's choice (as a pro choicer) to have more than one child (if she so chooses) and oppose forced abortion no matter what the laws..... right?

We already know you do not have power over the laws yet, this does not stop you from speaking out against the pro life position. Now does it?

Why raise heck with pro lifers and stay silent when it comes to others who interfere with a woman's choice?

Does a woman's choice to abort supersede a woman's choice to have children?
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 08:46 pm
Bartikus wrote:
cicerone imposter wrote:

My advocacy for a woman to choose doesn't change no matter what laws any government establishes.


So you advocate a woman's choice (as a pro choicer) to have more than one child (if she so chooses) and oppose forced abortion no matter what the laws..... right?



Bartikus, Are you really THAT stupid? How many ways do you want me to say "it's up to the woman to choose?"
0 Replies
 
Bartikus
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Dec, 2007 08:48 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
Bartikus wrote:
cicerone imposter wrote:

My advocacy for a woman to choose doesn't change no matter what laws any government establishes.


So you advocate a woman's choice (as a pro choicer) to have more than one child (if she so chooses) and oppose forced abortion no matter what the laws..... right?



Bartikus, Are you really THAT stupid? How many ways do you want me to say "it's up to the woman to choose?"


Oh ok, at first I thought you did'nt care if women were forced into abortion.(because you said you did'nt)

It's good to see your just as adamant against forced abortion as outlawing abortion or pro lifers! Rolling Eyes

It's ok. That's all you had to say........hey

Did you just ask a stupid guy how stupid he is.....smart guy?

How sharp is that?
0 Replies
 
 

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