ISRAEL - IRAN - SYRIA - HAMAS - HEZBOLLAH - WWWIII?

7800 BC:First building structures.
7000 BC:First Jerico fortifications.
2000 BC:First Canaanite Culture.

1400 BC:Eqypt conquers Palestine
1300 BC:First Israelite Culture.
1100 BC:First Philistine Culture (Philistra, evolved to the name Palestine).
Jews start ruling part of Palestine
1000 BC:Saul King of Israel (all Palestine except Philistra and Phoenicia).
950 BC:Solomon King of Israel.
721 BC:Israel Destroyed, but Judaea Continued.
516 BC:2nd Temple in Judaea.
333 BC:The Greek, Alexander the Great Conquers Palestine.
Jews stop ruling part of Palestine.
161 BC:Maccabaen Maximum Expansion of Judaea to All Palestine Plus.
Jews start ruling Palestine.
135 BC:Maccabaen Maximum Expansion Ends.
40 BC:The Roman, Herod Conquers Palestine.
73 AD:Fall of Jerusalem and all resistance ceases.
Jews stop ruling part of Palestine.
638 AD:Arabs take Jerusalem.
Arabs start ruling part of Palestine.
1099 AD:Crusaders take Palestine.
Arabs stop ruling part of Palestine.
1187 AD:Saladin Takes Palestine.
1229 AD:Saladin/Crusader Treaty.
1244 AD:Turks Take Palestine.
1516 AD:Ottoman Empire Begins Governing Palestine.
1831 AD:Egypt Conquers Palestine.
1841 AD:Ottoman Empire Again Conquers Palestine.
1915 AD:British Ambassador Promises Palestine to Arabs.
1917 AD:British Foreign Minister Balfour Promises Palestine to Zionists.
1918 AD:Ottoman Empire Ends Control of Palestine.
1918 AD:British Protectorate of Palestine Begins.
1920 AD:5 Jews killed 200 wounded in anti-zionist riots in Palestine.
1921 AD:46 Jews killed 146 wounded in anti-zionist riots in Palestine.
1929 AD:133 Jews killed 339 wounded.
1929 AD:116 Arabs killed 232 wounded.
1936,38,39 AD:329 Jews killed 857 wounded.
------------------3,112 Arabs killed 1,775 wounded.
------------------135 Brits killed 386 wounded.
------------------110 Arabs hanged 5,679 jailed.
1947 AD:UN resolution partitions Palestine into a Jewish and an Arab State.
1948 AD:Civil war breaks out between Jews and Arabs.
1948 AD:State of Israel conquers part of Palestine.
Jews start ruling part of Palestine;
Arabs start ruling part of Palestine.

A longtime CIA official says Hezbollah wins the battle with Israel simply by surviving.

I don't object to WHAT the media reports. I object to HOW they report it. I object to their lack of objectivity when they clearly write their news reports to cast the worst possible light on one side and pretty much give a free pass to the other.

And correcting a line from my recent previous post

Quote:

I think reasonable people can discuss opposing views with the personal insults, either covert or overt.

This line should read "I think reasonable people can discuss opposing views WITHOUT the personal insults, either covert or overt."

Going the Distance

Quote:

A longtime CIA official says Hezbollah wins the battle with Israel simply by surviving.

georgeob, from the bridge, yelled down

Quote:

Still - there are several insanities afoot in the world today of which Islamist zealotry is but one. Some others come cloaked in the best modern dress. Secularist materialism is one,

"But", a scruffy crewman yelled back up, "what of American Exceptionalism, sir? Ought we add it to your list? I understand you might be busy at the moment so if you could just send your reply down to the brig."

"That age-old tautology of exceptionalism - "I rule as I rule, because I am who I am" - faced its only real challenge from the growth of republican ideals, crafted by the Greeks and carried forward, fitfully, to the pointed assertions by eighteenth-century neoclassicists like Jeffereson, who helped forge that era's democratic explosion. Their disruptive thesis - that the people are the sovereign, and leaders serve at the public's pleasure - sought to reverse history's traditional equation of power preserving and justifying itself." (page 262, The One Percent Doctrine, Ron Suskind)

Foxfyre wrote:

I don't object to WHAT the media reports. I object to HOW they report it. I object to their lack of objectivity when they clearly write their news reports to cast the worst possible light on one side and pretty much give a free pass to the other.

I don't think that we see that happening. As an example, I will point to your post citing the MSM when it actually blamed Hezbollah for the incident that triggered the Israeli operation.

However, when there are more than ten times more civilians killed on the Lebanese side of the border than on the Israeli side, I wonder what kind of "objectivity" you could demand? Should the media rather not report on what is happening in Lebanon, or just report every tenth incident?

Foxfyre wrote:

And correcting a line from my recent previous post

Quote:

I think reasonable people can discuss opposing views with the personal insults, either covert or overt.

This line should read "I think reasonable people can discuss opposing views WITHOUT the personal insults, either covert or overt."

Absolutely no disagreement there... as you know, Foxy!

But neither you nor other Israel critics nor the media want to emphasize in the public mind that most of the deaths in Lebanon are because Hezbollah puts their rocket launchers in places where such deaths are certain to occur. THAT is the great obscenity. Israel either has to just take the rocket attacks or attempt to take out the launchers and rockets.

But neither you nor other Israel critics nor the media want to emphasize in the public mind that most of the deaths in Lebanon are because Hezbollah puts their rocket launchers in places where such deaths are certain to occur. THAT is the great obscenity. Israel either has to just take the rocket attacks or attempt to take out the launchers and rockets.

Foxfyre wrote:

But neither you nor other Israel critics nor the media want to emphasize in the public mind that most of the deaths in Lebanon are because Hezbollah puts their rocket launchers in places where such deaths are certain to occur. THAT is the great obscenity. Israel either has to just take the rocket attacks or attempt to take out the launchers and rockets.

That's a false dilemma. You claim that Israel has no other option than either indiscriminately target civilian neighborhoods all across Lebanon, or be attacked by Hezbollah without defending itself.

What about a third option: only target Hezbollah outposts in South Lebanon that actually fire rockets into Israel rather than indiscriminately striking warehouses, dams, schools, TV and radio stations, churches, mosques, hospitals and ambulances all across the country? What about a fourth option: calling for a ceasefire?

I mean, that black and white view is great and all, but in no way reflects reality.

...
Tell me where could Hezbollah have put their rockets to avoid civilian deaths by Israeli bombs?

revel wrote:

...
Tell me where could Hezbollah have put their rockets to avoid civilian deaths by Israeli bombs?

At the bottom of the Mediterrenean Sea.

Of course Hezbollah would not be able fire their rockets into Israel from the bottom of the Mediterrenean Sea. But then the Israelies would have no need to defend themselves against Hezbollah rockets sitting on the bottom of the Mediterrenean Sea, and therefore no need to shoot into Lebanon or the Mediterrenean Sea to destroy those rockets.

Eureka! That's it! To end this rocket conflict all we have to do is persuade the French to put all of Hezbollah's remaining rockets on the bottom of the Mediterrenean Sea!

Naaa! That won't work! The French don't know how to do that without attacking Hezbolla in Lebanon and thereby killing Lebanese civilians.

Hmmm

Israel controls at least 4 kilometers (deep) of South Lebanon and still advancing, and they have completely wiped all Hezbollah thugs from Ras Maroon and Bint Jbeil.

Hezbollah is a warfare type of militia. Their best chance is to operate in heavily populated areas where they can shoot and then run and hide amongst the civilians....once you take the civilians out of the equation Hezbollah strength is diminished to zero, zilch, nada.

• More than 841 killed and 3243 wounded
• Many bodies still unfound under wreckage
• 1/3 of casualties are children & majority civilians
• More than 913,760 displaced
• Complete blockade of air, sea & land transport
• More than 60 bridges and 70 roads destroyed
• Beirut International airport, all national
airways and major Lebanese ports bombed
• Electrical power plants bombed
and related fuel tanks destroyed
• Complete destruction of all radars
• More than 20 gas and fuel stations destroyed
• Factories (food industries), warehouses, dams,
schools, TV & radio stations, churches, mosques,
hospitals, ambulances & civil defense centre
• Thousands of civilian houses destroyed
• Estimated cost of infrastructure hit exceeds
US$ 2 billion
• Reported Israeli use of Internationally-banned
bombs
• More than 10 thousand tons of heavy oil polute
more than 80 km of sea coast

As the Israel Air Force continues to investigate the air strike, questions have been raised over military accounts of the incident.

It now appears that the military had no information on rockets launched from the site of the building, or the presence of Hezbollah men at the time.

The Israel Defense Forces had said after the deadly air-strike that many rockets had been launched from Qana. However, it changed its version on Monday.

The site was included in an IAF plan to strike at several buildings in proximity to a previous launching site. Similar strikes were carried out in the past. However, there were no rocket launches from Qana on the day of the strike.