For Neologist, and anyone else affiliated with watchtower.

Why not have PropMin come here to expose himself. Or, is that you?
Rolling Eyes

Back to the challenge you so adroitly evade: Witness to me about your message of truth.

You may start another topic if you think it necessary, or continue here.

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PropMin has a good command of the english language so why would you would think PropMin and Talkactive are the same person?

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Quote:

You are a real piece of work. If, as you say, you wish me to escape the frying pan, where must I go to escape the fire? Tell me about your PERFECT organization.

Neo, if you find it comfortable and have a need to belong to an Organisation, it is fully up to yourself to decide this and I'm fully agreed with Setanta in his statement, but if you harm yourself or others, by following and spreading doctrines which is well known and cost lives, I belive it is my duty as a good citizenry and being Christian, especially in my well informed situation, where knowledge obligate, about the Watchtower Society's non Biblical doctrines responsible for statistically 1000 adults and children death and dies every year. I do really hope you agree?

It seems that you haven't understand what Peter meant when Jesus ask his disciples if they also intended to lave him! Did he say that we should go to the Catholic Church, the Protestants or the Watchtower Society? No indeed not, he said that we shall go to Jesus! John 6:66-69!

6:66 From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him. 6:67 Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away? 6:68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life. 6:69 And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.

I just have to repeat my recommendation to you Neo, read your Bible every day and follow Jesus commandments and example, then you will not be away from the path.

At the Watchtower Building in Brooklyn, there is an announcement: Read the Bible every day. The correct and true announcement should have been: Read the Watchtower every day! But do as they say, but don't do as they do! Matthew 23:1-13!

Your frind Setanta wrote:

Quote:

It is not necessarily one with which i would disagree, but there is a value which i personally cherish which i consider more important than that, and that is that people are free agents, and have the right to believe what they like, and act upon that belief, so long as they do no harm to others.

Neo wrote:

Quote:

This topic is open to all a2k members. You may notice the number of views on most topics is roughly 10 times the number of posts. You may therefore assume that your drivel has been exposed as often as 3000 times. I could probably let this topic die by not posting further. I keep it alive for a reason.

It wasn't me who was trying to force anybody away from this topic, was it? What is your reaon for keepin it alive+

Neo, have you never ever thought of what comes forth here in this forum, or are you simply not interested in reading or focused on other things, than names and persons, rather that the topics content?

If you read the following by Jesus, then when I give you my statement here that I'm NOT Propmin, du you believe me then, maybe I shall use the same word to be understood; NO!!

The reason for guide your attention to the contents of Propmin, was that I couldn't have written it better than he/she/they did!

Quote:

5:33 Again, ye have heard that it hath been said by them of old time, Thou shalt not forswear thyself, but shalt perform unto the Lord thine oaths: 5:34 But I say unto you, Swear not at all; neither by heaven; for it is God's throne: 5:35 Nor by the earth; for it is his footstool: neither by Jerusalem; for it is the city of the great King. 5:36 Neither shalt thou swear by thy head, because thou canst not make one hair white or black. 5:37 But let your communication be, Yea, yea; Nay, nay: for whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil.

Neo I have the same comprehension as Tele, that our goal in this forum wasn't to teach you or others, what we believe or not, but to correct the misunderstanding on blood, through that give you and all other a fair chance to estimate whether the Watchtower Societies teachings in the question of blood is in harmony with the Bible and modern scientific knowledge instead of, you and others are going to be new victims of a misguide information and blood doctrine, which has and are going to send thousands of people into the death.

The Governing Body cover themselves with lawyers and the Un Chapter from 1948 in question of religious freedom, but misuse the chapter to spread their doctrines, a freedom they don't give their members, but keep them in fear with sanctions. They have, in accordance to my oppinion, become the evil servant. Matthew 24:48-51!

24:48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;
24:49 And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;
24:50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,
24:51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

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Teleologist wrote:

Quote:

It is a scientific fact that blood taken as a transfusion is not used by the body as food. Do you dispute this?

Neologist replied:

Quote:

No. What's your point?

My point is what it has always been. Your claim back on page 4 that taking a blood transfusion is the same as eating blood is not supported by any evidence. Your claim is based on nothing more than equating the transfusing of blood to intravenous feeding. But intravenous feeding involves putting substances into the veins that are used by the body as food. Since transfused blood is not used by the body as food then no feeding is taking place. Thus, your equating blood transfusions with intravenous feeding is bogus. Transfused blood is not consumed by the body as food. It remains in the circulatory system doing what blood is designed to do.

Teleologist wrote:

Quote:

Do you dispute that the Watchtower allows JW's to take transfusions of hemoglobin? Do you dispute that the Watchtower forbids JW's from taking transfusions of platelets? Can you explain scripturally why one is okay and the other isn't?

Neologist replied:

Quote:

No. No. Yes.

Okay. Let's hear your scriptural explanation as to why hemoglobin is permitted but platelets are forbidden.

Teleologist said:

Quote:

Do you dispute that there may be JW's that disagree with this policy?

Neologist replied:

Quote:

Which policy? You mentioned two.

The policy of disfellowshipping and shunning a JW that takes a transfusion of platelets but respecting a JW that takes a transfusion of hemoglobin.

Teleologist wrote:

Quote:

Would a Bible student be able to get baptized as a JW if they told the elders they didn't believe there is a difference between taking hemoglobin and taking platelets?

Neologist replied:

Quote:

Depends. Could be more than one correct answer.

Wrong! Since it is the Watchtower Society's policy to disfellowship a JW that takes a transfusion of platelets but to respect a JW that takes a transfusion of hemoglobin then certainly one couldn't be baptized as a JW if they disagreed with this policy.

Neologist wrote:

Quote:

I don't know what your experience is with our congregations. You seem well acquainted with our literature, but hardly at all able to comprehend what it means to be one of Jehovah's Witnesses. Both you and Talk paint a picture of confusion and fear where none exists.

Don't lump me in with Talkactive. My focus here is very narrow, namely, the Watchtower Society's blood policy and how they enforce it. It is a fact that a JW will be disfellowshipped and shunned for taking a transfusion of platelets but a JW that takes a transfusion of hemoglobin will remain a respected member of the congregation. Also, anyone that openly disagrees with this policy is liable to be disfellowshipped as is anyone that refuses to shun someone that is disfellowshipped for taking a transfusion of platelets.

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First one point, admittedly minor. A person who does not believe there to be a difference between the acceptance of platelets vs. other blood fractions may eschew the taking of any blood products and would not be in conflict with our current understanding. I said that already, actually, as I have answered most of your other questions sandwiched in between your erudite cross examinations. Go back and look.

That being said, I once again ask you to tell me what advice you have for someone who, upon escaping from the Watchtower frying pan, might avoid being scorched in the fire. Or, in the words of Peter: "whom shall we go away to?" (John 6:68)

Or, why did David not do away with King Saul when he had the chance?

I'd love to keep playing, but there's a ball game, a sack of chips and a brewski waiting. Bye for now.

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One more time. Blood is 80% water. Hemoglobin accounts for 75% of the non-water part of blood. Platelets only account for about 5% of the non-water part of blood. Now, explain to me why taking a transfusion of hemoglobin (derived from donated, stored human blood) is not a violation of the abstain from blood rule but taking a transfusion of platelets is. I've asked this question several times and have yet to get a straight answer. I would think that if you are teaching people that they should die before taking a transfusion of platelets that you would have the argument down pat. Just tell me what you tell them.

You requested my advice for someone escaping from the Watchtower frying pan. Why are you asking me for advice in this regard? Have I ever even hinted that you should leave your religion? I haven't told you to go anywhere else and never will. I'm simply pointing out where I think the Watchtower's blood policy is wrong. That's it.

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Neo wrote:

Quote:

That being said, I once again ask you to tell me what advice you have for someone who, upon escaping from the Watchtower frying pan, might avoid being scorched in the fire. Or, in the words of Peter: "whom shall we go away to?" (John 6:68)

I have already answered your question 2 times before, but do it more than willingly for the third time.
Does Peter meant Jesus, or does he meant the Catholic Church, Protestants or the Watchtower Society?
Why are you so anxious for belonging to an Organisation, do you need to belong to an Organisation?

Your friend Setanta, who suppose to know you, as an independent person, if it is correct means that you can stand at your own feet!

Quote:

Or, why did David not do away with King Saul when he had the chance?

Let me try to illustrate it this was by asking you a question: The Watchtower Society states that there was no sign from God when Muhammad cited the Quran, opposite when Moses got the stone tablet, there was thunder and lightening, for their rejection and the credibility of the Quran.

Have there been any sign in connection to the establishment of Russell or the Watchtower Society?

David knew that Saul was chosen, at least believed it, but give me only one prove from God, not what they claim to be or try to convince people to believe they are, that the Governing Body of the Watchtower are chosen by Jehovah?

There is another thing, if Jesus cleaned the Temple between 1914 and 1919, and Raymond Franz really was an apostate, as The Governing Body widely declared in the magazines and "crucified" him, how does it come that he was among them as late as in the 80ties?

The question is, are there still other apostates between members of the Governing Body today, since the blood doctrine continues and they can't be agreed in their voting's, for a doctrinal changes, to get rid of the Brothers, Sisters and children's blood, at their hands and since it continues as they latest have declared in the Blood Awake from August 2006?

NB We are not talking about that Jesus and Jehovah doesn't exist or whom they are to get that kind of sign!

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Nero Wrote:

Quote:

I'd love to keep playing, but there's a ball game, a sack of chips and a brewski waiting. Bye for now.

Pls. change the "needle" and be carefully with the "Brewski" and you will hopefully be able to follow the track and perhaps will the music and sound be clear and laud!

NB. I would like and prefere if we could continue in the blood track, which was the thread!

Ps. To improve that Jehovah was with Saul, Samuel gave 3 prophetical signs. Furthermore they, by drawing lots, choose who should be King, and they pointed at Saul.

Kindly show the profetical signs that confirms that the Governing Body or the Watchtower Society are appointed!

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Teleologist wrote:

One more time. Blood is 80% water. Hemoglobin accounts for 75% of the non-water part of blood. Platelets only account for about 5% of the non-water part of blood. Now, explain to me why taking a transfusion of hemoglobin (derived from donated, stored human blood) is not a violation of the abstain from blood rule but taking a transfusion of platelets is. I've asked this question several times and have yet to get a straight answer. I would think that if you are teaching people that they should die before taking a transfusion of platelets that you would have the argument down pat. Just tell me what you tell them.

You requested my advice for someone escaping from the Watchtower frying pan. Why are you asking me for advice in this regard? Have I ever even hinted that you should leave your religion? I haven't told you to go anywhere else and never will. I'm simply pointing out where I think the Watchtower's blood policy is wrong. That's it.

I refer you to my answer and your off the wall reply on page 13:

neologist wrote:

You seem to know a little about the Witnesses and the blood issue, Tele; so why not focus on the command to abstain from blood. In that case it wouldn't matter whether the blood was transfused, eaten or snorted, wouldn't you think?

Teleologist wrote:

Before we switch to a different topic I would like to get some closure on what we've been currently discussing. You presented the argument that blood transfusions are comparable to intravenous feeding in order to bolster the claim that taking blood transfusions are the same as eating blood. Can you back up the claim that blood transfusions are comparable to intravenous feeding or not? If you can't, just say so and we can move on.

What is it about the word abstain that implies a prohibition only against eating? And if doctors and lawyers are unable to define the essence of blood, why do you insist I provide the answer?

You say you are not asking me to leave my religion. Obviously you don't understand what it means to me to be a Witness of Jehovah. I have made a studied decision to follow the teachings of the Watchtower Society whether I understand them completely or not. If, on rare occasion, I don't understand well enough to teach, (It hasn't happened yet.) I defer to one more able. Were I to disclaim any doctrine that might lead to expulsion from the congregation, then by default I would no longer be able to consider myself a Witness. I would have left the frying pan, so to speak. So the question of where I might go would then be paramount. (Keep in mind that I continued attending meetings faithfully the entire time when I was disfellowshipped.)

I ask you again: How would I avoid the fire as I leave the frying pan? Tell me of your hope of salvation.

Talkactive wrote:

. . . Why are you so anxious for belonging to an Organisation, do you need to belong to an Organisation? . . .

Not anxious, but I would like to know how you heed Paul's admonition of Hebrews 10: 24, 25.

So, once again: Tell me of your perfect understanding and God directed organization.

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Neo wrote:

Quote:

What is it about the word abstain that implies a prohibition only against eating? And if doctors and lawyers are unable to define the essence of blood, why do you insist I provide the answer?

Neo. I'm speechless and dumbfounded!

Is it Jehovah, the Watchtower's doctrines, doctors or lawyers you have to obey mostly as stated in Acts 5:27-32? Jeremiah 7:31 and Leviticus 17:15! Don't you think you have a personal responsibility? Galathians 6:5!

It is really good to hear, in the following quotation. What does it mean for you and what do you suppose it means, to be a Witness of Jehovah? Wasn't Abel, Noah, Abraham and the other men of faith, Witness of Jehovah long time before the Watchtower Society was founded?

Quote:

You say you are not asking me to leave my religion. Obviously you don't understand what it means to me to be a Witness of Jehovah.

Again Neo, who have asked you to leave Jehovah or even your religion? If you feel comfortable attending the meetings, it's your personal choice, but spreading the Watchtowers un scriptual doctrines and harming yourself, your wife, children and others, as you Friend Setanta stated, should have been illegally and never ever have been allowed, but the fact is, due to misinterpretation of the UN Chapter from 1948, that it is, but religious freedom, shall not be absolutely, even not for people in The Governing Body of the Watchtower Society, Christian Sience or all others, when it comes to life or deat decission.

Tele is very hard and solely focusing at the blood issue, me too, but I go further to make people thinking of what's going on in an Organisation who claims to be Jehovah's chosen channel, claims to speak and be a servant for Jesus Christ. It's my sincerely hope to get people out of their mind control and indoctrination processes, by doing the thinking themselves and hopefully be able to sort out, via reading the Bible and look at the creation, what has its origin from Jehovah, rather than men and their wickered doctrine and nonsens.

Quote:

I have made a studied decision to follow the teachings of the Watchtower Society whether I understand them completely or not. If, on rare occasion, I don't understand well enough to teach, (It hasn't happened yet.)I defer to one more able.

The Bible is warning us and giving us good recommendations in Psalm 146:3-10! Furthermore Jesus warned his disciples for the Scribes and Pharisees leaven. Matthew 16:5-12! Are you really listening to your Bible and what the head of our Christian belief are going to tell us all? Or do you blindly follow their flippering doctrines at all times? you can even rad the warnings in Collosians 2:8-23!

You have followed their doctrines blindly, in question of the blood and you aren't late to: "Defere to one more able" which maybe or for sure, blindly are following the Watchtowers blood doctrine!

You furthermore blindly make statements in public, here at internet, where people are going to se what you write and suppose if they maybe will follow your statements, thoughts and recommendations!

Have you ever thought of that you can be held responsible, if someone dies because of your advice or your cooperation in gathering people together, which can and often leads to a premature death, like the assistants of Jim Jones, in question of the Watchtowers blood doctrine?

Quote:

Were I to disclaim any doctrine that might lead to expulsion from the congregation, then by default I would no longer be able to consider myself a Witness. I would have left the frying pan, so to speak. So the question of where I might go would then be paramount. (Keep in mind that I continued attending meetings faithfully the entire time when I was disfellowshipped.)

Neo I'm still speechless and dumbfounded!

You were informed here, in this forum, what has been or is going on about the procedures, inside the watchtower Society. In spite of the provided information, you denied it, which simply confirm their totally control over your thinking, which is called Mind Control and indoctrination.

With your last quotation, you are now also confirming that it is fear of sanctions and not to misplease God and you are willing to, like my family brother, blindly to follow the Watchtower changing doctrines, even after you have been aware of that they are wrong, but as you state: "Were I to disclaim any doctrine that might lead to expulsion from the congregation, then by default I would no longer be able to consider myself a Witness".

Would you also have been following the Watchtower doctrines if they have teach, that it was the will of God to kill all people who wasn't members of The Society, if somebody haven't had the power to stop them, like all the Catholic, protestants and not to forget people supporting Hitler and those in the concentration camps, which didn't listen to their conscience, but blindly follow orders, because they was convinced of the political ideas and/or afraid to get killed themselves, like The Watchtower treat you with, even it isn't physically, but by their teachings, that you will be destroyed in Armageddon, if you don't blindly follow their doctrines and is a member of the Society?

I like to guide your attention again to what comes forth in the Bible and since you call yourselves a Christian and properly don't belong to the Christendom, where many only use it as an label, without actions, by not following the head of the Christian belief, Jesus Christ example and teachings:

John 14.

14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

14:7 If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also:

14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

1 of John.
14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

Neo whom do you obey, Good or men, when you are following and spreading the Watchtowers or anydody else doctrines which don't has its origin from Jehovah?

Acts 5:

5:29 Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.

5:30 The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree.

5:31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

5:32 And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.

So Neo who are you going to listen to and obey, Jehovah or a son of a man, in whome there is no salvation and who are you going to follow, Jesus Christ examples or the Watchtower Society's changing doctrines.

Will you continue to spread the Watchtower unbiblical and sientific wrong doctrines and when you are not able to teach them yourself, then yoke people and you friends together with members of the Society, who also blindly believe and follow the doctrines and distribuate and teach others them? You make the decission but is responsible.

Jehovah looks also at your heart Neo and I personally think that time has come for you, to be asusre of everything, opposite following a mans son and other members of the Watchtower Soiciety, who is willing to sacrifie themselves and their belowed ones at the Society's alter!!!

If you like to attend the meetings, among others for sociel reasons, it's totally up to yourself, but you will never ever be able to make any excuse against Jehovah, due to and what the Watchtower Society have convienced you to think and make of decissions, you are personally responsible to do the thinking yourself and can't hang your hat of whatsoever broder or sister Joe or Jane belives an convince you about and when it comes to the final proof, do not try to excuse your acts like Adam, it was the woman you gave me...., by blaming others!

NB. If the Muslims haven't been mislead by their Imams and others of their religious leaders. They would have been reading the Quran rather than recitating it and been listening to what comes forth in Almaida, The Table, Surra 5:48, depending on which language and version of the Quran they use, where it comes forth:

"If you don't make your judgements after what have been sent down before him, Tewrat, The Mosaic law, Zebur, the small profets and Ingels, the Gospels (whether they interpret or assume that it is Jesus or Muhammad) its stated in the Quran, you will belong to the ungodly, and even worser than the djinns, which are the demons!"

So you see here that and if we do not make our judgement from the Bible, which is what have been sent before Muhammad, we are not in harmony with God!

That's why I'm questioning, why all religions shall have their own law books, the Catholics, the catechism, the Muslims the Sharia and the Watchtower Kingdom Service etc. etc.. when we have our Bibles!

Te Bible is all we need to make Judgements and to be in harmony with God and follow in the footsteps of Jesus Christ, since he was the largest profet, able to make miracles with it origin from God!

The Watchtower Society have furthermore replaced the Bible with The Watchtower Magazine and many of their other publications.

At last, that's why I recommend all to read their Bible, instead of listen and been following a mans son and his doctrines, in whom there is no salvation, rather than Jehovah and Jesus commandments and examples.

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Talkactive wrote:

Neo. I'm speechless and dumbfounded!

Speechless? Followed by an avalanche of words. Laughing

Talkactive wrote:

Wasn't Abel, Noah, Abraham and the other men of faith, Witness of Jehovah long time before the Watchtower Society was founded?

So?

Talkactive wrote:

Neo I'm still speechless and dumbfounded!

Were that only the case. Laughing

Talkactive wrote:

You were informed here, in this forum, what has been or is going on about the procedures, inside the watchtower Society. In spite of the provided information, you denied it, which simply confirm their totally control over your thinking, which is called Mind Control and indoctrination.

Informed with half truths and innuendo is not being informed

Talkactive wrote:

With your last quotation, you are now also confirming that it is fear of sanctions and not to misplease God and you are willing to, like my family brother, blindly to follow the Watchtower changing doctrines. . .

So you're tired of trying to mislead your brother and hoping to provide license for yourself. Is that it?

Talkactive wrote:

Would you also have been following the Watchtower doctrines if they have teach, that it was the will of God to kill all people who wasn't members of The Society, if somebody haven't had the power to stop them, like all the Catholic, protestants and not to forget people supporting Hitler and those in the concentration camps, which didn't listen to their conscience, but blindly follow orders, because they was convinced of the political ideas and/or afraid to get killed themselves . . .

The behavior of Jehovah's Witnesses in the concentration camps is nothing to be ashamed of. Why do you mention Hitler?

Talkactive wrote:

like The Watchtower treat you with, even it isn't physically, but by their teachings, that you will be destroyed in Armageddon, if you don't blindly follow their doctrines and is a member of the Society?

If you blindly follow any doctrine, you are to be pitied

Talkactive wrote:

. . . More words from the speechless one. . .

Talkactive wrote:

NB. If the Muslims haven't been mislead by their Imams and others of their religious leaders. They would have been reading the Quran rather than recitating it and been listening to what comes forth in Almaida, The Table, Surra 5:48, depending on which language and version of the Quran they use, where it comes forth:
(Koran cited). . .

That you expect me to be influenced by citations from the Koran shows you lack faith in the Bible. Why should I listen to you?

Talkactive wrote:

. . . At last, that's why I recommend all to read their Bible, instead of listen and been following a mans son and his doctrines, in whom there is no salvation, rather than Jehovah and Jesus commandments and examples.

Once again I ask: How do you obey Hebrews 10: 24, 25?

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Quote:

Talkactive wrote:
Neo. I'm speechless and dumbfounded!
Speechless? Followed by an avalanche of words.

Neo if I had been written for a couple of days, would it have maked more sense to you?

Quote:

Talkactive wrote:

Wasn't Abel, Noah, Abraham and the other men of faith, Witness of Jehovah long time before the Watchtower Society was founded?
So?

The question it raises, do you believe that it isn't possible to be at Witness for Jehovah without being a member of The Watchtower Society?

Quote:

Talkactive wrote:
Neo I'm still speechless and dumbfounded!
Were that only the case.
Talkactive wrote:
You were informed here, in this forum, what has been or is going on about the procedures, inside the watchtower Society. In spite of the provided information, you denied it, which simply confirm their totally control over your thinking, which is called Mind Control and indoctrination.
Informed with half truths and innuendo is not being informed

So when I and Tele informed you that a person get disfellowshipped when a members doesn't support the Watchtowers blood doctrine, it wasn't true?

Quote:

Were I to disclaim any doctrine that might lead to expulsion from the congregation, then by default I would no longer be able to consider myself a Witness. I would have left the frying pan, so to speak. So the question of where I might go would then be paramount. (Keep in mind that I continued attending meetings faithfully the entire time when I was disfellowshipped.)

Talkactive wrote:
With your last quotation, you are now also confirming that it is fear of sanctions and not to misplease God and you are willing to, like my family brother, blindly to follow the Watchtower changing doctrines. . .
So you're tired of trying to mislead your brother and hoping to provide license for yourself. Is that it?

That is only speculations from your side, pls. be seriously. The question of my salvation is solely a question between Jehovah and whom he had anointed, Jesus Christ to judge all of mankind. I can tell you that it will be a great please for me, if I will be able to see you Neo and all others going into the Paradise, before he will close my eyes for ever, if I'm not worthy to be granted with the everlasting life in the new world and heaven Peter and John describes in Revelation 21:8! I hope you understand what I mean!

21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

21:3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

21:5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

21:6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.

21:7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.

21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

Quote:

Talkactive wrote:
Would you also have been following the Watchtower doctrines if they have teach, that it was the will of God to kill all people who wasn't members of The Society, if somebody haven't had the power to stop them, like all the Catholic, protestants and not to forget people supporting Hitler and those in the concentration camps, which didn't listen to their conscience, but blindly follow orders, because they was convinced of the political ideas and/or afraid to get killed themselves . . .
The behavior of Jehovah's Witnesses in the concentration camps is nothing to be ashamed of. Why do you mention Hitler?

Simply because it doesn't matter whether people are mind controlled by their political or religious leaders, they blindly follow human commandments, whether it's to burn Jews or members of Watchtower in concentrations camps or burn their sons and daughters in the fire, as described in Jeremiah 7:31, or even sacrifice themselves, their belowed ones and children at the Watchtower doctrines blood alter! There's no difference!

It really seem that you don't wanna or with purpose will, or at leat try to understand what I mean and it seem also that you haven't read your Bible and understand human behaviour, even that I remember you have informed us about your psychological background? " In the sixties, I graduated from college with a degree in psychology" even that it is long time ago!

Quote:

Talkactive wrote:
like The Watchtower treat you with, even it isn't physically, but by their teachings, that you will be destroyed in Armageddon, if you don't blindly follow their doctrines and is a member of the Society?
If you blindly follow any doctrine, you are to be pitied

If you read "Threaten" instead will it make sense to you?

I can recommend you to browse through the literature, where you will se pictures, where people with big smile at their lips, seems to escape and all ungodly adults and their children falls in deep holes in connection with earth crakes! Hereto that their statement in the literature that only people belonging to Gods chosen channel will be saved!

May I ask you Neo, why are you so ancious to be a member of the watchtower Society?

Have you ever thought of that the Bible state: " I saw a great crowd noone was able to count" Neo can you caunt to 6 billions or even more....?

What about the old woman in the Churc of Sct. Peter in the Vertican, in Italy, when I was visting it and saw all the fantastic religious art and sculptures, when she looked at Jesus with tears in her eyes, not beeing a member of the Watchtower Society, don't you think that Jehovahs and maybe mostly Jesus Christ scarifice also will be valid for her, when you read all the places in the Bible where Jesus say: " Your faith have cured you... My daughter, your faith have cured you....." I think you have much to learn Neo!

2 John:
1:4 I rejoiced greatly that I found of thy children walking in truth, as we have received a commandment from the Father.

1:5 And now I beseech thee, lady, not as though I wrote a new commandment unto thee, but that which we had from the beginning, that we love one another.

1:6 And this is love, that we walk after his commandments. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it.

1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

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Neo I do understand your concerns!

Talkactive wrote:
. . . More words from the speechless one. . .
Talkactive wrote:

NB. If the Muslims haven't been mislead by their Imams and others of their religious leaders. They would have been reading the Quran rather than recitating it and been listening to what comes forth in Almaida, The Table, Surra 5:48, depending on which language and version of the Quran they use, where it comes forth:
(Koran cited). . .
That you expect me to be influenced by citations from the Koran shows you lack faith in the Bible. Why should I listen to you?

It seems again that you don't listen and you don't wanna understand what I'm trying to tell you. This was only to give you another example of how religious leaders have been successful to mind control their members and as so many other times Neo, it was my hope to guide you and maybe other, maybe muslims attention, if possible, to read the Bible!

Quote:

Talkactive wrote:
. . .
At last, that's why I recommend all to read their Bible, instead of listen and been following a mans son and his doctrines, in whom there is no salvation, rather than Jehovah and Jesus commandments and examples

Once again I ask: How you obey Hebrews 10: 24, 25..

Neo have your ever thought of what Jesus said in Matthew 18:19,20!

18:19 Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven.

18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

For the tenth time, have Tele or I said to you to leave your religion?

What I'm trying to tell you, is not to swallow all doctrines, but be aware of everything and specially when it comes to the Watchtowers blood doctrine, I really hope that you don't continue to state that a blood transfusion or taking derivates of blood is equal to eating blood!

If you distribute the blood doctrine or positively act and connect people and friends to be educated in the Watchtower blood doctrine, I am personally convinced that you or I, we all will be held responsible, if someone dies a premature death, due to distribuation of the doctrines!

You have never answered whether eating all the blood in a carcass was forbidden or not and do you really think a Jew or an alien would eat a carcass, unless it was in an emergency situation or to sustain the life? Pls. make you comments to the versus in Leviticus 17:13-15 and how it's is consistent with the Watchtowers Bible standards, that it is forbidden to store animals blood, and use 95 % off the red blood cells and inject in their members?

Do you think Jehovah would have allowed a Jew and an Alien to eat all the blood in a carcass if it was forbidden to sustain life on blood or derivates of, in an emergency situation? An answer with yes or no will be hightly appreciated and preferred.

Leviticus 17:

17:13 And whatsoever man there be of the children of Israel, or of the strangers that sojourn among you, which hunteth and catcheth any beast or fowl that may be eaten; he shall even pour out the blood thereof, and cover it with dust.

17:14 For it is the life of all flesh; the blood of it is for the life thereof: therefore I said unto the children of Israel, Ye shall eat the blood of no manner of flesh: for the life of all flesh is the blood thereof: whosoever eateth it shall be cut off.

17:15 And every soul that eateth that which died of itself, or that which was torn with beasts, whether it be one of your own country, or a stranger, he shall both wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even: then shall he be clean.

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Talkactive wrote:

The question it raises, do you believe that it isn't possible to be at Witness for Jehovah without being a member of The Watchtower Society?

See below.

Talkactive wrote:

So when I and Tele informed you that a person get disfellowshipped when a members doesn't support the Watchtowers blood doctrine, it wasn't true?

You covered may more topics than just that; and I answered that.

Talkactive wrote:

May I ask you Neo, why are you so ancious to be a member of the watchtower Society?

Answer already given.

Talkactive wrote:

Have you ever thought of that the Bible state: " I saw a great crowd noone was able to count" Neo can you caunt to 6 billions or even more....?

What about the old woman in the Churc of Sct. Peter in the Vertican, in Italy, when I was visting it and saw all the fantastic religious art and sculptures, when she looked at Jesus with tears in her eyes, not beeing a member of the Watchtower Society, don't you think that Jehovahs and maybe mostly Jesus Christ scarifice also will be valid for her, when you read all the places in the Bible where Jesus say: " Your faith have cured you... My daughter, your faith have cured you....." I think you have much to learn Neo!

I am quite sure that in the kingdom we will be as surprised by the many people who are with us as by those who are not. But one thing is certain: Al those who survive will have obeyed the command at Revelation 18:4: "Get out of her, my people, if YOU do not want to share with her in her sins, and if YOU do not want to receive part of her plagues." Subsequent to that, they would certainly know the answer to my next question.

neologist wrote:

Once again I ask: How you obey Hebrews 10: 24, 25..

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Neo wrote.

Quote:

I am quite sure that in the kingdom we will be as surprised by the many people who are with us as by those who are not. But one thing is certain: Al those who survive will have obeyed the command at Revelation 18:4: "Get out of her, my people, if YOU do not want to share with her in her sins, and if YOU do not want to receive part of her plagues." Subsequent to that, they would certainly know the answer to my next question.

Neo I think you already have given the answer yourself, or don't you believe in what you state above? What about people who never had heard anything from the Bible?

Do you think that members of the Society (JW's) will be able to knock at every single door, of the whole world population and see them in their eyes and talk to them, about the good news, or even reach them with the Watchtower and Awake magazines? (Even that you have the Mormons and other organisation which practice door to door service and evangelists, not to start a new discussion). It isn't described in my Bible that it shall be so!

Neo be realistic or is it simply the social get-together (Witout a coffe table) you are looking for and like in the Kingdom Hall? You can of course discuss spiritual things with one, two, three or more spiritual persons outside the Kingdom Hall, whether they are members of the Society or not!

The persons that you think of, will be persons who have found mercy in the eyes of Jehovah and be inherit in his son Jesus Christ sacrifice, which not take away a sin, but the sin of the whole world! 1 John 2:1,2!

2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:

2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

There are many persons that I know inside and outside the Watchtower Society who are very fine an spiritual people who "fears" Jehovah and are doing their best or almost to follow in the footsteps of Jesus Christ, the head of our faith and have you ever thought of the essence Proverbs 27:17!

27:17 Iron sharpeneth iron; so a man sharpeneth the countenance of his friend.

When you compare above together with what Jesus said in Matthew 18:19,20!

18:19 Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven.

18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

For the eleventh time, have Tele or I said to you to leave your religion?

But be warned, if you like to discuss something with one of your elders in the Kingdom Hall, make sure that you are doing it under 4 eyes without a recording unit, otherwise you can't be sure that you will be placed in front of a committee, because many of them are trained by and due to fact, that the Society have tightened their iron grip over the rank and file, which you can read in the Magazines and in Kingdom Service, trying to avoid members to get information from outside the community, e.g. the internet (people from the West) which expose their hypocrisy, as members of the UN, NGO. The way they handle the child molesters, by ignoring the higher Authorities. The blood doctrine and many other thing which isn't in harmony with the Bible and Jehovah's personality and Jesus Christ examples, your will be in great trouble and a potential or maybe even, not evne in risk, but in fact disfellowshipped.

So Neo if you read Hebrews 10:25,25 do you mean the social get-together or do you mean the possibility to discuss spiritual issues, which you aren't able to discuss, if it isn't in harmony with the Watchtower teachings and doctrines, in the Kingdom Hall, when it falls outside the given paragraphs in the Watchtower Magazine(s) and the pre printed questions and expected answers inherit in the paragraphs.

When have you latest discussed the blood doctrine with elders or other fellow men, or 1914,25, 75 and the 1914 Generation and that taking a blood transfusion isn't to be feed on blood?

To give you an example, before a person become a member of the Watchtower Society, it's possible to rise any question you like, one are free to speak, because one aren't in the iron grip so far!

If one for some reason already has a little understanding of the principles in the Bible and confront the JW's with it, you either get an answer we are going to ask in the Congregation, or in other cases you will only get an answer, believe us and then will they change subject.

Most of the persons whose gets in contact with members of the Society are quite unfamiliarly with the Bible and what's going on and the history, in question of the ever changing doctrines, the Watchtower Society history, Sheep and Goats, e.g. Beth Sarim, from an acceptance of blood, to a totally ban and to now where derivates from animals blood are allowed.

As soon as one has become a member, gets baptized and mostly answered YES in public to the second question to the candidates, then you become a member, it's dangerous to raise questions. It is simply with risk for your social and spiritual life. Who rise questions with Good chosen channel it's risky, e.g. when doctrinal changes are introduced, which you haven't accepted at the point you get baptized and maybe can't defend due to your conscience, one will be in trouble, because and as Tele wrote to you, as a member of the Society you are obliged to accept everything, without questioning the ability of the members of the Governing Body to make intelligent decisions!

If you rice questions about the members of the Governing Body or their doctrines, you are in trouble unless keep quiet or you shut up, otherwise you will be disfellowshiped and family and friends will be shunned!

A person which have become a member of the Society, state the Watchtower has the freedom to leave, but that is another lie, as they do in other respects. You can even nerver in your lifetime cancel your membership, becaus if you do you will be disfellowshipped and be clasified as an apostate, without a chance for defending yourself in front of a comitee and explain to others of the society/asembly, that it's because of your conscience can't accept that people you love has to chose a premature death because of the blood doctrine, you will be totally cut of from your family, offen also your wife, mature children, friends and belowed ones, which still are members of the Society, they are even not allowed to grate you, as an apostate, because you have betrade Goods chosen channel on earth equal or even higher to them than Jehovah himself!

I am sure you know what it means since you attended the meetings under the whole period you was disfellowshipped, on a fair basis or not, it's not of my business! Jehovah does look into ones hearts and kidney and have the possibility and right to examine it, which imperfect men can't!

Since and now you hopefully have learned that a blood transfusion isn't equal to eating blood, but a Jew and an Alien, was even allowed to eat all the blood in a carcass, not only derivates, to suatain life, when you then take a blood transfusion, it's not to eat blood but to replace what you already have had in your body, to maintain the transportation of the oxygene, as a last change to sustain life, which is the most important to Jehovah, Jesus Christ and maybe most ourselves, where a donator has been willing to give a little piece of his "life" then you and other members of the Society can have the benefit of, all the derivates but are forbidden to give blood, even that it could be of benefit to your fellow men, whos conscience will accept derivates from humans or maybe animals blood!

To, nearly the end, I can't avoid to forward my impression that you are amazing Neo!!!

You take the freedom without any authority and call yourselves a Christian and you is to be so impudence, against Tele and I, to accuse us for forwarding half lies, but every time you are catch in your own statements, you simply skid over the edge of the stone cake and try to change subject or try to escape, because you are well aware of, as we also informed you and readers in this forum about, that you get disfellowshipped if you don't accept every changing teaching and doctrines comming from the Watchtower Society in Brooklyn, hereunder even not to grate a Christian person, e.g your own biological brother or a friend, who has been disfellowshipped because his conscience can't accept that Adults and Children and bellowed ones gets killed, due to the Society's evil, non Scriptural, shown by the creation and scientific wrong blood doctrine, who already, in more than 50 years have sent thousands and other thousands of God fearing persons and their children into a premature death and the insanity continues, based at the latest statements in the Awake magazine from august 2006, BLOOD, because the watchtower has teached and trained their members conscience that they will displease God if they sustain life with blood and derivates, like you Neo, that will not accept blood, even the by the Society now allowed derivates, to be on the safe side against "Jehovah"!!!!!

Have a look at the first page in this topic, where there is a copy of former blood card which every member of the watchtower was forced to sign with the signature of 2 witnesses, with all members attending the book study group, if not, they will be disobedient to Jehovah's chosen channel on earth, which has its origin from "Jehovah"! Nonsens but merely from the evil slave described in Matthew 24:48-51!

Disfellwshipment is more effecient than physical violence and what the former Soviet and Comunist state could afford, because you are put up as an apostate to Jehovah and with the MindControl and indoctrination processes, 5 times a week the wole year round, your only choise, to keep your family intact, is to shut up and be inactive, but in the meantime there is a great risk, that your wife, children, rellatives, friends and belowed ones die, because they still are members and belive in the Society, like Jane and those mentioned in Jeremiah 7:31 due to Mind Control and indoctrination that it will please God!

7:31 And they have built the high places of Tophet, which is in the valley of the son of Hinnom, to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire; which I commanded them not, neither came it into my heart.
That is why Tele and many other like me, are warning people Neo, about the Watchtowers evil blood doctrine and I'm personally sure of what comes further in Jeremiah, that the blood doctrine and those eveil men behind, in the Gowerning Body of the watchtower Society, wil be resposible:

7:32 Therefore, behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that it shall no more be called Tophet, nor the valley of the son of Hinnom, but the valley of slaughter: for they shall bury in Tophet, till there be no place.

7:33 And the carcases of this people shall be meat for the fowls of the heaven, and for the beasts of the earth; and none shall fray them away.

7:34 Then will I cause to cease from the cities of Judah, and from the streets of Jerusalem, the voice of mirth, and the voice of gladness, the voice of the bridegroom, and the voice of the bride: for the land shall be desolate.

So once again Neo, will you pls. answer with a YES or NO, whether eating all the blood in a carcass, in a emergency situation, to sustain life, is a no-no? Leviticus 17:15!

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Your posts are insufferably long, so I will answer as I see fit.

God promises a resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous. (John 5:28) In that time, I am sure we will be able to look back on all things and agree that God has been fair.

After you answer my question about Hebrews 10:24-25, read vs, 26 and you will see that it is the willing practicers of sin who are condemned.

Carry on. . .

(*note to self __62)

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Neo wrote:

Quote:

After you answer my question about Hebrews 10:24-25, read vs, 26 and you will see that it is the willing practicers of sin who are condemned.

Neo, May I ask you again, what's the reason for, that you are so anxious to be a member of the Watchtower Society? Does it has anything to do with your life an acts, that you don't make anything foolish, as long as you sit in the Kingdom Hall, I was just wondering, because I have the full understandings for your point of view, then and why.

What is your understanding and how will you comment "to provoke unto love and to good works".What does it means to you Neo?

Have you ever heard this before: "It is better to sit at the Pub, and be thinking of the Church, rather than sitting in the Church and be thinking at the Pub"!

Do you mean or feel that a get-together in the Kingdom Hall, will prevent you from doing or being a "willing practicers" and therefore its better be there, rather than being out in the field, like Jesus and spreading the good news and helping people that really are in demand?

Is it not and even better, to do good things when you can help you neighbour, rather than sitting in the Kingdom Hall and studying the Watchtower and answer, by pre prepared questions and answers about an evil blood doctrine, which has and are going to course the premature death of thousand and another thousands Brothers, Sisters and their children's lives!

Have you ever thought of what comes forth in James 1:27?

1:27 Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

Is it to keep unspotted of the world and not to be willing practicers, spreading and following religious leaders doctrines 100 % which has sent and are sending thousands and another thousands into the death, and lies about their membership of United Nations as an Non Governmental Organisations and against Human Right Watch, that they will not practice sanctions against their members, if they as a last change choose to be treated with blood, rather than follow or to be a pure religion and help people in demand for medicine e.g. in the thirld world?

Have you ever thougth of what comes fort in Matthew 23:23?

23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

For me it seems more to fit into what Jesus said in John 8:44!

8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

Neo, again for the twelfth time, have Tele and I, ever excoriated you to leave your religion, other than trying to open your eyes and not to end up in a situation of bloodguilt against Jehovah, by not distributing doctrines and wrong statements, that a blood transfusion was equal to eatblood and yoking people and friends together, teaching them the Society's non scriptural blood doctrine.

3:2 For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.

So once again Neo, will you pls. answer with a YES or NO, whether eating all the blood in a carcass, in a emergency situation, to sustain life, is a no-no? Leviticus 17:15!

What about and then, is a blood transfusion of whole blood, wrong to sustain life, when it is not even a feeding at blood. YES or NO?

Is it wrong to store tons of killed animals blood, where lives are taken, when the Bible in clear terms state that it shall be pulled out as water on the ground in Leviticus 17:13? YES or NO?

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Neologist wrote:

Quote:

You say you are not asking me to leave my religion. Obviously you don't understand what it means to me to be a Witness of Jehovah. I have made a studied decision to follow the teachings of the Watchtower Society whether I understand them completely or not.

I would think that being a witness of Jehovah would mean that one would put loyalty to Jehovah above loyalty to men. I would expect a true witness of Jehovah to say that if they determined that some teaching of the Watchtower was false that they wouldn't continue to teach it as true. When told to teach a false doctrine that when followed could lead to premature death, I would expect a real witness of Jehovah to say: I must obey God rather than men. Acts 5:29

I understand that you can't openly rebel against the teachings of the Watchtower Society or you will be kicked out of your religion but we are not having this discussion in front of your elders. We are online and you are anonymous. Under these circumstances I would expect you to say that you won't teach something as true that you know to be false, that you believe in obeying God as ruler rather than men. But you seem to be saying just the opposite, that you must obey a dozen men in Brooklyn, New York even when you know they are wrong. Wow! I wish you had spelled this out at the beginning of this thread. What's the point in having a debate over what the Bible teaches about blood with an opponent that doesn't accept the Bible as the final authority but instead defers to a group of men?

You evidently teach that transfusions of platelets are against God's Law not because of what you read in the Bible, but rather an adherence to whatever Watchtower policy happens to be at the present time. This must be the case because if tomorrow the Watchtower dropped its ban on platelets, you would immediately start teaching that transfusions of platelets are not against God's Law. Yet, the scriptures didn't change. This just goes to show that the ban on platetets isn't based on scripture. It is a teaching of men. It is a teaching that can lead to loss of life. And it is a teaching that could change tomorrow. I wouldn't want to be in your shoes if one of your Bible students were to die because you taught them platelets were forbidden and then the Watchtower changes its mind. If God were to ask you why you taught persons that He views transfusions of platelets differently than transfusions of hemoglobin, what would you say? You couldn't refer to a scripture, right? All you could say is that the Watchtower told you to do it. When God asks you if you are familiar with Acts 5:29 your goose is cooked.

Neologist wrote:

Quote:

I ask you again: How would I avoid the fire as I leave the frying pan? Tell me of your hope of salvation.

Let's say you determined that taking a transfusion of platelets was not against God's law. Would that cause you to leave your religion? I have a JW relative that doesn't believe that taking a transfusion of platelets is against God's law and they have not left their religion.

As for my religious beliefs, the only belief of mine that is relevant to this thread is my belief on blood. Even if I agreed with all other JW teachings I wouldn't be allowed to become a JW unless I agreed with the Watchtower's blood policy. So if you can convince me that God views the transfusion of platelets differently than He views the transfusion of hemoglobin, I'll start another thread where we can discuss other issues.

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Talkactive wrote:

Have you ever heard this before: "It is better to sit at the Pub, and be thinking of the Church, rather than sitting in the Church and be thinking at the Pub"!

Very astute quote. Do you mind if I save it?
Do you know the source, or is it anonymous? If you were to dip your toe into some other topics on this forum, you will find that 'the pub' is where I travel. I'm hoping to steer some good folks into a consideration of Revelation 18:4.

Still waiting for simple answer to my question about Hebrews.

Teleologist wrote:

I understand that you can't openly rebel against the teachings of the Watchtower Society or you will be kicked out of your religion but we are not having this discussion in front of your elders. We are online and you are anonymous. Under these circumstances I would expect you to say that you won't teach something as true that you know to be false, that you believe in obeying God as ruler rather than men. But you seem to be saying just the opposite, that you must obey a dozen men in Brooklyn, New York even when you know they are wrong. Wow! I wish you had spelled this out at the beginning of this thread. What's the point in having a debate over what the Bible teaches about blood with an opponent that doesn't accept the Bible as the final authority but instead defers to a group of men?

You are obviously not paying attention.

Teleologist wrote:

I have a JW relative . . .

Why does that not surprise me?

Teleologist wrote:

. . . that doesn't believe that taking a transfusion of platelets is against God's law and they have not left their religion.

As for my religious beliefs, the only belief of mine that is relevant to this thread is my belief on blood. Even if I agreed with all other JW teachings I wouldn't be allowed to become a JW unless I agreed with the Watchtower's blood policy.

So your relative is a hypocrite, you say? Perhaps you just haven't paid attention to him either.

Teleologist wrote:

So if you can convince me that God views the transfusion of platelets differently than He views the transfusion of hemoglobin, I'll start another thread where we can discuss other issues.

Haven't met your relative. Another thread would be refreshing, though; or how about mixing it up in some of the existing threads where you can subject yourself to the scrutiny of all. I don't know if Talk would be comfortable with that, but why not give it a whirl?

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Neologist wrote:

Quote:

So your relative is a hypocrite, you say?

How is he a hypocrite?

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Neologist wrote:

Quote:

Another thread would be refreshing, though; or how about mixing it up in some of the existing threads where you can subject yourself to the scrutiny of all. I don't know if Talk would be comfortable with that, but why not give it a whirl?

Don't forget, I said I would participate in another thread only if you convinced me that that God views a transfusion of platelets differently than He views a tranfusion of hemoglobin. This is a Watchtower teaching that I don't think is based on the Bible. As I said before, even if I were to accept all Watchtower teachings except the blood policy I wouldn't be allowed to become a JW. So unless you can convince me the Watchtower blood policy is correct, nothing else matters.

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