THE DANGER OF GUN-FREE SCHOOL ZONES

Dave, I don't personally know a single person who died because he or she was not packing. Not packing a handgun doesn't endanger the average person. But having all packing would endanger all of us.

Thank goodness I was not allowed to pack a handgun when I was a kid. I would certainly have shot my older brother and Billy Campbell up the street.

The courts have overwhelmingly said that the second amendment doesn't preclude gun control, which still applies everywhere.

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Dave, I don't personally know a single person who died because he or she was not packing.

I don't personally know a single person who died because he or she was hit by a car.

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Not packing a handgun doesn't endanger the average person.

The FUNDAMENTAL principle of insurance,
that enables insurance companies to exist,
is that NOT all of their pool of assured risks
will fall victim to the risk against which thay r assured.
Thay SHARE the risk. The incentive is to protect the person
who is so unfortunate as to find himself in NON-AVERAGE peril
( e.g., fire, heart attack, loss of income, etc. )

The goal of a logical citizen shud NOT be to be safe and secure ONLY
if he is AVERAGE.

U can go for YEARS, and for decades without getting a flat tire ( hence, it is not an " AVERAGE " experience )
but it happened to ME 3 nites ago; my penultimate flat tire was in the 1970s.
I was not comforted by the fact that I was NOT AVERAGE
in being thusly afflicted.

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But having all packing would endanger all of us.

That belief is only your erroneous imagination at work.

Gun control is only a jonny-come-lately to the American experience;
a creature of the 1900s. Before then, there was little or no gun control,
except against the blacks, in the South.
In Florida, gun control was rejected in 1986,
in favor of the vu that every citizen can freely get a license to carry concealed guns,
if he did not have a bad history of criminality or of adjudicated mental defect.
The anti-freedom members of the Legislature of Florida,
led by one Mr. Silver, who shared your point of vu, Advocate.
The anti-freedom members of the Legislature of Florida screamed
that the streets wud run red with blood,
and bullets wud fly thicker than mosquitos in a swamp.

In 1987, crime dropped, and there were no ill effects of the gun freedom.
Mr. Silver was decent enuf to admit he was rong, and he apologized.
Since then about 39 more states have rejected gun control
in favor of the Florida philosophy; none of them has ever changed its mind
and reverted to gun control. Does that tell u anything, Advocate ??

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Thank goodness I was not allowed to pack a handgun when I was a kid.
I would certainly have shot my older brother and Billy Campbell up the street.

BALONEY ! ( I doubt that u were a murderer, by proclivity ).
If u had been sufficiently MOTIVATED,
thay 'd be dead.
Do u think that murderers WAITED for guns to be invented
before thay started killing anyone ?
Is that Y Julius Caesar was never assassinated ?

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The courts have overwhelmingly said that the second amendment
doesn't preclude gun control,

DOUBLE BALONEY !

In the case of US v. VERDUGO (199O) 11O S.Ct. 1O56
(at P. 1O61) the US Supreme Court declares that:

"The Second Amendment protects
'the right of the people to keep
and bear arms'".

THE SUPREME COURT THEN PROCEEDS TO DEFINE "THE PEOPLE" AS BEING
THE SAME PEOPLE WHO CAN VOTE TO ELECT THE US HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
EVERY SECOND YEAR. (Notably, one need not join the National Guard
in order to vote for his congressman.) The Court further defined "the people"
to mean those people who have a right peaceably to assemble [1st Amendment]
and those who have the right to
be free of unreasonable searches and seizures [4th Amendment]
in their persons houses, papers and effects (personal rights, not rights of states,
as the authoritarian-collectivists allege of the 2nd Amendment).
THE COURT HELD THAT THE TERM "THE PEOPLE" MEANS THE SAME THING
EVERYWHERE THAT IT IS FOUND IN THE CONSTITUTION OF 1787, AND
EVERYWHERE THAT IT IS FOUND IN THE BILL OF RIGHTS.

In VERDUGO (supra), the Court indicated that the same people are protected
by the First, SECOND, Fourth, Ninth and Tenth Amendments;
i.e.THE PEOPLE who can speak n worship freely are THE PEOPLE who can keep and bear arms.

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which still applies everywhere.

Rong.
Alaska has repealed and rejected all of its gun control laws, several years ago.
Vermont has NEVER had any gun laws, and it has always been a safe state.
40 of the 50 states have now rejected gun control
( meaning discriminatory licensure of the right of self defense,
at the unfettered discretion of the local authorities ),
in favor of the legal right to carry concealed,
if the licensee has no bad criminal history nor adjudicated mental defect.

David

It is silly to liken a handgun, which is designed to kill people, to a car or the like, which are staples of civilized society.

M, you are a lame dog.
Or, you and Dave are of the same litter.

But having all packing would endanger all of us.

Dave, you know very well that Verdugo is dicta and is not even close to being dispositive relative to the second amendment.

I am familiar with Parker, which is one of two cases misinterpreting the second amendment. I hope it stops with that case.

more kids shot in cleveland after the last lot shot in wisconsin.

ah so what i say they're only 'mericuns

you carry on

Criminals will ALWAYS arm themselves.

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Criminals will ALWAYS arm themselves.

Oh yeah. That's why the criminals in Britain and Holland and Canada and Spain are just shooting up their schools so regularly. Thank god that the US has so many guns floating around allowing that desireable level of defense that maintains those incredibly low gun-death statistics in the US.

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So, you've got to start arming ALL your 14 year olds now,

Only if thay make a pauper 's appeal.
As it is, u don 't give them free pens and paper.
Let them bring their own.
( I did when I was a child. )
Government was never granted any authority
to legislate in this area, the same as it cannot assign u a religion
and then make sure u arrive in church on time.

In PLANNED PARENTHOOD v. CASEY (1992) 112 S.Ct. 2791 (P. 28O5)
the US Supreme Court declares that:
"...by the express provisions of the FIRST EIGHT amendments to the Constitution"
rights were "guaranteed to THE INDIVIDUAL ...
It is a promise of the Constitution
that there is a realm of personal liberty
which the government may not enter." [emphasis added]
The 2nd Amendment is within "the first eight amendments".
( In the US Constitution, the 2nd Amendment protects the right to keep and bear arms )

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to protect themselves against other 14 year olds
who might want to go on a shooting rampage?

To protect themselves from people ( or from animals )
of ANY age who threaten them.
( Personally, I started in the 3rd Grade [ age 8 ] ).
The idea is that thay shud live long enuf to see
their later years.

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I'm truly interested in where you want to draw the line.
Maybe you should have them carrying side arms in kindergarten?

It is an error to ASSUME that government shud be drawing any lines of this nature.
Government has never been granted authority
to draw any lines in this area; it is NOT government 's function
to limit any person 's ability to defend his life;
to say to any person: " YOU have no right to defend your life
because YOU are too young. Screw u.
Just let criminals or animals kill u. "

Classes in competence, accuracy, and safety
shud be held in the schools, as early as possible.

I remember seeing a horrible account on TV
of a 7 year old boy who was riding his bike
in his neighborhood, after dinner,
when he was grabbed by a pervert,
and had his throat cut from one side
to the other, in addition to other mutilation.

He was helpless, in accordance with gun control law,
doubtless to the delight of the pervert,
who presumably did not wish to be defensively
mutilated by the boy. If he had been MY son,
I 'd desire that he cud defend himself.
Its only right.

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So cutting through all that, I want to be clear.
You want to live in a society where EVERYONE is armed?

Yes.
If a person has a dangerous history,
he shud be removed from society.

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14 year olds, 10 year olds, 7 year olds, 5 year olds?

Yes

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You made it clear that there should be NO line drawn. 3 year olds?
Basically, from the time their capable of picking the thing up and using? Have I got that right?

Yes.
In other words, go back to how it was
before around 1910, nationwide
( and maybe in England too before the First World War ? );
i.e., no laws about that.
David