ISRAEL - IRAN - SYRIA - HAMAS - HEZBOLLAH - WWWIII?

The witless, rightwing reactionary paranoia here is just breathtaking--islamofascits, the caliphate, sharia . . . yes, it's much better to indulge in carefully crafted hysteria which has been fed to you by conservative puppet-masters than to actually, carefully inquire into the sources of people's greivances.

0 Replies

InfraBlue wrote:

foxfyre wrote:
The answer to is make sure the terrorist are unable to terrorize, threaten, injure, maim, and murder. So we do whatever is necessary to accomplish that whatever it takes within reason. I think there will be different processes for different situations of course, and I think decent people will mitigate collateral damage to innocents as much as possible in those processes, but the ugly part is that no war has ever been fought nor will ever be fought in which no good people are harmed.

One way to to start to make terrorists unable to terrorize, threaten, injure, maim, and murder is to take away their reasons for doing so. Israel can begin by abandoning it's ethnocentric raison d'etre that necessarily discriminates against, and oppresses the Palestinian populations in Israel and the Occupied Territories. It should dismantle its oppressive regime, and emplace a truly democratic and egalitarian government that incorporates and enfranchises all of the peoples therein.

Even if what you say is true,and that the only reason terrorists exist is because of Israeli policies,that still begs a question.

How does attacking athletes at the Olympics change anyones mind?
How does machinegunning innocent,UNARMED people in an airport change anything?
How does blowing up innocent children change anyones mind?

By committing those kinds of atrocities,all it does is strengthen Israel's resolve and its commitment to not capitulate to the terrorists.
If the terrorists truly want change,they should use peaceful protests,ala MLK and the civil rights movement.

That way,if Israel uses violence against them,it will make Israel look very bad in the eyes of the world,and it will force change.

0 Replies

ican, McGentrix, Foxfyre:

If you think that terrorism can only be "eradicated" by using means that are not covered by the Geneva Conventions (and the Geneva Conventions cover quite a lot) - what measures do you guys propose?

Is bombing civilian neighbourhoods okay for you? What about death squads? Do you think torture is okay?

Also, can you give an example in modern history where terrorism has been successfully fought using those means?

0 Replies

old europe wrote:

ican, McGentrix, Foxfyre:

If you think that terrorism can only be "eradicated" by using means that are not covered by the Geneva Conventions (and the Geneva Conventions cover quite a lot) - what measures do you guys propose?

Is bombing civilian neighbourhoods okay for you? What about death squads? Do you think torture is okay?

Also, can you give an example in modern history where terrorism has been successfully fought using those means?

Bombing civilian neighborhoods is not okay UNLESS it is the only reasonable way to stop terrorists from using those neighborhoods as a base of operations to organize and execute attacks on innocent men, women and children.

I don't know what you mean about death squads. If you mean is it okay to infiltrate the other side, assassinate leaders, etc. etc. etc., I would have to know the circumstances but if that is what is NECESSARY to protect innocent men, women, and children, I would approve it.

I don't think torture is okay by anybody and I do not approve anybody using torture on anybody. But I have a very specific definition of torture and it does not include making a terrorist afraid, uncomfortable, bored, or embarrassed if that is what is NECESSARY to obtain information NECESSARY to save lives.

I have no historical perspective on this as I think the current war on terrorism by Islamofacist extremists is a new thing and requires different measures to deal with it. I do have a historical perspective on the reality that any war worth fighting is worth winning and anything less generally produces quite unsatisfactory results.

0 Replies

Foxfyre wrote:

I have no historical perspective on this as I think the current war on terrorism by Islamofacist extremists is a new thing and requires different measures to deal with it.

There might be a new element in the events that occured on 9/11 and since, but saying that terrorism is a new thing is certainly not true, and neither is the notion that terrorism is limited to islamic fundamentalists.

Consider this map here, provided by the US Department of State:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/ed/Terrorincidents2001atlas.jpg/350px-Terrorincidents2001atlas.jpg

It shows the number of terrorist attacks in 2001. The highest number of terrorist attacks occured in Colombia. Probably not perpetrated by "Islamofacist extremists", though.

0 Replies

old europe wrote:

Foxfyre wrote:
I have no historical perspective on this as I think the current war on terrorism by Islamofacist extremists is a new thing and requires different measures to deal with it.

There might be a new element in the events that occured on 9/11 and since, but saying that terrorism is a new thing is certainly not true, and neither is the notion that terrorism is limited to islamic fundamentalists.

Consider this map here, provided by the US Department of State:

It shows the number of terrorist attacks in 2001. The highest number of terrorist attacks occured in Colombia. Probably not perpetrated by "Islamofacist extremists", though.

I did not say that terrorism is new nor that terrorism is limited to Islamic fundamentalists. But this war against the modern Islamofacist Extremist is a new thing and it is this war that we are fighting.

0 Replies

Foxfyre wrote:

I did not say that terrorism is new nor that terrorism is limited to Islamic fundamentalists. But this war against the modern Islamofacist Extremist is a new thing and it is this war that we are fighting.

Well, 9/11 was the first major terrorist attack in the United States perpetrated by a group of people from outside the US in recent history.

Anything else? Honestly, what do you think is so new about it?

0 Replies

The term islamofascist is completely meaningless. Basically, "-fascist" is being used as a cryptic term, a combining form to mean evil. In the first place, rants such as Ican't's constant and unsubstantiated claim that all militant Muslims want to establish a new caliphate, referred to by Fox as a desire to put us all under sharia--is completely without foundation. The number of people who have openly stated that they wish to conquer the world for Islam is negligible. Virtually every other Islamic movement which can be described as terrorist (or which has been so described, often without justification) has clearly stated goals which do no include world conquest.

More than that, the establishment of a new caliphate doesn't qualify as the establishment of fascism. The rightwingnuts who use the term (and now that the dipshit in the White House has done so, it suddenly has conservative cachet) don't even recognize that it is a meaningless term. A term such as narco-terrorist, however, has a very specific and obvious meaning. The high number of terrorist attacks in Columbia to which OE referred were carried out by FARC, who have become narco-terrorists, which means that they use both terror methods, and the sale of narcotics, the latter of which is used to fund their operations. The late stage of the troubles in Ireland saw Provos and their Prod counterparts become narco-terrorists, selling crack in the slums of Ulster to finance their operations. Often, narco-terrorists become so affluent from their narcotics trafficing operations, that they cease to be politically motivated at all--Sendero Luminoso in Peru, and now Bolivia, are a good example of this. Narcotics sale have taken over ideology as their motivation.

Islamo-fascist is a meaningless term, and is used to demonize the other. It's easier to accept the slaughter of thousands of Muslims, men, women and children, if you just switch off your brain and your conscience, and think of them all as "islamo-fascists."

0 Replies

old europe wrote:

Foxfyre wrote:
I did not say that terrorism is new nor that terrorism is limited to Islamic fundamentalists. But this war against the modern Islamofacist Extremist is a new thing and it is this war that we are fighting.

Well, 9/11 was the first major terrorist attack in the United States perpetrated by a group of people from outside the US in recent history.

Anything else? Honestly, what do you think is so new about it?

Here I'll ask Ican to post his list that he has posted several times previously.

Meanwhile, do you honestly think 9/11 was the first? You have forgotten the first WTC bombing during the Clinton administration? Do you honestly think 9/11 would have been the only major terrorist attack in the United States if our current administration had not taken immediate and deliberate action to prevent others as much as is possible?

And should the USA and Britain and others who are actively resisting the terrorists fold up and give up, do you honestly think you in Germany would be immune to terrorist activity?

0 Replies

Another breath-takingly stupid remark. Germany has not been immune, and nothing the Shrub and his Forty Theives of Baghdad does makes them safe. Ronnie Ray-gun attacked Lybia because it was alleged that the Lybians were responsible for the Berlin Disco bombing in 1986, targeting a club popular with American GIs. Leaving aside Bader Meinhoff in years gone by, there have been many incidents of firebombing the businesses and residences of Turks in Germany, which incidents are assumed to be the operations of skin head organizations.

Of course, the latter would not rise above Fox's event horizon, because the targets were Muslims, not the perps.

0 Replies

Setanta wrote:

Leaving aside Bader Meinhoff

Well, the Red Army Faction alone accounts for quite a number of terrorist attacks in Germany....

0 Replies

old europe wrote:

Honestly, what do you think is so new about it?

Foxfyre wrote:

Here I'll ask Ican to post his list that he has posted several times previously.

Meanwhile, do you honestly think 9/11 was the first? You have forgotten the first WTC bombing during the Clinton administration? Do you honestly think 9/11 would have been the only major terrorist attack in the United States if our current administration had not taken immediate and deliberate action to prevent others as much as is possible?

And should the USA and Britain and others who are actively resisting the terrorists fold up and give up, do you honestly think you in Germany would be immune to terrorist activity?

I'm not suggesting anybody should fold up and give up, and I don't suggest anyone is immune terrorism.

But I notice that you haven't really answered the question, so I'll ask you again: What do you think is so new about the terrorism perpetrated by islamist fanatics?

0 Replies

I only left the Red Brigades and all its offshoots out because it probably is too long ago for Fox to recall, if she was ever even familiar with terror in Europe. Thirty years ago, Red Brigades operated in Italy and Japan, as well, and, of course, Munich was the scene of the one of the worst terrorist incidents to that time when the Israeli wrestlers were taken from the Olympic village.

For conservatives like Fox, it just doesn't count if the United States is not involved.

0 Replies

mysteryman wrote:

[
How does attacking athletes at the Olympics change anyones mind?
How does machinegunning innocent,UNARMED people in an airport change anything?
How does blowing up innocent children change anyones mind?

By committing those kinds of atrocities,all it does is strengthen Israel's resolve and its commitment to not capitulate to the terrorists.
If the terrorists truly want change,they should use peaceful protests,ala MLK and the civil rights movement.

That way,if Israel uses violence against them,it will make Israel look very bad in the eyes of the world,and it will force change.

I agree. But I'd ammend that to say "if the Palestinians truly want change...".

0 Replies

old europe wrote:

old europe wrote:
Honestly, what do you think is so new about it?

Foxfyre wrote:
Here I'll ask Ican to post his list that he has posted several times previously.

Meanwhile, do you honestly think 9/11 was the first? You have forgotten the first WTC bombing during the Clinton administration? Do you honestly think 9/11 would have been the only major terrorist attack in the United States if our current administration had not taken immediate and deliberate action to prevent others as much as is possible?

And should the USA and Britain and others who are actively resisting the terrorists fold up and give up, do you honestly think you in Germany would be immune to terrorist activity?

I'm not suggesting anybody should fold up and give up, and I don't suggest anyone is immune terrorism.

But I notice that you haven't really answered the question, so I'll ask you again: What do you think is so new about the terrorism perpetrated by islamist fanatics?

It's new because the leaders have stated their goals which is to bring all people under Sharia rule, not just the USA, not just the Israelis. It's new because the leaders have stated their goals to kill all who decline that opportunity. And it's new because for the first time the terrorist have access to weapons of mass destruction on a scale never before available to terrorists and they have absolutely no conscience about using them on anybody. And it's new because we are better aware of the very real danger in that.

You cited Columbia is the site for the most terrorist attacks. Are you quite sure there is no Muslim extremist connection there?
SEE THIS

0 Replies

islamo fascists = islamofascists = islamo-fascists = islamic fascists = islamic tyrannists = islamic terrorists = people who allege they are Muslims and deliberately kill non-combatants.

For example, the members of the al-Qaeda confederation are people who allege they are Muslims and deliberately kill non-combatants.

It isn't important what you or anyone else calls them. It is important what they do and how to stop them from doing what they do. If it makes you feel better, then call them whatchamacallems

HERE'S WHAT SOME OF THESE whatchamacallems HAVE BEEN ACCUSED OF SAYING:

Quote:

The Fatwahs Against American Troops in Saudi Arabia and Yemen
5. At various times from in or about 1992 until the date of the filing of this Indictment, Usama Bin Laden, working together with members of the fatwah committee of al Qaeda, disseminated fatwahs to other members and associates of al Qaeda that the United States forces stationed on the Saudi Arabian peninsula, including both Saudi Arabia and Yemen, should be attacked.

The Fatwah Against American Troops in Somalia
6. At various times from in or about 1992 until in or about 1993, Usama Bin Laden, working together with members of the fatwah committee of al Qaeda, disseminated fatwahs to other members and associates of al Qaeda that the United States forces stationed in the Horn of Africa, including Somalia, should be attacked.
The Fatwah Regarding Deaths of Nonbelievers

7. On various occasions, an unindicted co-conspirator advised other members of al Qaeda that it was Islamically proper to engage in violent actions against "infidels" (nonbelievers), even if others might be killed by such actions, because if the others were "innocent," they would go to paradise, and if they were not "innocent," they deserved to die.
The August 1996 Declaration of War

8. On or about August 23, 1996, a Declaration of Jihad indicating that it was from the Hindu Kush mountains in Afghanistan entitled, "Message from Usamah Bin-Muhammad Bin-Laden to His Muslim Brothers in the Whole World and Especially in the Arabian Peninsula: Declaration of Jihad Against the Americans Occupying the Land of the Two Holy Mosques; Expel the Heretics from the Arabian Peninsula" was disseminated.

The February 1998 Fatwah Against American Civilians
9. In February 1998, Usama Bin Laden endorsed a fatwah under the banner of the "International Islamic Front for Jihad on the Jews and Crusaders." This fatwah, published in the publication Al-Quds al-`Arabi on February 23, 1998, stated that Muslims should kill Americans - including civilians - anywhere in the world where they can be found.

10. In an address in or about 1998, Usama Bin Laden cited American aggression against Islam and encouraged a jihad that would eliminate the Americans from the Arabian Peninsula.

Bin Laden Endorses the Nuclear Bomb of Islam
11. On or about May 29, 1998, Usama Bin Laden issued a statement entitled "The Nuclear Bomb of Islam," under the banner of the "International Islamic Front for Fighting the Jews and the Crusaders," in which he stated that "it is the duty of the Muslims to prepare as much force as possible to terrorize the enemies of God."
Usama Bin Laden Issues Further Threats in June 1999

12. In or about June 1999, in an interview with an Arabic-language television station, Usama Bin Laden issued a further threat indicating that all American males should be killed.

Usama Bin Laden Calls for "Jihad" to Free Imprisoned Terrorists
13. In or about September 2000, in an interview with an Arabic-language television station, Usama Bin Laden called for a "jihad" to release the "brothers" in jail "everywhere."
...

HERE'S WHAT SOME OF THESE whatchamacallems HAVE BEEN ACCUSED OF DOING:

Quote:

Hezbollah:

04/18/1983 -- crashes van bomb into U.S. Embassy in
..................... Beirut, killing 63 including 17 Americans;
10/23/1983 -- explode truck bomb at U.S. Marine Barracks in
...................... Beirut killing 241 Marines in peace keeping force;
03/16/1984 -- kidnaps and murders CIA station chief, William F.
...................... Buckley;
04/12/1984 -- bombs Torrejon, Spain restaurant near U.S. Air
...................... Force Base, killing 18 U.S. servicemen;
09/20/1984 -- car-bombs U.S. Embassy annex in east Beirut
...................... killing 2 Americans, injuring ambassador;
12/04/1984 -- hijacks Kuwait Airlines plane and murder 2 American
...................... passengers;
06/14/1985 -- hijacks TWA flight 847, Athens to Rome with 153
...................... passengers, mostly Americans, beats passenger
...................... Robert Stethem U.S. Navy diver to death and
...................... dumps onto Beirut Airport ramp;
02/17/1988 -- kidnaps and subsequently murders Col. William
...................... Higgins, U.S. Marine in Lebanon serving in
...................... UN truce monitoring group;
03/17/1992 -- bomb, with help of Iranian intelligence agents,
...................... Israeli embassy in Buenos Aires, wounding about
...................... 300, killing 28;
[Oslo accords in 1993, established Palestinian rule within Israel in return for not attacking Israelies]
07/18/1994 -- bomb the Jewish Community Center in in Buenos
...................... Aires, wounding about 200, killing 86;
11/28/1995 -- bombards northern Israel towns with Katyusha
...................... rockets;
03/30/1996 -- bombards northern Israel towns with Katyusha
...................... rockets;
06/25/1996 -- bomb Kobar Towers apartment complex in Saudi
...................... Arabia, killing 19 U.S. servicemen;
08/19/1997 -- bombards northern Israel towns with Katyusha
...................... rockets;
12/28/1998 -- bombards northern Israel towns with Katyusha
...................... rockets;
05/17/1999 -- bombards northern Israel towns with Katyusha
...................... rockets;
06/24/1999 -- bombards northern Israel towns with Katyusha
...................... rockets;
[05/24/2000, Israel completes pull out from Lebanon.]
10/07/2000 -- kidnaps 3 Israeli soldiers patrolling Israel's border
...................... with Lebanon, and their bodies are subsequently
...................... exchanged for 400 Arab prisoners;
[12/23/2000, Arafat rejects Israel's offer to pull out of Gaza and parts of the West Bank in return for recognizing Israel's right to exist.]
04/09/2002 -- bombards northern Israel towns with Katyusha
...................... rockets;
[05/02/2003, Israel accepts "Road Map" for peace.]
08/10/2003 -- bombards northern Israel towns with rockets,
...................... killing 16-year old Israeli boy;
[08/15/2005, Israel pulls out of Gaza and parts of the West Bank.]
07/12/2006 -- kidnaps 2 Israeli soliers, kills 8 Israeli soldiers
..................... on Israeli soil, and bombards northern Israel
..................... towns with rockets.

HERE'S MORE OF WHAT SOME OF THESE whatchamacallems HAVE BEEN ACCUSED OF DOING:

Quote:

1996
June 25: Khobar Towers bombing, killing 19 and wounding 372 Americans.

1997
----

1998
August 7: U.S. embassy bombings in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania and Nairobi, Kenya, killing 225 people and injuring more than 4,000.

1999
----

2000
October 12: USS Cole bombing kills 17 US sailors.

2001
September 11: The attacks on September 11 kill almost 3,000 in a series of hijacked airliner crashes into two U.S. landmarks: the World Trade Center in New York City, New York, and The Pentagon in Arlington, Virginia. A fourth plane crashes in Somerset County, Pennsylvania.

October 12: Bali car bombing of holidaymakers kills 202 people, mostly Western tourists and local Balinese hospitality staff.

October 17: Zamboanga bombings in the Philippines kill six and wounds about 150.

October 18: A bus bomb in Manila kills three people and wounds 22.

October 19: A car bomb explodes outside a McDonald's Corp. restaurant in Moscow, killing one person and wounding five.

Note: October 20, 2001: USA invades Afghanistan

Quote:

October 23: Moscow theater hostage crisis begins; 120 hostages and 40 terrorists killed in rescue three days later.

Note: December 20, 2001: Osama helps establish al Qaeda training bases in Iraq.

Quote:

2003
March 4: Bomb attack in an airport in Davao kills 21.

Note: March 20, 2003: US invades Iraq at the time al Qaeda controls about a dozen villages and a range of peaks in northeastern Iraq on the Iranian border.

Quote:

2003
May 12: Bombings of United States expatriate housing compounds in Saudi Arabia kill 26 and injure 160 in the Riyadh Compound Bombings. Al-Qaeda blamed.

May 12: A truck bomb attack on a government building in the Chechen town of Znamenskoye kills 59.

May 14: As many as 16 die in a suicide bombing at a religious festival in southeastern Chechnya.

May 16: Casablanca Attacks by 12 bombers on five "Western and Jewish" targets in Casablanca, Morocco leaves 41 dead and over 100 injured. Attack attributed to a Moroccan al-Qaeda-linked group.

July 5: 15 people die and 40 are injured in bomb attacks at a rock festival in Moscow.

August 1: An explosion at the Russian hospital in Mozdok in North Ossetia kills at least 50 people and injures 76.

August 25: At least 48 people were killed and 150 injured in two blasts in south Mumbai - one near the Gateway of India at the other at the Zaveri Bazaar.

September 3: A bomb blast on a passenger train near Kislovodsk in southern Russia kills seven people and injures 90.

November 15 and November 20: Truck bombs go off at two synagogues, the British Consulate, and the HSBC Bank in Istanbul, Turkey, killing 57 and wounding 700.

December 5: Suicide bombers kill at least 46 people in an attack on a train in southern Russia

December 9: A blast in the center of Moscow kills six people and wounds at least 11.

2004
February 6: Bomb on Moscow Metro kills 41.

February 27: Superferry 14 is bombed in the Philippines by Abu Sayyaf, killing 116.

March 2: Attack on procession of Shia Muslims in Pakistan kills 43 and wounds 160.

March 11: Coordinated bombing of commuter trains in Madrid, Spain, kills 191 people and injures more than 1,500.

April 21: Basra bombs in Iraq kill 74 and injure hundreds.

April 21: Bombing of a security building in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia kills 5.

May 29: Al-Khobar massacres, in which Islamic militants kill 22 people at an oil compound in Saudi Arabia.

August 24: Bombing of Russian airplane kills 90.

August 31: A blast near a subway station entrance in northern Moscow, caused by a suicide bomber, kills 10 people and injures 33.

September 1 – 3: Beslan school hostage crisis in North Ossetia, Russia, results in 344 dead.

September 9: Jakarta embassy bombing, in which the Australian embassy in Jakarta, Indonesia was bombed, kills eight people.

October 7: Sinai bombings: Three car bombs explode in the Sinai Peninsula, killing at least 34 and wounding 171, many of them Israeli and other foreign tourists.

December 6: Suspected al Qaeda-linked group attacks U.S. consulate in Jeddah, Saudi Arabia, killing 5 local employees.

December 12: A bombing at the Christmas market in General Santos, Philippines, kills 15.

2005
February 14: A car bomb kills former Lebanese Prime Minister Rafiq Hariri and 20 others in Beirut.

March 9: An attack of an Istanbul restaurant killed one, and injured five.

March 19: Car bomb attack on theatre in Doha, Qatar, kills one Briton and wounds 12 others.

April 7: A suicide bomber blows himself up in Cairo's Khan al Khalili market, killing three foreign tourists and wounding 17 others.

May 7: Multiple bomb explosions across Myanmar's capital Rangoon kill 19 and injure 160.

June 12: Bombs explode in the Iranian cities of Ahvaz and Tehran, leaving 10 dead and 80 wounded days before the Iranian presidential election.

July 7: London bombings - Attacks on one double-decker bus and three London Underground trains, killing 56 people and injuring over 700, occur on the first day of the 31st G8 Conference. The attacks are believed by many to be the first suicide bombings in Western Europe.

July 23: Sharm el-Sheikh bombings: Car bombs explode at tourist sites in Sharm el-Sheikh, Egypt, killing at least 88 and wounding more than 100.
August 17: Around 100 home-made bombs exploded in 58 different locations in Bangladesh, Killing two and wounding 100.

October 1: A series of explosions occurs in resort areas of Jimabaran Beach and Kuta in Bali, Indonesia.

October 13: A large group of Chechen rebels launched coordinated attacks on Russian federal buildings, local police stations, and the airport in Nalchik, Kabardino-Balkaria. At least 137 people, including 92 rebels, were killed.

October 15: Two bombs exploded at a shopping mall in Ahvaz, Khuzestan in Iran. Six people died and over 100 were injured.

October 29: Multiple bomb blasts hit markets in New Delhi, India, leaving at least 61 dead and more than 200 injured.

November 9: Three explosions at hotels in Amman, Jordan, leave at least 57 dead and 120 wounded.

December --

2006
January --

February --

March 2: Bombing in Karachi, Pakistan kills four, including a U.S. diplomat.

March 7: Bombings in the Hindu holy city of Varanasi, India, leave at least 15 people dead.

0 Replies

Setanta wrote:

I only left the Red Brigades and all its offshoots out because it probably is too long ago for Fox to recall, if she was ever even familiar with terror in Europe. Thirty years ago, Red Brigades operated in Italy and Japan, as well, and, of course, Munich was the scene of the one of the worst terrorist incidents to that time when the Israeli wrestlers were taken from the Olympic village.

For conservatives like Fox, it just doesn't count if the United States is not involved.

Not that it matters, but I agree with all of Setanta's posts. Some of you posters would do well to re-read what he's saying. But only those of you who can actually think for themselves.

And I'm not defending you, Setanta. You are capable of doing that yourself.

0 Replies

mysteryman wrote:

InfraBlue wrote:

One way to to start to make terrorists unable to terrorize, threaten, injure, maim, and murder is to take away their reasons for doing so. Israel can begin by abandoning it's ethnocentric raison d'etre that necessarily discriminates against, and oppresses the Palestinian populations in Israel and the Occupied Territories. It should dismantle its oppressive regime, and emplace a truly democratic and egalitarian government that incorporates and enfranchises all of the peoples therein.

Even if what you say is true,and that the only reason terrorists exist is because of Israeli policies,that still begs a question.

How does attacking athletes at the Olympics change anyones mind?
How does machinegunning innocent,UNARMED people in an airport change anything?
How does blowing up innocent children change anyones mind?

By committing those kinds of atrocities,all it does is strengthen Israel's resolve and its commitment to not capitulate to the terrorists.
If the terrorists truly want change,they should use peaceful protests,ala MLK and the civil rights movement.

That way,if Israel uses violence against them,it will make Israel look very bad in the eyes of the world,and it will force change.

I'm not saying that Israel's discrimination and oppression of the Palestinians is the only reason terrorists exist. I'm saying that it is a main reason why they exist.

Israel ending it's discrimination and oppression of the Palestinian peoples should not be conditional upon anything. Israel should do the moral thing and incorporate and enfranchise the Palestinian people. Period. It is a pretext to make the cessation the discrimination and oppression of the Palestinian people conditional upon the cessation of terrorism. All Israel is accomplishing is giving the terrorists a legitimacy they do not deserve. Ultimately what it is doing is using terrorism as a pretext to continue oppressing the Palestinian people in the name of "security," and expansion of its borders, all the while concentrating the Palestinians within a continually circumscribed camp which it utterly controls.

Changing minds should be an insignificant concern, seeing as how minds tend to be fickle. Look at how opinions have changed about terrorism with the Zionists' own example thereof, e.g. the Irgun and LEHI.

0 Replies

Infrablue,

Do you think those terrorist training camps in South America (link posted yesterday) would not have happened if Israel had not 'oppressed' the Palestinians?

Would 9/11 not have happened if Israel had not 'oppressed' the Palestinians?

Would the Wahhabi terrorist attacks in Indonesia not have happened if Israel had not 'oppressed' the Palestinians?

Would the genocide in Somalia and the Sudan not have happened if Israel had not 'oppressed' the Palestinians?

Do you think peace would prevail in the Middle East if the USA went home and Israel packed up and left? Would we have nothing more to fear from Islamic fundamentalist terrorists?

0 Replies

Foxfyre wrote:

You cited Columbia is the site for the most terrorist attacks. Are you quite sure there is no Muslim extremist connection there?
SEE THIS

Nonsense!

All your article mentions is that Venezuela might provide somewhat of a safe haven for Middle Eastern extremists, while at the same time providing somewhat of a safe haven for FARC extremists.

However, your article does not talk about Colombia.

And, your article explicitly states that "Currently there are no known terror attacks that can be attributed to these groups."

....

You know, Foxy, if you absolutely don't care about the details and are so eager to find a "Muslim extremist connection", how about considering all the US citizens who financed Sinn Féin who in turn financed the IRA who in turn sent members to training camps in the Middle East so they could learn how to commit terrorist attacks in the United Kingdom?

0 Replies

ISRAEL - IRAN - SYRIA - HAMAS - HEZBOLLAH - WWWIII?

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know